§ Order of the Day for the House to be put into Committee, read.
§ Moved, That the House do now resolve itself into Committee.—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Motion agreed to.
§ House in Committee accordingly.
§ [The EARL OF DONOUGHMORE in the Chair.]
§ Clauses 1 to 4 agreed to.
§ Clause 5:
§ Power to take to samples of milk
§ 5—(1) It shall be lawful for an inspector of the Local Government Board, or the medical officer of health of a local authority, or any person provided with and, if required, exhibiting an authority in writing from such an inspector or from the local authority or medical officer of health, to take for examination samples of milk at any time before it is delivered to the consumer. Provided that the powers of a medical officer of health and of a person authorised by him or by the local authority under this section shall, except so far as the Local Government Board may otherwise direct, be exercisable only within the area of the local authority.
§ (2) The result of an analysis or bacteriological or other examination of a sample of milk taken tinder this Act shall not be admissible as evidence in proceedings under this Act, or in proceedings under the Sale of Food and Drugs Acts, 1875 to 1907, unless the provisions of the last-mentioned Acts which relate to the division of samples into parts are complied with, but if those provisions have been complied with, the result of the analysis shall be available for proceedings under the said Acts (as if it had been procured in accordance with those Acts) as well as for proceedings under this Act.
§ (3) The medical officer of health or any other officer authorised for the purpose by a local authority within the area of which milk from any dairy situate outside that area is being sold or exposed or kept for sale, may by notice in writing require the medical officer of health or other authorised officer of any other local authority being an authority for the purposes of the Sale of Food and Drugs Acts, 1875 to 1907, to take samples of the milk at that dairy or in the course of transit from that dairy to the area of the first-mentioned local authority.
§ (4) Upon receipt of such notice it shall, subject to the provisions of subsection (1) of this section, be the duty of the medical officer of health or other authorised officer of the other authority as soon as practicable to take samples and to forward, for analysis or bacteriological examination, to the officer who gave the notice a part of any sample so taken, and in taking a sample the officer shall, if so required by the notice, comply with the provisions of the Sale of Food and Drugs Acts, 1875 to 1907, which relate to the division of samples into parts.
431§ The authority requiring the samples to be taken shall be liable to defray any reasonable expenses incurred, the amount whereof shall in default of agreement be settled by the Local Government Board.
§ For the purpose of the Sale of Food and Drugs Acts, 1875 to 1907, the sample shall be deemed to have been taken within the area of the officer who gave the notice, and proceedings under those Acts may be taken either before a court having jurisdiction within the district for which that officer acts or before a court having jurisdiction in the place where the sample was actually taken.
§ (5) In any proceedings under the Sale of Food and Drugs Acts, 1875 to 1907, or this Act, the production of a certificate of the officer who took the sample under this section that the provisions of this section, as to the manner in which samples are to be dealt with, were complied with shall he sufficient evidence of compliance, unless the defendant requires that officer to be called as a witness.
§ (6) In the exercise at any railway station or upon any railway premises of the powers conferred upon them by this section, such inspector, medical officer of health, or other person so authorised as aforesaid shall conform to such reasonable requirements of the railway company owning or using such station or premises as are necessary to prevent the working of the traffic thereat being obstructed or interfered with.
§ LORD STRACHIEMy Lords, I have on the Paper an Amendment to add a proviso at the end of subsection (2) of Clause 5. The object of the Amendment, which was strongly pressed upon the President of the Local Government Board in the House of Commons by Mr. Sanderson, is to protect persons engaged in the milk trade from being prosecuted in respect of milk which is not under their control. This has always been a vexed question among agriculturists. It has been recognised to he unfair that a man should be fined for adulterated milk over which he had no control. Therefore it seems only right that, when we are dealing with the whole of this milk question, a provision should be inserted to remove this injustice.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 5, line 22, after ("Act") insert ("provided that no proceedings shall be taken against any person unless at the time the sample was taken the milk was in his custody or control or was contained in a churn or other receptacle which had been sealed or closed in accordance with a Milk and Dairies Order.").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Clause 5, as amended, agreed to.
§ Clauses 6 and 7 agreed to.
432§ Clause 8:
§ Regulations as to imported milk.
§ 8. The Local Government Board shall make regulations under the Public Health (Regulations as to Food) Act, 1907, for the prevention of danger arising to public health from the importation of milk and milk products intended for sale for human consumption or for use in the manufacture of products for human consumption.
THE EARL OF NORTHBROOKMy Lords, I should like to ask the noble Lord in charge of the Bill a question. This clause provides for the Local Government Board making regulations for the prevention of danger arising to public health from the importation of milk and milk products. The Bill will not extend to Scotland or Ireland, and I wish to know whether the word "importation" includes milk that would be brought into England from Scotland or Ireland. I might explain that I ask this question because the President of the Local Government Board was questioned in the other House of Parliament on this matter, and he stated that he was advised that "importation" under the Customs Act means importation from a foreign country, but he admitted that it may be a point of doubt whether in this Bill it would hear the same interpretation. He further said that he would consider whether any drafting Amendment was needed before the Bill came to your Lordships' House. I observe that the noble Lord in charge of the Bill has no Amendment to this clause on the Paper. Therefore I should like to ask him what the considered view of the Local Government Board now is with regard to the interpretation of the word "importation."
§ LORD STRACHIEMy Lords, I may say that I was myself present when the discussion took place in the Grand Committee of the House of Commons, and I heard exactly what the noble Earl has told the House. I made inquiries as to what the effect would be, and I am assured that the considered opinion of the Local Government Board is that the position of milk coining from Scotland and Ireland would be just the same as milk coming from a foreign country. There would be the same power of forbidding it being brought here, if necessary.
THE EARL OF NORTHBROOKI do not know whether the position is quite a satisfactory one. Scotland has, or at any rate very soon will have, a Bill con- 433 taining provisions very similar to those contained in the present Bill; but, so far as I am aware, Ireland at present has no regulations of similar stringency. Therefore it is quite possible that milk might be brought from Ireland which would be inferior in cleanliness to milk brought into this country from Scotland. I am aware that the President of the Local Government Board expressed the opinion that the Board have at present ample power under other Acts of dealing with this question. Therefore I should be content to leave this clause as it stands, relying on the assurance of the President of the Local Government Board that lie will give, under the power he has under those Acts, protection to the milk consumer in this country against such a contingency.
§ LORD STRACHIEI certainly meant to assure the noble Earl that I am advised that the Local Government Board consider that this clause would be applicable to milk coming in from Ireland or from Scotland. It is true, as the noble Earl says, that with regard to Scotland there will be a Bill passed similar to this Bill, and therefore there will be no objection to milk coming into this country from Scotland because they will have similar powers to our own. With regard to Ireland, the opinion of the Local Government Board is that they could deal with milk coming in from Ireland the same as milk coming from abroad; that is to say, that if necessary they could stop it equally as well.
§ Clause 8 agreed to.
§ Clause 9 to 13 agreed to.
§ Clause 14.
§ Expenses of local authorities.
§ 14. The expenses of local authorities under this Act and the Milk and Dairies Orders shall be defrayed—
- (a) in the ease of a county council, out of the county fund, as expenses for general county purposes, or, if an order of the Local Government Board so directs as respects any such expenses as expenses for special county purposes charged on such part of the county as may be provided by the order;
- (b) in the case of the common council, out of the general rate;
- (c)in the case of the council of a metropolitan borough, as part of the expenses incurred by the council in the execution of the Public Health (London) Act, 1891;
- (d) in the case of the council of a municipal borough or urban or rural district, as part of their general expenses incurred in the execution of the Public Health Acts.
THE EARL OF NORTHBROOKI should be glad to have an assurance that it is still the intention of the Government that one half of the expenditure of salaries and remuneration of all officers engaged in carrying out the Milk and Dairies Order will be borne by the county council and other local authorities from public funds. An intimation to that effect was made by the President of the Local Government Board on the Second Reading of the Bill in the other House of Parliament, but I should be glad if the noble Lord in charge of the Bill could give us an assurance that that undertaking still holds good.
§ LORD STRACHIEI can assure the noble Earl that any pledge given by my right hon. friend in the other House with regard to this question will, of course, be carried out.
§ Clause 14 agreed to.
§ Clause 15:
§ Provisions as to offences.
§ 15.—(1) if any person commits an offence against this Act, he shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding in the case of a first offence five pounds and in the case of a second or subsequent offence fifty pounds, and if the offence is a continuing offence to a further tine not exceeding forty shillings for each day during which the offence continues.
§ (2) Proceedings against a dairyman for failure to comply with an order made under the Second Schedule to this Act requiring the dairyman not to supply milk from a dairy may be taken before a court of summary jurisdiction either in the place where the offence was committed or in the place where the dairy is situated, and shall be taken only by the authority by which the order was made.
§ (3) Where the occupier of a dairy is charged with an offence against this Act, he shall be entitled upon information duly laid by him to have any other person whom he charges as t he actual offender brought before the court at the time appointed for hearing the charge; and, if after the commission of the offence has been proved, the occupier of the dairy proves to the satisfaction of the court—
- (a) that he has used due diligence to enforce the execution of this Act and the Milk and Dairies Orders; and
- (b) that the said other person had committed the offence in question without his knowledge, consent or connivance;
§ (4) When it is made to appear to the satisfaction of the authority by or on whose behalf proceedings are about to be taken—
- (a) that the actual occupier of the dairy has used all due diligence to enforce the execution of this Act and the Milk and Dairies Orders; and
- (b) by what person the offence has been committed; and
- (c)that it has been committed without the knowledge, consent, or connivance of the occupier of the dairy and in contravention of his orders;
§
(5) The duty of taking proceedings for enforcing t he provisions of section one of this Act shall rest on the county council or county borough council, without prejudice however to the power of a sanitary authority in a county to take such proceedings, and the duty of taking proceedings for enforcing the provisions of any Milk and Dairies Order shall rest on the local authority prescribed in the order, and the cleric of the local authority or other officer whom the local authority may appoint, shall have power, if so authorised by the local authority, to institute and carry on such proceedings:
Provided that in cases where the Local Government Board direct that the council of a non-county borough shall exercise and perform within the borough the powers and duties of a county council under sections three and four of this Act, the duty of taking proceedings for enforcing the provisions of section one of this Act in such borough shall rest on the council thereof and not on the county council.
§ (6) Notwithstanding anything contained in any Act to the contrary all fines imposed in any proceedings instituted by or on behalf of a local authority in the exercise of their powers and duties under this Act shall be paid to the authority and carried to the credit of the fund out of which the expenses incurred by the authority under this Act are defrayed.
§ LORD STRACHIE moved to amend the proviso to subsection (5) by omitting the word "direct" and substituting "make an order under Section 3 of this Act directing." The noble Lord said: This is an Amendment which was promised to Mr. Charles Bathurst in another place, to make it quite clear that the provision only applies when an Order is made under Clause 3, subsection (4). Your Lordships are aware that certain boroughs of a certain size have a right to control the Contagious Diseases (Animals) Act in their own areas, and the object of this Amendment is to make it quite clear that an Order made under Clause 3, subsection (4) should apply in those particular cases.
436
§
Amendment moved—
Page 10, line 25, leave out ("direct") and insert ("make an Order tinder section three of this Act directing").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Clause 15, as amended, agreed to.
§ Remaining clauses agreed to.
§ First Schedule agreed to.
§ Second Schedule:
§ Procedure for stopping Supply of Milk under Section three.
§ (1) The medical officer of health of the county or county borough in which the cows from which the milk is obtained are kept shall report the matter to the council of such county or county borough (hereinafter referred to as the responsible authority).
§ (2) His report shall be accompanied by the veterinary or bacteriological reports which have been furnished to him.
§ (3) On the receipt of the report or a copy of the report from the medical officer of health the responsible authority may serve on the dairyman notice to appear before them, or furnish an explanation in writing, within such time not less than forty-eight hours from the time of the service of the notice on him as may he specified in the notice, to show cause why such order as is hereinafter mentioned should not be made.
§ (4) The notice shall be accompanied by a copy of the reports made in respect of the dairy.
§ (5) The responsible authority if, in their opinion, the dairyman has failed to show cause why an order should not be made, may make an order prohibiting him, either absolutely or unless such conditions as may be prescribed in the order are complied with, from supplying for human consumption, or using or supplying for use in the manufacture of products for human consumption, any milk from the dairy or from any particular cow or cows therein until the order has been withdrawn in accordance with the provisions of this Schedule.
§ (6) The order shall specify the grounds on which it is made.
§ (7) On the making of such an order a copy of the order shall forthwith he served on the dairyman, and notice of the facts shall also be served on the Local Government Board and the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries.
§ (8) Where no order is made, the responsible authority shall allow the dairyman any reasonable expenses incurred by hint in showing cause why the order should not be made.
§ (9) An order prohibiting the supply or use of milk made under this Schedule shall forthwith be withdrawn, and notice of withdrawal served on the dairyman as soon as may be after the responsible authority or their medical officer of health is satisfied that the milk supplied from the dairy is not likely to cause disease.
§ (10) The medical officer of health shall have power to withdraw an order if so authorised by the responsible authority.
437§ (11) If a dairyman is aggrieved by the making or continuance of an order prohibiting the supply or use of milk, he may by complaint under the Summary Jurisdiction Acts appeal to a court of summary jurisdiction.
§ (12) A court of summary jurisdiction on such appeal may confirm, vary, or withdraw the order and may direct to and by whom the costs of the appeal are to be paid.
§ (13) Pending the determination of the appeal, an order shall remain in force unless previously withdrawn.
§ (14) If an order prohibiting the supply or use of milk is made against a dairyman he shall unless the order has been made in consequence of his own default or neglect be entitled to recover from the responsible authority full compensation for any damage or loss which he may have sustained by reason of the making of the order.
§ (15) In the case of an appeal under this schedule being allowed, the court to which the appeal is made shall determine and state whether the order, the subject of appeal, has been made without due cause or the withdrawal has been unreasonably neglected or refused, and whether the dairyman has been in default.
§ (16) Any dispute as to the fact of damage or loss or as to the amount of compensation shall be settled by arbitration in the same manner as provided by the Public Health Act, 1875, and any sum awarded as compensation shall be recoverable as a civil debt.
§ (17) if the compensation claimed does not exceed twenty pounds it may at the option of either party instead of being settled as hereinbefore provided be settled by and recoverable before a court of summary jurisdiction.
§ LORD STRACHIEThis Amendment to add words at the end of subsection (14) is to carry out an assurance given by my right hon. friend in the House of Commons to protect a dairyman where there was unreasonable refusal by the local authority to withdraw an order made against him. That is to say, if the refusal was unreasonable then there should be compensation awarded to the dairyman affected thereby. This, like a previous Amendment that I moved earlier in the evening, is for the protection of the farmer and producer, and hope your Lordships will agree to it.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 15, line 34, after ("order") insert ("The dairyman shall also be entitled to full compensation for any damage or loss which he may sustain in consequence of the responsible authority unreasonably neglecting or refusing to withdraw an order made against him").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ LORD STRACHIEMy Lords, my Amendment to subsection (15) provides that no compensation shall be payable 438 if the Court is of opinion that the order was made in consequence of the default or neglect of the dairyman. These words are necessary, as compensation clearly ought not to be paid to a man who, owing to his own default or neglect, causes the stoppage in the supply of his milk.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 15, line 37, after "appeal" insert ("was made in consequence of the default or neglect of the dairyman").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ LORD STRACHIEThe words which I now move to insert are consequential.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 15, lines 37 and 38, leave out ("has been made without due cause").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ LORD STRACHIEThe next Amendment is also consequential.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 15, line 39, leave out ("and whether the dairyman has been in default").—(Lord Strachie)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Second Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Third Schedule:
§ Amendment of Sale of Food and Drugs Acts.
§ (1) Where, under the Sale of Food and Drugs Act, 1875 to 1907, a sample of milk is procured from a purveyor of milk, he shall, on being required to do so by the person by whom or on whose behalf the sample was taken, state the name and address of the seller or consignor from whom he received the milk.
§
(2) The local authority in whose district the sample was taken may take or cause to be taken one or more samples of milk in course of transit, or delivery from such seller or consignor.
Within forty-eight hours after the sample of milk was procured from the purveyor he may serve on the local authority a notice stating the name and address of the seller from whom he received the milk and the time and place of delivery to the purveyor by the seller or consignor of milk from a corresponding milking anti requesting them to take immediate steps to procure as soon as practicable a sample of milk in the course of transit or delivery from the seller or consignor to the purveyor, unless a sample has been so taken since the sample was procured from the purveyor, or within twenty-four hours prior to the sample being procured from tin purveyor, and where a purveyor has not served
439
such notice as aforesaid, he shall not be entitled to plead a warranty as a defence in any such proceedings:
Provided that the purveyor shall not have any such right to require that such a sample shall be taken in cases where the milk from which the sample procured from the purveyor was taken was a mixture of milk obtained by the purveyor from more than one seller or consignor.
If a purveyor has served on the local authority such a notice as aforesaid, and the local authority have not procured a sample of milk from the seller or consignor in accordance with the foregoing provisions, no proceedings under the Sale of Food and Drugs Act, 1875 to 1907, shall be taken against the purveyor in respect of the sample of milk procured from him.
§ (3) Any sample of milk so taken in the course of transit or delivery shall be submitted for analysis to the analyst to whom the sample procured from the purveyor is or was submitted
§ (4) If proceedings are taken against the purveyor of milk, a copy of the certificate of the result of the analysis of every sample so taken in the course of transit or delivery shall be furnished to the purveyor, and every such certificate shall, subject to the provisions of section twenty-one of the Sale of Food and Drugs Act, 1875, be sufficient evidence of the facts stated therein, and shall be admissible as evidence on any question whether the milk sold by the purveyor was sold in the same state as he purchased it,
§ (5) The local authority of the district in which the first-mentioned sample was taken may, instead of, or in addition to taking proceedings against the purveyor of milk, take proceedings against the seller or consignor.
§
(6) If a sample of milk of cows in any dairy is taken in course of transit or delivery from that dairy, the owner of the cows may, within forty-eight hours after the sample of milk was procured, serve on the local authority a notice requesting them to take immediate steps to procure as soon as practicable a sample of milk from a corresponding milking of the cows, and the foregoing provisions shall apply accordingly:
Provided that the person taking the sample shall be empowered to take any such steps at the dairy as may be necessary to satisfy him that the sample is a fair sample of the milk of the cows when properly and fully milked.
§ LORD STRACHIE moved to delete "forty-eight" at the beginning of subsection (2) and to insert "sixty" The noble Lord said: This Amendment is moved at the request of the traders, who considered that forty-eight hours might not be sufficient in which to serve notice on the local authority. Therefore it was thought desirable to increase it from forty-eight hours to sixty.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 16, line 17, leave out ("forty-eight") and insert ("sixty").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
440§ LORD STRACHIEThe next is a similar Amendment, only this time it is introduced—in subsection (6)—on behalf of the farmers, who, like the traders, thought forty-eight hours too short a limit in order to serve notice on the local authority.
§
Amendment moved—
Page 17, line 15, leave out ("forty-eight") and insert ("sixty").—(Lord Strachie.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Third Schedule, as amended, agreed to.
§ Fourth Schedule agreed to.
§ Then (Standing Order No. XXXIX having been suspended) Bill read 3ª, and passed, and returned to the Commons, and to be printed as amended. (No. 222.)