SEA FISHERIES BILL [H.L.] (Hansard, 16 February 1904)

* THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD OF AGRICULTURE (The Earl of ONSLOW)

My Lords, undersized flat fish have not been fortunate at the hands of Parliament. Many Bills have been brought in to endeavour to preserve them, but none of them have succeeded in commanding the support of both Houses of Parliament. As long ago as 1888 this question was brought before Parliament by a conference of those interested in the trawling 1455 industry. Some of them waited upon me as a deputation a short time ago, and one or two of those gentlemen pathetically observed that most of those who had originally taken part in urging this question had now joined the great majority. A Bill was brought in by Mr. Bryce, then President of the Board of Trade, in 1895. Another Bill was brought in by the present Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland (the Earl of Dudley), then representing the Board of Trade in this House, both in 1896 and 1897. In 1898 my noble friend Lord Heneage brought in a Bill, and in 1899 a measure was introduced by Lord Camperdown, and the last Bill on the subject was one brought in by Mr. Ritchie when he was President of the Board of Trade in 1900. That Bill was referred to a Commitee, which considered it very carefully. The Committee reported that in their opinion it had been established that there were certain well-known areas in the North Sea where small and young fish congregate, and that if we could prevent fishing in such areas it would obviously be of great value. They further reported that the proposal in the Bill to prevent the sale of undersized flat fish would introduce certain harassing conditions upon those who carried on their business along the shore and in the smaller trawling vessels, and in those circumstances the Committee thought it would not be expedient for the Bill to pass without further investigation; but they added that they were confident that the question of the diminution of he fish supply was a very pressing one and that the situation was going from bad to worse. No effort, they thought, ought to be spared to provide especially for the regulation of the Nort Sea area and for the adequate equipment of the Government Department which had control of the subject. Since then the catch of fish has, it is true, not materially fallen off, but the area to which the vessels go— from Iceland in the North to Portugal in the South—has increased enormously, as also has the number of vessels engaged in the trade. Therefore I do not think that the former statistics are at all comparable with the statistics obtainable to-day.

If your Lordships are pleased to give this Bill a Second Reading I propose to 1456 ask you to send it to a Select Committee of this House, before whom I believe I shall be able to lay an amount of evidence which was not before the Committee of 1900, and which, if it had been before that Committee, would, I think, very materially have influenced their decision. This question is not one which is being brought forward by the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries on its own mere notion. It has been pressed upon it on all sides by those who are interested in the fishing industry. It has been pressed upon it by the owners of those large fleets that go to the North Sea to pursue their business, and it has been pressed equally by the various fisheries committees throughout the Kingdom. A very large sum of public money is being expended in investigation and research. This country joined an International Conference which was to inquire, among other things, into the reason why the supply of flat fish in the North Sea was being gradually depleted. A sum of £42,000 has been voted to be expended in three years. The investigations are to last for a longer period than that, but for at least three years this country is committed to an expenditure of £42,000 in the aggregate for the purpose of those investigations. After that it will be necessary to reconsider our position. When that £42,000 was authorised there was no Department specially concerned with the administration of the fisheries. Certain statutory duties concerning the interests of the fishing population of England and Wales were entrusted to the Board of Trade. It was therefore thought advisable to hand this sum of money over to two existing bodies, to the Scottish Fisheries Board and to the Marine Biological Association. The latter is a scientific institution, whose headquarters are at Plymouth, which is primarily, in fact I think I may say entirely, a biological association managed and administered by biologists; they have directed the investigations under their control more particularly to the direction and the temperature of the currents in the North Sea plankton, and also to that curious floating organism which is the fish food found in all parts of the ocean; but they have not directed their attention, at any rate to any great extent, in the direction of ascertaining what are the 1457 sizes of the fish caught, the localities in which they are caught, where they pass the different periods of their lives, and where they can be caught with least detriment to this industry. These things have been rather, I think, put aside, and indeed our Minister at Copenhagen has represented to His Majesty's Government that, while England has by far the largest take of fish, she is the most backward in giving information on the subjects to which I have just directed your Lordships' attention. When the time comes for a reconsideration of the relationship of this country to the other countries taking part in the conference, at the end of the first three years, I think it will be necessary very carefully to consider whether those two bodies to whom the expenditure of Great Britain's very large pecuniary contribution is entrusted are those most competent to expend it wisely and well. In addition to this sum £1,600 a year is expended by the Department over which I have the honour to preside in ascertaining the total catch and the total value of the fisheries of this country, and a further £1,000 a year is given for scientific purposes to the Marine Biological Association. I am happy to say that, owing to the generosity of one of the great City Livery Companies—the Fishmongers' Company—we have had the advantage of having placed at our disposal facilities which have enabled us to prosecute inquiries a little further. Under those arrangements we have been able to ascertain the fish brought into the market at Billingsgate and to divide them into three classes—namely, "large," "medium," and "small," and carefully to analyse them. From these returns we find that, during the months of March to July inclusive, the fleets fishing in the area off the Danish coast, in the nighbourhood of Heligoland, took very large quantities of small plaice. In 1902 the proportion of these fish to the total take was 82.6 per cent. by weight and 71.8 per cent. by value; in 1903 it was 69.2 per cent. by weight and 56.2 per cent by value. The term "small plaice" is however, merely a market distinction and includes fish from six inches to fifteen inches in length.

The investigations which I have referred to were conducted so as to ascertain the average proportion of fish 1458 of each size in a box of small plaice obtained from these grounds. A sufficient number of boxes to constitute a fair sample of the whole were bought on the market, and their contents, consisting of over 40,000, were measured. Similarly a sufficient number of each length were weighed so as to establish the average relation between length and weight. The average contents of a box was thus established, and by applying such knowledge to the statistical returns it was found that the fleets fishing on the Eastern grounds referred to had in 1902 an average catch of over 40 per cent., and in 1903 over 36 per cent. by weight of plaice under ten inches, and, in 1902, of over 60 per cent., and in 1903, of 53 per cent. by weight of plaice under eleven inches. I think that conclusively proves that the vessels which go out to fish in this great nursery ground in the North Sea bring home a very large number of fish which, if they were allowed to grow to mature size, would enormously increase the amount of the food supply.

This Bill is of a somewhat elastic character, and I have so drafted it because the Icthyological Committee which sat in 1903 recommended that, in view of the difficulty of carrying out reliable investigations as to the effect of natural causes on the supply of fish, the effect of such operations on the fisheries could best be tested by regulating such operations experimentally, and it is experimentally that we desire to proceed in this Bill. I am sorry that my noble friend Lord Tweedmouth is not in his place, because he has taken a great interest, from the beginning, in all these fisheries questions. I have read carefully the objections which he advanced against the Bills that have been introduced in former years. One suggestion which he made was that this ought to be dealt with rather by international agreement than by legislation in this country. There is nothing in this Bill which will prevent our entering into any international agreement, but that is a matter involving considerable time and a great deal of waiting, and we cannot afford to wait in this matter. I think your Lordships will see that it is highly desirable that this country at any rate should proceed as rapidly as possible to do something to prevent the destruction of undersized fish 1459 in the great nursery grounds of the North Sea.

The Board of Agriculture, to which has been referred the duties of watching over the fisheries, has for many years been entrusted by Parliament with discretionary powers by way of Order. That was originally done in the case of diseases of animals, and the object of the Board, which has been completely attained, has been, not to force public opinion, but to endeavour, as far as possible, to follow and to live up to it. We have begun with Orders which, perhaps, have been by many people thought not sufficiently stringent. We have increased from time to time their stringency, and in the case of diseases of animals we are at present most loyally supported by those who are interested in agriculture, in our desire to stamp out the diseases which we have not already obliterated. It is in the same way that we hope to proceed by this Bill. If you look at Clause I you will observe that the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries are to be empowered to make Orders for the purpose of preventing the destruction of undersized flat fish, either absolutely or subject to such exemptions or conditions as may be prescribed.

The matters which we shall have to consider, and which the Committee will have to consider, are, first, what months in the year shall that prescription apply to; secondly, what is the class of vessels which shall be prohibited from landing undersized fish; and, thirdly, what shall be the size of fish the landing of which shall be prohibited. Under the former Bills it was an offence to sell any fish under a certain size, that size being prescribed in the Bill, and it was stated, with, I daresay, a great deal of truth, that as that applied indiscriminately to everybody engaged in fishing, it might work great hardship to the small people along the shore, who, although they may destroy a certain number of undersized fish, do nothing like the damage done by trawlers in the North Sea. The object of this Bill is to exempt many small boats catching undersized fish to an extent which is infinitesimal compared to the resources of the sea, but which may be of vital importance to the immediate owner in obtaining his livelihood. Such vessels may be found at Rams gate, Brixham, and, indeed, all round the coast, and I do not propose to interfere 1460 with people getting such a livelihood. It is true that it is impossible to avoid catching these small fish if you go to the ground where they are, but we believe, from the evidence before us, that it will not be worth the while of the trawlers to go to these nurseries of small fish if you prevent them from landing them after they have been caught. They will go to other parts of the North Sea, and these nurseries will be preserved as breeding grounds for the fish.

Perhaps I may explain how it comes that this particular area is the breeding ground of the North Sea. The current is always running from West to East, the spawn of the fish floats in the water and is carried by the current into that angle between the North of Germany and Jutland; it cannot get any further and strikes up against the coast; the young fish are hatched out and travel back to the large banks adjoining Heligoland. If they are allowed to remain there a year undisturbed they become good sized fish, and swim out into the larger area of the North Sea. There is a clause in the Bill which gives power to the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries to prevent trawling within a three mile limit of the shore; that power is already in the hands of the fisheries committees all round the coast. There are, I think, 1,700 miles of coast line, and there are some parts where the prohibitions might with advantage be extended. All we ask is that Parliament should give to us the same powers as are now possessed by fisheries committees all round the coast. It is high time that England should set an example to other countries. Other countries have passed limits for fish, but we have no undersized limit in this country. I am informed that there is no sale for undersized fish on the Continent, and certainly the first vessels we should prohibit landing fish on these shores would be foreign vessels bringing them in when English vessels are prevented from doing so.

We should first confine the prohibition to those steam carriers and large trawlers that go out to the North Sea. We are invited to do so by the great companies who own these trawlers and carriers, and I believe there is no difference of opinion 1461 amongst those who represent the great fishing interest upon this subject. The diminution of the fish food supply of this country is a very serious matter. It is one which at a very early date will inevitably come home to the population, particularly the poorer population, and unless something is done, at a very early date, my fear is that there will be a very serious diminution in the food supply of this country. This Bill is designed, as I have said, with a certain amount of elasticity, to enable us to proceed tentatively, so that if we make a false step we are able to retreat. I think the way in which the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries has been supported by the farming interest in this country is such that I may safely ask your Lordships to give it a certain discretion in this matter. The Bills that have been introduced before have not been very successful, but I earnestly hope, and confidently expect, that a measure of this kind, which will not interfere with the small shrimper and the longshoreman round the coast, while it will impose a self-denying ordinance on the owners of large steam trawlers and carriers, will meet with but little opposition. I therefore invite your Lordships to give it a Second Reading.