HL Deb 15 May 1900 vol 83 cc156-60
VISCOUNT SIDMOUTH

My Lords, I beg to ask the Postmaster General whether arrangements could be made by which the officers and seamen of Her Majesty's Navy could receive, at the principal stations in the United Kingdom, letters and telegrams without extra payment. In putting this question I may, perhaps, be allowed to say a few words by way of explanation. The officers and seamen of the Royal Navy are at present practically dependent upon ships' boats for the supply of their letters and telegrams. I do not complain of that so far as letters are concerned, although it may happen that ships lying at Spithead or in the Sound may find it extremely inconvenient to send their boats in for letters. If I may be allowed to refer to my own experience, which is somewhat an ancient one, I may say that I cannot remember any time when we were dependent on our own resources. A postman always came to the ship with the letters, and he was paid, I believe, by the Post Office. But when it comes to telegrams the case is much more serious. A telegram despatched from any part of England to an officer or seaman comes down to Portsmouth or Plymouth and then has to be conveyed by a shore boat at the expense of the person to whom it is addressed. To officers this does not matter much, but to the unfortunate midshipman or seaman it is a matter of great hardship that they should be compelled to pay sixpence, and frequently, when the weather is bad, a shilling for the delivery of their telegrams. I have heard of cases where half-a-crown has had to be paid when the ship is outside. I may mention that on many foreign stations—at Japan, for instance—every ship, of whatever nationality, has its telegrams and letters delivered free at the expense of the Government. I hope the noble Marquess will be able to make some arrangement by which the officers and seamen of Her Majesty's Navy can receive at the principal stations in the United Kingdom letters and telegrams without extra payment.

EARL SPENCER

My Lords, I hope the noble Marquess will allow me to support the prayer of the noble and gallant Viscount who has just spoken. It certainly does seem to me a great hardship that men who are serving their country on board ship should be put to much greater expense in getting their letters and telegrams than any other person in the kingdom. I am not quite certain whether this is entirely a Post Office matter; it may partly belong to the Admiralty. I was not aware of the instance which the noble Viscount has quoted from Japan; but as Japan has followed us in so many ways—notably in the matter of ships and the organisation of the Navy --I hope in the matter of the delivery of telegrams and letters the Post Office or the Admiralty will follow the example of Japan.

THE POSTMASTER, GENERAL (The Marquess of) LONDONDERRY

My Lords, my noble friend in putting this question has voiced the universal opinion of your Lordships' House—namely, that it is desirable as far as possible to conduce to the comfort, welfare, and convenience of our gallant sailors. I need not say that I do not yield to my noble friend or the noble Earl opposite in my desire to carry their suggestion into effect, but at the same time there are various difficulties with which the Post Office has to contend in this particular matter. My noble friend has not made any great complaint with regard to the delivery of letters. There is no extra payment due for the delivery of any fully prepaid letter as long as the destination of the letter is within the ordinary limits of the postman's work. At the same time, it is not considered advisable that postmen, if I may use a naval expression, should go afloat, because, as your Lordships are aware, the distance of the various vessels from the mainland is very variable. The delivery by postmen would therefore be very irregular, and it would lead to considerable inconvenience. Ships' boats are, however, in constant communication with the mainland, and I believe that that communication and the transport of letters from the mainland to the ships by moans of the boats are not absolutely inconvenient. The same argument, to a certain extent, holds good in the arrangement for the delivery of telegrams. The circumstances affecting the delivery of telegrams also vary to the same extent as the delivery of letters. Every effort is made to deliver telegrams to the officers and men of the Navy on the ships at the various stations with as little delay and expense as possible, and in many cases with no expense at all. I should like to allude specially to the chief stations—Plymouth and Devonport —which my noble friend had in his mind when he put the question, and to tell your Lordships what the arrangements are there. In the case of Plymouth and Devonport telegrams to Her Majesty's ships in the Hamoaze are delivered on board the respective ships in watermen's boats at charges from 4d. to 1s. 6d., according to the position of the ship. The amount charged is in accordance with the scale of charges issued by the commissioners of boats and wherries for the port, and it is feared that no cheaper arrangement is possible. Telegrams for ships lying in the Sound are delivered at the Commander-in-Chief's office in accordance with the Admiralty instructions of the port, and are either sent off in the next despatch box or are semaphored to the ship if she is on the point of leaving. There is no charge for delivery. At Portsmouth, under an arrangement made with the naval Commander-in-Chief, telegrams for Her Majesty's ships in the stream or at Spithead are left at the dockyard main gate, and the ship is informed by signal from the tower. They are either sent for by the ship, or, at the request of the addressee, signalled from the tower to the ship. At Sheerness, telegrams for Her Majesty's ships are delivered at the Royal Naval Barracks, and the addressees are informed by signal of their arrival. In any case in which the addressee so requests, the telegram is signalled to the ship; otherwise it waits at the Royal Naval Barracks until called for. I have no doubt that my noble friend had in his mind the fact that telegrams, letters, and parcels have been sent at a reduced rate to South Africa during the present war, but I must remind your Lordships that the telegrams have been sent there at a reduced rate owing to the fact that the privilege was due to a free gift on the part of the Eastern Telegraph Company. Unstamped letters that have been delivered in this country from South Africa have been delivered free of expense owing to the action of the War Office. The noble Lord opposite alluded to the fact that the Admiralty might perhaps render some assistance in the matter. So far as the Post Office is concerned, if the Admiralty and the War-Office are prepared to refund to the Post Office any loss it may sustain by the free delivery of letter's and telegrams, I shall be only too glad to undertake the duty on behalf of the Department. I would remind your Lordships that at the present moment the telegraph branch of the Post Office is not remunerative; indeed, it is carried on at a considerable loss. Unless, therefore, these great Departments of the State, to whom our soldiers and sailors naturally look, are prepared to refund to the Post Office the loss which would be sustained otherwise, I do not think I should be justified in undertaking the responsibility of incurring further loss to the telegraph branch; nor do I think I should be justified—in view of the fact that the Treasury have been called upon to provide a large expenditure during the past few months, and in all probability a still larger expense in the coming months—in asking that Department to launch on an expenditure of the character contemplated. I sympathise most sincerely with the desire of the noble Viscount to conduce to the comforts and prosperity of our sailor.-3. I can assure him that it is the ardent desire of the Department over which I preside that our sailors should receive their telegrams with the utmost expedi- tion and with the least possible expense; and if the noble Lord will bring to my notice any cases of delay or unnecessary expense, the complaints will receive my sympathetic consideration, and I will do my utmost to remedy any grievance for which my Department can be held responsible.

THE EARL OF KIMBERLEY

I would point out to the noble Marquess that payment made by the Admiralty or the War Office out of public funds, or payment made in the shape of reduction of expense, so far as the revenue of this country is concerned, comes to exactly the same thing. It is merely a question of booking the amount to one Department or the other, and therefore I do not see that it is of very much consequence. I would venture to urge that the question of supplying special facilities for the men serving in the Navy must not be looked upon in the same way as supplying the public generally. We owe this concession to one of the great services. Even if the terrible thing were to happen that the Post Office were unable to show to the Treasury as large a balance as usual, I think the public would be better served by the expenditure of the money in this way that by a desire to swell the Post Office revenue. I think the reductions that have been made to the general public have been most generous, but I maintain that it is the absolute duty of the country to relieve those serving on board ship of inconvenience and extra expense.

House adjourned at Five of the clock, to Thursday next, half-past Ten of the clock.