§ Lord Grenvillerose, and said, that agreeably to the notice he had given, he was about to offer to their Lordships a petition from certain of his Majesiy's subjects in Ireland, professing the Roman Catholic religion. He now held the Petition in his hand, and in the first place desired that it might be read. The Clerk then read the Petition, of which the following is an authentic copy.
The humble Petition of the Roman Catholics of Ireland, whose names are hereunto subscribed, on behalf of themselves and of others his majesty's subjects professing the Roman Catholic Religion,
"SHEWETH—That your petitioners are steadfastly attached to the person, family, and government, of their most gracious sovereign; that they are impressed with sentiments of affectionate gratitude for the benign laws which have been enacted for meliorating their condition during his paternal reign; and they contemplate, with rational and decided predilection, the admirable principles of the British constitution.
"Your Petitioners most humbly state, that they have, solemnly and publicly, taken the oaths by law prescribed to his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, as tests of political and moral principles; and they confidently appeal to the sufferings which they have long endured, and the sacrifices which they still make rather than violate their consciences (by taking oaths of a religious or spiritual import contrary to their belief), as decisive proofs of their profound and scrupulous reverence for the sacred obligation of an oath.
"Your Petitioners beg leave to represent—that by those awful tests they bind themselves, in the presence of the All seeing Deity, whom all classes of Christians adore, "to be faithful and bear true allegiance to their most gracious sovereign lord King George the Third, and him to defend to the utmost of their power against all conspiracies and attempts whatsoever that shall be made against his person, crown or dignity; to do their utmost endeavours to disclose and make known to his majesty and his heirs all treasons and traitorous conspiracies which may be formed against him or them; and faithfully to maintain, 98 support, and defend, to the utmost of their power, the succession to the crown in his majesty's family against any person or persons whatsoever."—"That, by those oaths, they renounce and abjure obedience and allegiance unto any other person claiming or pretending a right to the crown of this realm; that they reject and detest, as unchristian and impious, to believe that it is lawful in any ways to injure any person or persons whatsoever under pretence of their being heretics; and also that unchristian and impious principle—that no faith is to be kept with Heretics—that it is no article of their faith—and that they renounce, reject, and abjure, the opinion, that princes excommunicated by the pope and council, or by any authority whatsoever, may be deposed or murdered by their subjects, or by any other person whatsoever;—that they do not believe that the pope of Rome, or any other foreign prince, prelate, state, or potentate, bath, or ought to have, any temporal or civil jurisdiction, power, superiority, or pre-eminence within this realm;—that they firmly believe, that no act in itself unjust, immoral, or wicked, can ever be justified or excused by or under pretence or colour that it was done for the good of the church, or in obedience to any ecclesiastical power whatsoever; and that it is not an article of the catholic faith, neither are they thereby required to believe or profess, that the pope is infallible, or that they are bound to any order, in its own nature immoral, although the pope or any ecclesiastical power should issue or direct such order; but that, on the contrary, they hold, that it would be sinful in them to pay any respect or obedience thereto—that they do not believe that any sin whatsoever, committed by them, can be forgiven at the mere will of any pope or of any priest, or of any person or persons whatsoever, but that any person who receives absolution, without a sincere sorrow for such sin, and a firm and sincere resolution to avoid future guilt, and to atone to God, so far from obtaining thereby any remission of his sin, incurs the additional guilt of violating a sacrament; and," by the same solemn obligation, "they are bound and firmly pledged to defend, to the utmost of their power, the settlement and arrangement of property in their country 99 as established by the laws now in being; —that they have disclaimed, disavowed, and solemly abjured any intention to subvert the present church establishment for the purpose of substituting a catholic establishment in its stead;" and that they have also solemnly sworn, "that they will not exercise any privilege, to which they are or may become entitled, to disturb or weaken the protestant religion or protestant government in Ireland."
"Your Petitioners most humbly beg leave to shew, that however painful it is to their feelings, that it should still be thought necessary to exact such tests from them (and from them alone of all his majesty's subjects), they can with perfect truth affirm, that the political and moral principles, which are thereby asserted, are not only conformable to their opinions, but expressly inculcated by the religion which they profess; and your Petitioners most humbly trust, that the religious doctrines, which permit such tests to be taken, will be pronounced by this honourable house to be entitled to a toleration, not merely partial, but complete, under the happy constitution and government of this realm; and that his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, holding those principles, will be considered as subjects upon whose fidelity the state may repose the firmest reliance.
"Your Petitioners further most humbly shew, that 26 years have now elapsed since their most gracious sovereign and the honourable houses of parliament in Ireland, by their public and deliberate act, declared, that, "from the uniform peaceable behaviour of the Roman Catholics of Ireland for a long series of years, it appeared reasonable and expedient to relax the disabilities and incapacities under which they laboured, and that it must tend not only to the cultivation and improvement of this kingdom, but to the prosperity and strength of all his majesty's dominions, that his majesty's .subjects of all denominations should enjoy the blessings of a free constitution, and should be bound to each other by mutual interest and mutual affection;" a declaration founded upon unerring principles of justice and sound policy, which still remains to be carried, into full effect faithough your Petitioners are impressed with a belief, that the apprehensions which retarded its beneficial operation previous to the union cannot exist in the parliament of the united kingdom).
"For your Petitioners most humbly shew, that, by virtue of divers statutes 100 now in force, his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, who form so great a proportion of the population of Ireland, and contribute so largely to the resources of the state, do yet labour under many incapacities, restraints, and privations, which affect them with peculiar severity in almost every station of life; that more especially they are denied the capacity of sitting or voting in either of the honourable houses of parliament; the manifold evils consequent upon which incapacity they trust it is unnecessary to unfold and enumerate to this honourable house.
"They are disabled from holding or exercising (unless by a special dispensation) any corporate office whatsoever in the cities or towns in which they reside; they are incapacitated and disqualified from holding or exercising the offices of sheriffs and sub-sheriffs, and various offices of trust, honour, and emolument in the state, in his majesty's military and naval service, and in the administration of the laws, in this their native land.
"Your Petitioners, declining to enter into the painful detail of the many incapacities and inconveniencies avowedly inflicted by those statutes upon his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, beg leave, however, most earnestly to solicit the attention of this hon. house, to the humiliating and ignominious system of exclusion, reproach, suspicion, which those statutes generate and keep alive.
"For your Petitioners most humbly shew, that in consequence of the hostile spirit thereby sanctioned, their hopes of enjoying even the privileges, which through the benignity of their most gracious sovereign, they have been capacitated to enjoy, are nearly altogether frustrated, insomuch that they are, in effect, shut out from almost all the honours, dignities, and offices of trust and emolument in the state, from rank and distinction in his majesty's army and navy, and even from the lowest situations and franchises in the several cities and corporate towns throughout his majesty's dominions.
"And your petitioners severely feel, that this unqualified interdiction of those of their communion from all municipal stations, from the franchises of all guilds and corporations, and from the patronage and benefits annexed to those situations, is an evil not terminating in itself for they beg leave to state, that, by giving an advantage over those of their communion to others, by whom such situations are ex- 101 clusively possessed, it establishes a species of qualified monopoly, universally operating in their disfavour, contrary to the spirit, and highly detrimental to the freedom of trade.
"Your Petitioners likewise severely feel, that his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, in consequence of their exclusion from the offices of sheriffs and sub-sheriffs, and of the hostile spirit of those statutes, do not fully enjoy certain other inestimable privileges of the British constitution, which the law has most jealously maintained and secured to their fellow subjects.
"Your Petitioners most humbly beg leave to solicit the attention of this hon. house to the distinction which has conceded the elective, and denies the representative franchise to one and the same class of his his majesty's subjects; which detaches from property its proportion of political power under a constitution whose vital principle is the union of the one with the other; which closes every avenue of legalized ambition against those who must be presumed to have great credit and influence among the mass of the population of the country; which refuses to peers of the realm all share in the legislative representation, either actual or virtual; and renders the liberal profession of the law to Roman Catholics a mere object of pecuniary traffic, despoiled of its hopes and of its honours.
"Your Petitioners further most humbly shew, that the exclusion of so numerous and efficient a portion of his majesty's subjects as the Roman Catholics of this realm from civil honours and offices, and from advancement in his majesty's army and navy, actually impairs, in a very material degree, the most valuable resources Of the British empire, by impeding his majesty's general service, stifling the most honourable and powerful incentives to civil and military merit, and unnecessarily restricting the exercise of that bright prerogative of the crown, which encourages good subjects to promote the public welfare, and excites them to meritorious actions, by a well regulated distribution of public honours and rewards.
"Your Petitioners beg leave most humbly to submit, that those manifold incapacities, restraints, and privations, are absolutely repugnant to the liberal and comprehensive principles recognized by their most gracious sovereign and the parliament of Ireland: that they are impolitic 102 restraints upon his majesty's -prerogative—that they are hurtful and vexatious to the feelings of a loyal and generous people—and that the total abolition of them will be found not only compitible with, but highly conduci[...] to, the perfect security of every establishment religious or political, now existing in this realm.
"For your Petitioners most explicitly declare, that they do not seek or wish, in the remotes degree, to injure or encroach upon "the rights, privileges, immunities, possessions, or revenues appertaining to the bishops and clergy of the protestant religion, as by law established, or to the churches committed to their charge, or to any of them"—the sole object of your petitioners being an equal participation, upon equal terms with their fellow-subjects, of the full benefits of the British laws and constitution.
"Your Petitioners beg leave most humbly to observe, that although they might well and justly insist upon the firm and unabated loyalty of his majesty's Roman Catholic subjects to their most gracious sovereign, their profound respect for the legislature, and their dutiful submission to the laws, yet they most especially rest their humble claims and expectations of relief upon the clear and manifest conduciveness of the measure which they solicit to the general and permanent tranquillity, strength and happiness of the British empire. And your Petitioners, entertaining no doubt of its final accomplishment, from its evident justice and utility, do most solemnly assure this hon. house, that their earnest solicitude for it, at this peculiar crisis, arises principally from their anxious desire to extinguish all motives to disunion, and all means of exciting discontent.
"For your Petitioners humbly state it as their decided opinion, that the enemies of the British empire, who meditate the subjugation of Ireland, have no hope of success, save in the disunion of its inhabitants; and therefore it is, that your Petitioners are deeply anxious, at this moment, that a measure should be accomplished which will annihilate the principles of religious animosity, and animate all descriptions of his majesty's subjects in an enthusiastic defence of the best constitution that has ever yet been established.
"Your Petitioners, therefore, most humbly presume to express their earnest, but respectful hope, that this hon. house will in its wisdom and liberality, deem the se- 103 veral statutes, now in force [...]ainst them, no longer necessary to be re[...]tined; and that his majesty's loyal and dutiful subjects, professing the Roman Catholic religion, may be effectually relieved from the operation of those statutes, and that so they may be restored to the full enjoyment of the benefits of the British [...]nstitution, and to every inducement of [...]achment to that constitution, equally [...] in common with their fellow subjects throughout the British empire. And your Petitioners will ever pray, &c. Signed Shrewsbury, Waterford, and Wexford; Fingal, Kenmare, Gormanstown, Southwell, Trimlestown, &c. &c."
§ Lord Grenvilleagain rose, and moved, that it do lie on the table. He said, it was not his intention to make any other motion at present, on a subject of so much importance; much deliberation was necessary previous to any notice being given of a motion for the consideration of the petition. When it should be thought fit to submit that proposition to the house, he assured their lordships that ample notice would be given.
Lord Aucklandfelt himself bound to say a few words before the petition was laid on the table. He declared that the nature of the petition, until this moment, had been perfectly unknown to him. He had, however, listened attentively to it while reading, and, from what caught his ear, it appeared to him that the petitioners claimed a full participation of all the rights and privileges of the other subjects of his majesty. That was a claim which merited the most serious consideration. If it were to be conceded, the consequence would be that their lordships would see a protestant king, in this country, maintaining the protestant religion here, while it was losing its ascendency in Ireland. In Ireland, their lordships would see the protestant religion established by law, while the magistrates and legislators of the country would be Roman Catholics. He regretted that this subject had been brought forward, but since it had come under the notice of their lordships, he trusted that the question would be fully investigated. Their lordships could not now let the subject pass over, but must feel it to be their duty to discuss it minutely, calmly, and dispassionately. He would give no opinion at present; but he must confess that he saw nothing in the signs of the times that would induce him to break down the barriers, 104 and undermine the fortifications which had been raised for the protection of the church and state. He must use these words church and state, because they presented an idea to his mind, which he never could separate from that of the constitution of the country. Having said thus much, be again expressed his hope that the business would not be suffered to lie over, but that it would be brought forward as speedily as possible.
§ Lord Grenvillewould not use one word of argument in support of the petition. He should only observe, that so far as it was in his power to expedite the business, it would be forwarded, and he was anxious that no unnecessary delay should take place. He also assured their lordships, that when the subject was brought forward, it should, as far as depended on him, receive a deliberate, calm, and dispassionate discussion. With regard to the merits of the petition, he would say nothing now; that was what he wished to avoid at present, even if any thing could have induced him to offer any observations on a motion for laying this petition on the table.
§ Lord Hawkesbury ,after what had passed, could not permit the petition to be laid on the table, without taking the opportunity of saving a few words upon the motion. The right of petitioning he held to be so sacred a privilege, that nothing could excuse their lordships from receiving petitions from any description of his majesty's subjects. To this general proposition he knew only two exceptions: 1st, when the grievance complained of was one over which their lordships had no jurisdiction, and which they therefore could not redress. 2d, when there was something disrespectful in the form or language of the petition. The present petition, however, came not within either of these exceptions, and he therefore should not object to its being laid on the table. He concurred with the noble baron who had introduced the petition, in deprecating all premature discussion; but, if it was that noble baron's intention to bring the subject again before the House, he thought it but justice now to declare, that if any motion should be made for carrying into effect the prayer of the petition, he should then, but not till then, state his reasons for opposing any such measure.
§ Lord Grenvillesaid, he only rose, that it might be distinctly understood, that it was his intention to bring forward the sub- 105 ject of the petition and its prayer to the consideration of the house, and that with as little interval of delay as the circumstances of the case would admit.—The petition was then ordered to lie on the table.
The Duke of Norfolkrose, to move that the Petition should be printed. He was not aware whether such a motion was conformable to the custom and usage of the house; but when he considered the importance of the subject, and the variety of assertions made in the Petition, all of which it was indispensably necessary their lordships should thoroughly investigate, he wished, if there was no order against it, to press upon the attention of the House a motion for printing the petition. He at the same time regretted, that a noble lord, holding a high situation in his majesty's most intimate councils, should have prematurely expressed an opinion inimical to the prayer of the petition.
The Lord Chancellorsaid, he believed it would be found, on the one hand, that there was no order against printing a petition, and that, on the other, there was no example of any petition having been printed. He thought that the importance of the petition demanded that it should remain on the table, for the examination of every one of their lordships, instead of being sent out of the House to be printed.—motion was negatived.