§ Mr. RifkindI beg to move amendment No. 135, in page 26, leave out lines 35 to 40 and insert—
'27.—(1) Section 1(5) of the Housing Rents and Subsidies (Scotland) Act 1975 (no provision to be made for surplus in housing revenue account) is repealed.This replaces the original clause 27 in repealing the sections of the Housing Rents and Subsidies (Scotland) Act 1975 which respectively prohibit the accumulation on the housing revenue account of more than a reasonable working balance and empower the Secretary of State by order to limit rents. The replacement clause 27 contains new provisions which allow local authorities considerable freedom on housing revenue accounts.
- (2) For sub-paragraph 11(1) of Schedule 4 to the Housing (Financial Provisions) (Scotland) Act 1972 there shall be substituted the following sub-paragraph—
- "11.—(1) If at any time a credit balance is shown in the housing revenue account, the whole or part of it may be made available for any purpose for which the general fund of the local authority maintained under section 93 of the Local Government (Scotland) Act 1973 may lawfully be applied."
- (3) Section 2 of the Housing Rents and Subsidies (Scotland) Act 1975 (reserve powers to limit rents) is repealed.'.
These were matters which were discussed in Committee. This is thought to be a more appropriate way of formulating the provision.
With regard to the credit balances of housing revenue accounts, these matters were put forward to COSLA, and the housing committee of the convention has indicated that it is content with what is put forward.
I commend the amendment to the House.
§ Mr. MillanThe Government know that we are wholly opposed to clause 27 as it stands. I should have liked an opportunity to move an amendment that would have expressed that opposition. Unfortunately, our amendments were not selected. But the Government have at least facilitated us in our desire to have a vote on these provisions by redrafting the clause : and putting it on the Amendment paper.
711 We object to both parts of the clause—the question of allowing local authorities to accumulate surpluses in the housing revenue account and also the fact that the Government are abolishing the power of the Secretary of State to intervene with reserve power to limit rents in suitable circumstances. If we did not have the redrafted version, clause 27 would still be in the Bill. We must do
§ the best we can in these inadequate circumstances as we have no amendments of our own to debate. It is to express our disagreement with the clause that I invite my right hon. and hon. Friends to vote against the amendment.
§ Question put, That the amendment be made :—
§ The House divided: Ayes 276, Noes 209.
715| Division No. 359] | AYES | [10.05 pm |
| Adley, Robert | Eggar, Timothy | Lang, Ian |
| Aitken, Jonathan | Emery, Peter | Langford-Holt, Sir John |
| Alexander, Richard | Eyre, Reginald | Lawrence, Ivan |
| Alton, David | Fairbairn, Nicholas | Lee, John |
| Ancram, Michael | Fairgrleve, Russell | Le Marchant, Spencer |
| Arnold, Tom | Faith, Mrs Shella | Lennox-Boyd, Hon Mark |
| Aspinwall, Jack | Farr, John | Lewis, Kenneth (Rutland) |
| Atkins, Rt Hon H. (Spelthorne) | Fenner, Mrs Peggy | Lloyd, Peter (Fareham) |
| Atkins, Robert (Preston North) | Finsberg, Geoffrey | Loveridge, John |
| Atkinson, David (B'mouth, East) | Fisher, Sir Nigel | Lyell, Nicholas |
| Baker, Kenneth (St. Marylebone) | Fletcher, Alexander (Edinburgh N) | McCrindle, Robert |
| Baker, Nicholas (North Dorset) | Fletcher-Cooke, Charles | Macfarlane, Neil |
| Beaumont-Dark, Anthony | Fookes, Miss Janet | MacGregor, John |
| Beith, A. J. | Fowler, Rt Hon Norman | MacKay, John (Argyll) |
| Bendall, Vivian | Fox, Marcus | Macmillan, Rt Hon M. (Farnham) |
| Benyon, Thomas (Abingdon) | Fraser, Rt Hon H. (Stafford & St) | McNair-Wilson, Michael (Newbury) |
| Benyon, W. (Buckingham) | Fraser, Peter (South Angus) | McNair-Wilson, Patrick (New Forest) |
| Berry, Hon Anthony | Fry, Peter | McQuarrie, Albert |
| Best, Keith | Gardiner, George (Reigate) | Madel, David |
| Bevan, David Gilroy | Gardner, Edward (South Fylde) | Major, John |
| Blggs-Davison, John | Garel-Jones, Tristan | Marland, Paul |
| Blackburn, John | Glyn, Dr Alan | Marlow, Tony |
| Bonsor, Sir Nicholas | Goodhew, Victor | Marshall, Michael (Arundel) |
| Boscawen, Hon Robert | Gower, Sir Raymond | Marten, Neil (Banbury) |
| Bottomley, Peter (Woolwich West) | Grant, Anthony (Harrow C) | Mates, Michael |
| Bowden, Andrew | Gray, Hamish | Mather, Carol |
| Braine, Sir Bernard | Greenway, Harry | Maude, Rt Hon Angus |
| Bright, Graham | Grieve, Percy | Mawby, Ray |
| Brinton, Tim | Griffiths, Eldon (Bury St Edmunds) | Mawhinney, Dr Brian |
| Brittan, Leon | Grist, Ian | Maxwell-Hyslop, Robin |
| Brocklebank-Fowler, Christopher | Grylls, Michael | Mellor, David |
| Brooke, Hon Peter | Gummer, John Selwyn | Meyer, Sir Anthony |
| Brown, Michael (Brigg & Sc'thorpe) | Hamilton, Hon Archie (Eps'm&Ew'll) | Miller, Hal (Bromsgrove & Redditch) |
| Bruce-Gardyne, John | Hamilton, Michael (Salisbury) | Mills, lain (Meriden) |
| Bryan, Sir Paul | Hampson, Dr Keith | Mills, Peter (West Devon) |
| Buchanan-Smith, Hon Alick | Kannam, John | Miscampbell, Norman |
| Budgen, Nick | Haselhurst, Alan | Mitchell, David (Basingstoke) |
| Bulmer, Esmond | Hastings, Stephen | Moate, Roger |
| Burden, F. A. | Havers, Rt Hon Sir Michael | Monro, Hector |
| Butcher, John | Hawksley, Warren | Montgomery, Fergus |
| Butler, Hon Adam | Hayhoe, Barney | Moore, John |
| Cadbury, Jocelyn | Heddle, John | Morris, Michael (Northampton, Sth) |
| Carlisle, John (Luton West) | Henderson, Barry | Morrison, Hon Charles (Devizes) |
| Carlisle, Kenneth (Lincoln) | Higgins, Rt Hon Terence L. | Morrison, Hon Peter (City of Chester) |
| Carlisle, Rt Hon Mark (Runcorn) | Hill, James | Mudd, David |
| Chalker, Mrs. Lynda | Hogg, Hon Douglas (Grantham) | Murphy, Christopher |
| Channon, Paul | Holland, Philip (Carlton) | Myles, David |
| Chapman, Sydney | Hooson, Tom | Neale, Gerrard |
| Clark, Hon Alan (Plymouth, Sutton) | Hordern, Peter | Needham, Richard |
| Clark, Sir William (Croydon South) | Howe, Rt Hon Sir Geoffrey | Nelson, Anthony |
| Clarke, Kenneth (Rushclifle) | Howell, Rt Hon David (Guildford) | Neubert, Michael |
| Clegg, Sir Walter | Howell, Ralph (North Norfolk) | Newton, Tony |
| Cockeram, Eric | Howells, Geraini | Normanton, Tom |
| Colvin, Michael | Hunt, David (Wirral) | Nott, Rt Hon John |
| Cormack, Patrick | Hunt, John (Ravensbourne) | Onslow, Cranley |
| Corrie, John | Irving, Charles (Cheltenham) | Oppenheim, Rt Hon Mrs Sally |
| Costain, A. P. | Jenkin, Rt Hon Patrick | Page, John (Harrow, West) |
| Cranborne, Viscount | Jessel, Toby | Page, Richard (SW Hertfordshire) |
| Dean, Paul (North Somerset) | Johnson Smith, Geoffrey | Parkinson, Cecil |
| Dickens, Geoffrey | Johnston, Russell (Inverness) | Parris, Mathew |
| Dorrell, Stephen | Jopling, Rt Hon Michael | Patten, Christopher (Bath) |
| Douglas-Hamilton, Lord James | Kaberry, Sir Donald | Patten, John (Oxford) |
| Dover, Denshore | Kimball, Marcus | Pattle, Geoffrey |
| Dunn, Robert (Dartford) | King, Rt Hon Tom | Pawsey, James |
| Durant, Tony | Kitson, Sir Timothy | Penhaligon, David |
| Dykes, Hugh | Knox, David | Pollock, Alexander |
| Eden, Rt Hon Sir John | Lamont, Norman | Porter, George |
| Prentice, Rt Hon Reg | Smith, Dudley (War, and Leam'ton) | Wainwright, Richard (Colne Valley) |
| Price, David (Eastleigh) | Speller, Tony | Waldegrave, Hon William |
| Prior, Rt Hon James | Spicer, Michael (S Worcestershire) | Walker, Rt Hon Peter (Worcester) |
| Proctor, K. Harvey | Squire, Robin | Walker, Bill (Perth & Perthshire) |
| Pym, Rt Hon Francis | Stanbrook, Ivor | Walker-Smith, Rt Hon Sir Derek |
| Ralson, Timothy | Stanley, John | Wall, Patrick |
| Rathbone, Tim | Steel, Rt Hon David | Waller, Gary |
| Rees, Peter (Dover and Deal) | Steen, Anthony | Walters, Dennis |
| Rees-Davies, W. R. | Stevens, Martin | Ward, John |
| Ronton, Tim | Stewart, Ian (Hitchin) | Warren, Kennth |
| Rhodes James, Robert | Stewart, John (East Renfrewshire) | Wells, John (Maidstone) |
| Ridley, Hon Nicholas | Stradling Thomas, J. | Wells, Bowen (Hert'rd & Stev'nage) |
| Ridsdale, Julian | Tapsell, Peter | Wheeler, John |
| Rifkind, Malcolm | Taylor, Teddy (Southend East) | Whitelaw, Rt Hon William |
| Roberts, Michael (Cardiff NW) | Tebbit, Norman | Whitney, Raymond |
| Ross, Stephen (Isle of Wight) | Temple-Morris, Peter | Wickenden, Keith |
| Rossi, Hugh | Thomas, Rt Hon Peter (Hendon S) | Wilkinson, John |
| Sainsbury, Hon Timothy | Thompson, Donald | Williams, Delwyn (Montgomery) |
| Scott, Nicholas | Thorne, Neil (Ilford South) | Winterton, Nicholas |
| Shaw, Giles (Pudsey) | Thornton, Malcolm | Wolfson, Mark |
| Shaw, Michael (Scarborough) | Townsend, Cyril D. (Bexleyheath) | Young, Sir George (Acton) |
| Shelton, William (Streatham) | Trippier, David | Younger, Rt Hon George |
| Shepherd, Colin (Hereford) | Trotter, Neville | |
| Shepherd, Richard (Aldridge-Br'hills) | Vaughan, Dr Gerard | TELLERS FOR THE AYES : |
| Silvester Fred | Viggers, Peter | Mr. John Cope and |
| Sims,Roger | Waddington,David | Mr. John Wakeham. |
| Skeet, T. H. H. | ||
| NOES | ||
| Abse, Leo | Dubs, Alfred | Jones, Barry (East Flint) |
| Adams, Allen | Duffy, A. E. P. | Jones, Dan (Burnley) |
| Anderson, Donald | Dunn, James A. (Liverpool, Kirkdale) | Kaufman, Rt Hon Gerald |
| Archer, Rt Hon Peter | Dunnett, Jack | Kerr, Russell |
| Armstrong, Rt Hon Ernest | Dunwoody, Mrs Gwyneth | Kilroy-Silk, Robert |
| Ashley, Rt Hon Jack | Eastham, Ken | Kinnock, Neil |
| Aahton, Joe | Ellis, Raymond (NE Derbyshire) | Leadbitter, Ted |
| Atkinson, Norman (H'gey, Tott'ham) | Ellis, Tom (Wrexham) | Lewis, Ron (Carlisle) |
| Bagier, Gordon A. T. | English, Michael | Lofthouse, Geoffrey |
| Barnett, Rt Hon Joel (Heywood) | Ennais, Rt Hon David | Lyon, Alexander (York) |
| Benn, Rt Hon Anthony Wedgwood | Evans, loan (Aberdare) | Lyons, Edward (Bradford West) |
| Bennett, Andrew (Stockport N) | Ewing, Harry | Mabon, Rt Hon Dr J. Dickson |
| Bidwell, Sydney | Field, Frank | McCartney, Hugh |
| Booth, Rt Hon Albert | Fitch, Alan | McDonald, Dr Oonagh |
| Boothroyd, Miss Betty | Fitt, Gerard | McKay, Allen (Penistone) |
| Bradley, Tom | Flannery, Martin | McKelvey, William |
| Bray, Dr Jeremy | Fletcher, Ted (Darlington) | Maclennan, Robert |
| Brown, Hugh D. (Provan) | Foot, Rt Hon Michael | Magee, Bryan |
| Brown, Ronald W. (Hackney S) | Ford, Ben | Marks, Kenneth |
| Brown, Ron (Edinburgh, Leith) | Forrester, John | Marshall, Jim (Leicester South) |
| Buchan, Norman | Foster, Derek | Meson, Rt Hon Roy |
| Callaghan, Jim (Middleton & P) | Foulkes, George | Maxton, John |
| Campbell, Ian | Fraser, John (Lambeth, Norwood) | Meacher, Michael |
| Campbell-Savours, Dale | Freeson, Rt Hon Reginald | Mellish, Rt Hon Robert |
| Cant, R. B. | Garrett, John (Norwich S) | Millan, Rt Hon Bruce |
| Carter-Jones. Lewis | George, Bruce | Miller, Dr M. S. (Ees Kilbride) |
| Cartwright, John | Gilbert, Rt Hon Dr John | Mitchell, Austin (Grimsby) |
| Clark, Dr David (South Shields) | Ginsburg, David | Mitchell, R. C. (Soton, Itchen) |
| Cocks, Rt Hon Michael (Bristol S) | Graham, Ted | Morris, Rt Hon Alfred (Wythenahawe) |
| Cohen, Stanley | Grant, George (Morpeth) | Morris, Rt Hon Charlea (Openshaw) |
| Coleman, Donald | Grant, John (Islington C) | Morris, Rt Hon John (Aberavon) |
| Concannon, Rt Hon J. D. | Hamilton, James (Bothwell) | Moyle, Rt Hon Roland |
| Conlan, Bernard | Hamilton, W. W. (Central Fife) | Newens, Stanley |
| Cowans, Harry | Hardy, Peter | Oakes, Rt Hon Gordon |
| Cox, Tom (Wandsworth, Tooting) | Harrison, Rt Hon Walter | Ogden, Eric |
| Crowther, J. S. | Hart, Rt Hon Dame Judith | O'Halloran, Michael |
| Cryer, Bob | Hattersley, Rt Hon Roy | O'Neill, Martin |
| Cunliffe, Lawrence | Haynes, Frank | Orme, Rt Hon Stanley |
| Cunningham, George (Islington S) | Healey, Rt Hon Denis | Owen, Rt Hon Dr David |
| Cunningham, Dr John (Whitehaven) | Heffer, Eric S. | Palmer, Arthur |
| Dalyell, Tam | Hogg, Norman (E Dunbartonshire) | Park, George |
| Davidson, Arthur | Holland, Stuart (L'beth, Vauxhall) | Parker, John |
| Davies, Rt Hon Denzil (Llanelli) | Home Robertson, John | Parry, Robert |
| Davies, Ifor (Gower) | Homewood, William | Pavitt, Laurie |
| Davis, Clinton, (Hackney Central) | Hooley, Frank | Pendry, Tom |
| Davis, Terry (B'rm'ham, Stechford) | Horam, John | Powell, Raymond (Ogmore) |
| Deakins, Eric | Howell, Rt Hon Denis (B'ham, Sm H) | Prese Ott, John |
| Dean, Joseph (Leeds West) | Huckfield, Les | Race, Reg |
| Dempsey, James | Hughes, Robert (Aberdeen North) | Radice, Giles |
| Dewar, Donald | Hughes, Roy (Newport) | Rees, Rt Hon Merlyn (Leeds South) |
| Dixon, Donald | Janner, Hon Greville | Richardson, Jo |
| Dobson, Frank | Jay, Rt Hon Douglas | Roberts, Albert (Normanton) |
| Dormand, Jack | John, Brynmor | Roberts, Ernest (Hackney North) |
| Douglas, Dick | Johnson, James (Hull West) | Roberts, Gwilym (Cannock) |
| Douglas-Mann, Bruce | Jones, Rt Hon Alec (Rhondda) | Robertson, George |
| Rodgers, Rt Hon William | Spriggs, Leslie | White, James (Glasgow, Pollok) |
| Rooker, J. W. | Stewart, Rt Hon Donald (W Isles) | Whitlock, William |
| Rosa, Ernest (Dundee West) | Strang, Gavin | Williams, Rt Hon Alan (Swansea W) |
| Ryman, John | Straw, Jack | Wilson, Gordon (Dundee East) |
| Sever, John | Summerskill, Hon Dr Shirley | Wilson, William (Coventry SE) |
| Sheerman, Barry | Taylor, Mrs Ann (Bolton West) | Winnick, David |
| Sheldon, Rt Hon Robert (A'ton-u-L) | Thomas, Jeffrey (Abertillery) | Woodall, Alec |
| Short, Mrs Renée | Thomas, Mike (Newcastle East) | Woolmer, Kenneth |
| Silkin, Rt Hon John (Deptford) | Thomas, Dr Roger (Carmarthen) | Wrigglesworth, Ian |
| Silkin, Rt Hon S. C. (Dulwich) | Thorne, Stan (Preston South) | Wright, Shella |
| Silverman, Julius | Tilley, John | Young, David (Bolton East) |
| Skinner, Dennis | Watkins, David | |
| Smith, Rt Hon J. (North Lanarkshire) | Weetch, Ken | TELLERS FOR THE NOES : |
| Snape, Peter | Welsh, Michael | Mr. George Morton and |
| Soley, Clive | White, Frank R.(Bury & Radcliffe) | Mr. James Tinn. |
| Spearing, Nigel |
§ Question accordingly agreed to.