§ Secretary Marjorie Mowlam, supported by the Prime Minister, Mr. Secretary Prescott, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Mr. Secretary Cook, Mr. Secretary Straw, Mr. Secretary Robertson, Mr. Secretary Michael, Mr. Secretary Reid and Mr. Paul Murphy, presented a Bill to make provision for the suspension in certain circumstances of devolved government in Northern Ireland and the exercise of certain functions conferred by or under Part V of the Northern Ireland Act 1998; and for connected purposes: And the same was read the First time; and ordered to be read a Second time tomorrow, and to be printed [Bill 136].
§ Sir Brian Mawhinney (North-West Cambridgeshire)On a point of order, Madam Speaker. I have just been to the Vote Office, and the Northern Ireland Bill that has just been presented is not available to right hon. and hon. Members. The Vote Office tells me that it has been told that the Bill may be available by 9 pm this evening, but that there is no guarantee of that.
I understand that the content of Bills and when they are debated in the House is a matter for the Government and not for you, Madam Speaker, but I wonder whether you have some power to help Back Benchers. The Bill may literally affect the peace of the realm. We are told that the Government expect it to go through all of its stages tomorrow. Have you the power to specify a time beyond which it would not be acceptable for the Bill to be made available to Back Benchers, if indeed it is to be considered tomorrow?
§ Mr. Eric Forth (Bromley and Chislehurst)Further to that point of order, Madam Speaker. Can you also advise the House how you envisage that it will be possible for hon. Members properly to consider such a Bill, properly 24 to consult those who may legitimately be interested in it, and more crucially, properly to table amendments? how can the House have time to consider the original text of the Bill and the text of any amendments that may be tabled? Your advice is essential in this case, because there seems to be a great danger that the House will get itself into extreme difficulty in legislating properly, with such absurd time constraints placed on it.
§ Mr. Gerald howarth (Aldershot)rose—
§ Madam SpeakerOrder. The Leader of the House and I are quite capable of dealing with the matter so far.
§ Mrs. BeckettFurther to that point of order, Madam Speaker. Of course I understand the anxieties expressed by right hon. and hon. Members, and I respect in particular the concerns of Back-Bench Members who have not been involved in the detailed discussions.
It may be helpful to the House to know that discussions are proceeding to try to get the Bill as strong and as robust as we can, so that there will broad agreement. The Leader of the Opposition and other relevant, closely involved parties are being kept informed and involved in those discussions. We hope that the Bill will be available in time for amendments to be tabled before Second Reading. That can be facilitated if the House agrees a motion that the Government have already tabled for decision later today.
§ Mr. Gerald howarthrose—
§ Madam SpeakerOrder. May I just reply to those points of order. I am not in a position to delay tomorrow's legislation in any way. I am aware that Bill is not available—I made inquiries myself—but that is not unusual, as hon. Members of long standing will be aware. It is not disorderly, and it is no discourtesy to the house, not to have a Bill ready at this stage. That has happened on a number of occasions and we have heard what the Leader of the House said.
§ Sir Brian MawhinneyFurther to that point of order, Madam Speaker. I understand—and, indeed, I know from my own experience—that sometimes Government Bills are produced to the House when they are not in their final form. I cannot immediately think, however, of any example of that being the case when a Bill was to be put through all its stages the following day. I have to say through you that, as a Back Bencher, I want the protection of the Chair against those arrangements, which the Leader of the House tells us are being made in corners and behind Benches, even if they are being made with the most distinguished Members of the house. Your protection is for the vast majority of Members—the Back Benchers, who have as much right, duty and responsibility as the Front Benchers to consider the legislation.
§ Madam SpeakerThe right hon. Gentleman might put those points about his dissatisfaction with matters in the Second Reading debate.
§ Mr. Paul Flynn (Newport, West)On a point of order, Madam Speaker. My point of order arises from your 25 statement, which will be very much welcomed in Wales, and I hope that we can avoid the confusion of last Wednesday. It has been suggested that Members representing constituencies in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland should no longer vote on matters affecting England only and that the House would act as an English Parliament on certain occasions. You will recall that we were all elected as representatives of the United Kingdom. Could you give some guidance, now or possibly in the future, on what the conduct of Members of Parliament should be when matters affecting England only come before the house?
§ Madam SpeakerI expect all Members who have been elected to the House to participate in all the procedures of the house. Whether that means going into the Lobby or not is up to them. It is not for me to determine whether Members should vote, but as far as I am concerned, they certainly have the right, the privilege and the responsibility so to do.
§ Sir Peter Emery (East Devon)On a point of order, Madam Speaker. I am sorry to return to this matter for a moment, but it is of considerable importance. The Northern Ireland Bill has been presented, but its Second Reading is not until tomorrow, when all stages will be taken. May we have the assurance that you, or whoever is in the Chair, will ensure that manuscript amendments will be accepted by the Clerks at the Table? That is imperative. Members may wish to amend the Bill, even if there has been agreement on it between those on the two Front Benches.
§ Madam SpeakerI am very tolerant of such things, but that is a matter for the Chair. When the amendments come in, I shall certainly look at them and be as helpful as I can.
§ Mr. Gerald howarthFurther to that point of order, Madam Speaker. Whatever the precedent may have been, is it not unsatisfactory in terms of the proceedings of this House—quite apart from the time scale involved—for the Government to have presented a Bill that is not yet in its final form? Surely the time has come for Bills to be presented to the House in a form that the House can debate.
§ Madam SpeakerI have already indicated to the House that that is not a disorderly practice. Other Governments have presented Bills in a similar way. If there is a strong feeling among Members about Bills being ready when they are presented for First Reading, that is a matter for the Procedure Committee.