Sheep (Hansard, 10 July 1986)

§ 1. Mr. Kennedy
asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he is yet in a position to announce details of compensation for farmers affected by the recent controls on the movement and slaughter of sheep; and if he will make a statement.

§ 5. Mr. Ray Powell
asked the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food when he expects to consider the payment of compensation to sheep farmers who have suffered losses as a result of the measures announced on 20 June.

§ The Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Mr. Michael Jopling)
My colleagues and I have had discussions with the farmers unions on the compensation issue. We have agreed that, as yet, it is too early to assess the overall impact on producers of the restrictions, since that will depend upon the relationship between the length of time the restrictions are in operation and the individual farmer's marketing patterns. In this connection, I am happy to announce that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Wales and I have today signed another order to come into effect at midnight to release a further area of Cumbria from the restrictions. I understand that he will be making a similar announcement today, in relation to further areas in Wales. These releases are based on the results of intensive monitoring, which is continuing. Full details of the area, and the results of latest tests, are being published today and a copy is being placed in the Library of the House.

§ Mr. Kennedy
In thanking the Minister for that informative reply, may I stress to him that in my constituency in Easter Ross, which obviously and understandably will not be covered by the decisions that he is making today, we have the continuing difficulties of last year's bad weather, a 75 per cent. fall in farm incomes and, within the past 48 hours, confirmation from Lord Gray of a further increase in Scottish farming indebtedness to the banks of 9 per cent.? Given those difficulties, and appreciating what the Minister said, may I urge him to take all possible steps as arid when sufficient evidence becomes available to help compensate those farmers, who are already suffering badly at the margins and who will be plunged even further into indebtedness, because the survival of the whole rural economy in the highlands of Scotland is dependent on their well being? Can the Minister give us that undertaking?

§ Mr. Jopling
I have listened to the hon. Gentleman. Many of his points are matters for my right hon. arid learned Friend the Secretary of State for Scotland. I remind him that I said on 20 June that we were prepared to discuss cases of compensation for severe loss in particular circumstances to specific farmers. That undertaking still stands.

§ Mr. Powell
That is not all that helpful to farmers. Recently we have also had discussions with the farmers union, and the farmers want to know the Government's criteria on compensation. When will the Government 431 make a statement on that? Is the Minister suggesting that the Secretary of State for Wales may be making that statement somewhere else, because he should be present on the Front Bench if it is a measure affecting Wales? Is the Minister aware that in Wales the scare is so great that a butcher in Monmouth must use a geiger counter to sell lamb in his shop? Is it not time that the Government came clean and told farmers how they will compensate them and the criteria that they will lay down?

§ Mr. Jopling
The hon. Gentleman should be a little careful before he starts making irresponsible statements of that sort. Questions today are for my Department and not for the Welsh Office. I shall repeat to him—he probably was not listening when I said it earlier—that the leaders of the farmers unions in England and Wales have recognised that until more data are available it is not possible to consider the compensation question in detail. I accept the importance that they attach to early decisions as soon as sufficient data are available.

§ Mrs. Kellett-Bowman
Will my right hon. Friend accept that we appreciate that he is concerned about the serious economic plight of many farmers in our part of the world? Will he deplore, as he did partly in his answer, the scaremongering that may lead people to cease to buy lamb which is perfectly safe? Will he continue to press the Russians, who are responsible for this disaster, to cough up some cash?

§ Mr. Jopling
I am glad that my hon. Friend has drawn attention to the perfect safety of consuming sheepmeat at this time. I believe that the British housewife has demonstrated that clearly because the market price for lamb, both last week and, as we forecast, this week, is rather higher than it was in the corresponding weeks last year. With regard to the points my hon. Friend made about the Russians, I warned Mr. Murakhousky when he was here last week of concern about the impact of the Chernobyl disaster on our agriculture. Of course, any matter of claims is one for the Foreign Office, and not for me.

§ Mr. Nicholas Winterton
Will my right hon. Friend accept that I am reassured by the fact that he admits that compensation is needed? However, in addition to the sheep farmers, haulage contractors and auction markets have suffered a fairly dramatic drop in their income. Will their position also be considered? Will he confirm to the House, as I had hoped my right hon. Friend the Minister for Health would confirm, that there is no danger whatsoever to any man, woman or child in this country in eating sheepmeat?

§ Mr. Jopling
I can gladly confirm that there is no danger. With regard to the matter of abattoirs and markets, the undertaking that I gave to consider compensation was for specific farmers. One has to realise that abattoirs and markets were able, if they wished, to draw sheep from outside the areas in which the restrictions applied. With regard to compensation, I can only repeat what I said. We are prepared to discuss cases of compensation for severe loss in particular circumstances by specific farmers.

Mr. Mark Hughes
I am deeply disturbed by the right hon. Gentleman's comment that abattoirs can draw from elsewhere. The butchers and abattoirs in parts of north Wales cannot, without great loss, call from sources 432 elsewhere. They are as eligible to compensation as anyone else. Will they be considered, and will the right hon. Gentleman please ask that his right hon. and hon. Friends from the Welsh Office are present on such occasions?

§ Mr. Jopling
With regard to markets and abattoirs, I can only repeat the truth. Markets and abattoirs, even if they were within the restricted areas, were and are entitled to draw their livestock and sheepmeat from outside the area.

§ Mr. Home Robertson
We welcome the fact that the Minister has felt able to lift the ban in certain areas. The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office told me in a written reply on 1 July that the Government were reserving the right to press a claim against the Soviet Union for any losses, but does the Minister accept that farmers whose lambs have missed the market cannot possibly wait to press a claim through the International Court of Justice? The right hon. Gentleman gave a clear commitment on 20 June to the principle of paying compensation to people who had sustained losses, and he repeated that commitment today, but he appeard to be back-pedalling in a speech that he made to farmers at the Great Yorkshire show. Will the Government try to wriggle out of that commitment, or will they pay compensation where it is justified?

§ Mr. Jopling
The hon. Gentleman is putting words into my mouth. What I have done today is to repeat precisely the undertaking that I gave to the House on 20 June. Perhaps some newspapers misreported what I said at the Great Yorkshire show the day before yesterday. If the hon. Gentleman reads the Yorkshire Post, I think he will find that, in its customary way, it has got it right.