§ 7. Mr. Grantasked the Minister of Transport how many cases of sabotage have occurred on British Railways in the last year; how this compares with previous years; who has been responsible; and, in view of the dangers to the public involved, if he will give a general direction, in the public interest, to the British Railways Board to take action to reduce the number of such cases.
§ The Joint Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Transport (Mr. Stephen Swingler)We are informed by the British Railways Board that in 1964 some 6,300 instances were reported of acts apparently intended to disrupt or hinder the operation of the railway services; this compares with about 4,100 such cases in 1963; corresponding figures for earlier years are not available, From the evidence available it would seem that the majority of these acts were committed by juveniles of school age. The Board 422 is taking special measures to deal with the matter, and we do not consider that a general direction from my right hon. Friend would be appropriate.
§ Mr. GrantIs the Minister aware that these incidents are causing very grave anxiety and concern to railwaymen and to the traveling public alike, and that if they continue it will undoubtedly be infinitely safer to travel by air than by railway? In view of the rather disturbing indication that these are mostly coming from juveniles, does this not indicate a rather peculiar and alarming trend in our society, and would he cast his inquiries a little wider, perhaps by consulting his colleages the Home Secretary and the Secretary of State for Education and Science?
§ Mr. SwinglerThis is a very serious matter, and as a result of recent incidents considerable consultations have taken place between a number of Departments. It is a matter in which a wide number of people have responsibility and could help considerably. Special measures are being taken, but I think it will be appreciated by the House that we do not wish to give publicity to all these measures, because that might be self-defeating, but I can assure the hon. Gentleman that very urgent action and inquiry are going on.
§ Mr. ManuelIn connection with these incidents of sabotage and vandalism, and the great and growing concern now apparent among railwaymen and the railway trade union leadership, will my hon. Friend, in any discussions which are to take place, consult the trade unions and the railway workers in order to get the benefit of their experience?
§ Mr. SwinglerYes. My hon. Friend can rest assured that that will be done. We require the co-operation of all concerned in trying to diagnose this problem and to take proper measures of action to solve it. The House will know that there is a Bill before Parliament promoted by the Railways Board to increase the penalties for trespassing, stone throwing, and so on. That is an example of the kind of action being taken.
§ Mr. ChannonCan the hon. Gentleman give an assurance that, apart from the consultations he has mentioned he 423 is having with his colleagues, he will keep in touch with the Home Office, because it has a very important part to play?
§ Mr. SwinglerYes, the review of the penalties is going on. It is part of the action being taken. A considerable number of prosecutions have taken place in the last few weeks, and nearly 600 last year. We are reviewing the whole of the situation.
§ Mr. LubbockHas the hon. Gentleman any statistics relating to this type of offence in the current year, and do those statistics show that the measures to which he has referred are having any effect already?
§ Mr. SwinglerI have not got fully up-to-date figures for the current year, but I regret to say that so far as we know the number of incidents is at any rate at the same rate as occurred last year.