HC Deb 03 July 1947 vol 439 cc1505-8
65. Mr. John Foster

asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether, having regard to the police evidence in the recent case at the Old Bailey, resulting in the conviction of a Maltese, called Messina, for unlawful wounding, to the effect that Messina was closely associated with prostitutes in the West End of London, and that the case had arisen out of a dispute between rival gangs engaged in the white slave trade, he will appoint a commission to make inquiries into the existence of organized vice in London with a view to its suppression.

Mr. Ede

I do not think that the appointment of a commission of inquiry would be of assistance in this matter. It is a criminal offence knowingly to live on the earnings of prostitution, and the police exercise all possible vigilance with a view to the suppression of activities of this kind. An inquiry would not help the police because their difficulties arise from the fact that though they may have good reason to suspect such activities, they are sometimes unable to obtain evidence upon which criminal proceedings could be based.

Mr. Foster

Is it not possible to appoint a commission which could call for bank accounts and other evidence to prove the existence of organised vice? Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the Messina brothers are supposed to have made about £500,000 out of this vice, that they own a firm of West End estate agents and shares in an important restaurant, and have no less than 20 girls working for them? Is he further aware that one of the girls averaged £3,000 a year during the war?

Mr. Ede

I have seen some information in regard to the other activities of these people. I do not think a commission which could be appointed to inquire into these matters could call for the bank accounts of people other than those who had been convicted of the offence. I do not think one can appoint a Royal Commission to hold a roving inquiry into bank balances, much as I should like to do so in regard to some people.

Mr. Foster

Is the Home Secretary aware that the Act—I think it is called the Tribunal Evidence Act—exists, under which the activities of Mr. J. H. Thomas in connection with the Budget were investigated, and that it gives power to call for all books and documents?

Mr. Eder

There must be some grounds for calling for a particular book or document. If we had sufficient evidence to justify calling for such a book or document under the Act mentioned, I suspect that we should have sufficient evidence to prosecute under the existing law.

Squadron-Leader Fleming

Is the Home Secretary satisfied that the punishment for such an offence is sufficient, in view of the fact that this man, after serving three years will come out and live on the illegal gains of this immoral life?

Mr. Ede

The question of the punishment inflicted is a matter for the courts. The full penalty was not imposed in this case, and one must imagine that the judge —I think it was the Common Serjeant-presiding at the trial thought that he had inflicted an appropriate penalty for the offence.

Mr. James Callaghan

Is the Home Secretary aware that Maltese residents deplore the emphasis placed on the country of origin of these wretched men? Is he aware that a large number of decent citizens of Malta consider that they are prejudiced by this undue emphasis?

Earl Winterton

On a point of Order. Am I not right in saying that no decision of a court can be criticised? Is not the previous supplementary question a criticism of the courts?

Mr. Speaker

It is not criticism of the court, but of the sentence.

Mr. Ede

In regard to the point raised by my hon. Friend the Member for South Cardiff (Mr. Callaghan), I think it is regrettable that undue emphasis should be placed, in certain quarters, on the fact that these men happened to have been Maltese. I hope that it will not be taken as a reflection on those of Maltese origin residing in this country.

Mr. Derek Walker-Smith

Whatever the merits of a Commission, would not the Home Secretary recognise that it shows a very unsatisfactory state of the enforcement of the law that this man was brought to trial on a charge of unlawful wounding and not on a charge of living on immoral earnings, which he had been practising so successfully for so long?

Mr. Ede

That was the case on which we obtained the evidence on which a prosecution could be based. The figures given in the Press with regard to what he made out of prostitution, by no means agree with the facts as known to the police.

Earl Winterton

On a point of Order. Do I understand, Mr. Speaker, your Ruling to be that it is possible to discuss by way of Question and answer or in Debate a sentence given by a judge in a court of law investigation?

Mr. Speaker

Certainly, I think it is.? That has always been the case. Hon. Members can always protest where they consider there has been too heavy or too lenient a sentence.

Wing-Commander Hulbert

Is it not a fact that there is an appeal pending in this case?

Earl Winterton

That is my point.

Mr. Speaker

If there is an appeal then the matter is sub judice.

Mr. Wilkes

Can the Home Secretary say whether there are any powers exist- ing at present which would allow him to impound or confiscate the bank balances of people found guilty of such offences, and, if not, is it his intention to ask for such powers?

Mr. Ede

I would like notice of that question.