HC Deb 11 November 1884 vol 293 cc1458-61
MR. GLADSTONE

In pursuance, Sir, of an engagement which I entered into yesterday, in reply to a Question put to me by the right hon. Baronet the Member for North Devon (Sir Stafford Northcote), I wish to refer to the proceedings which we propose in Supply, and also with regard to Lord Northbrook's Mission. With regard to Supply I partially answered the Question last night—that when we get through the Franchise Bill we shall proceed with Supply. We now propose to take Supply on Thursday, and the necessary Notice of the Supplementary Estimates which will then be moved will be laid on the Table. As far as we are concerned, we shall proceed with respect to them as we should proceed with respect to other Supplementary Estimates, and move them in the same way. It is our intention also to be prepared to proceed on Friday if we are able, but we do not intend on Friday next to interfere with the Friday Rule. Should it be necessary, however, to do anything to expedite financial business, we shall not hesitate to make a proposal on the subject. With regard to Lord Northbrook's Mission, his Report, properly so called, is not yet in form; but his Colleagues are sufficiently cognizant of his general plans to take them into consideration, which they will do, and on some day in the coming week I hope to state to the House the course that we propose.

SIR MICHAEL HICKS-BEACH

I understand that it is in the contemplation of the Government to propose a Vote for Sir Charles Warren's Expedition to Bechuanaland. If that is so, I would express a hope that before the Vote is proposed to the House we may be furnished with the instructions given to Sir Charles Warren. There have been rumours on that subject of a very grave nature, and I think the House ought to have them.

MR. GLADSTONE

I shall see that that matter is considered. I was not aware there was any question on the subject.

MR. JOSEPH COWEN

I would like to ask the Prime Minister if he contemplates the House taking any other Business during the Autumn Session save that which arises out of the Franchise Bill and the Votes for South Africa and the Nile Expedition, and the discussion on Lord Northbrook's proposals?

MR. GLADSTONE

There has been no change in the general intention of the Government, which was to make this Autumn meeting subservient, as far as they could, to purposes connected with the Franchise Bill. Then there has arisen the necessity in connection with the Expedition up the Nile and the military preparations having reference to Bechuanaland. That, of course, the Government must take upon themselves, and whatever grows naturally out of it. The hon. Gentleman has referred to the discussion upon Lord Northbrook's Report under his commission. With respect to that matter the Government have nothing to propose to Parliament at the present moment. I have already said that we shall be prepared to refer to the matter next week. With respect to anything beyond, I think our understanding was this—that the Government did not contemplate at this Autumn meeting—did not consider this Autumn meeting the proper time, or would last sufficiently long, for the prosecution of the general legislation of the year. That proposition we adhere to. At the same time, it will be readily understood that occasionally subjects arise with regard to which there may be some peculiar pressure, and the scope of which is not of any great extent, on which, if the Government see cause, they may make an exception. There is, for instance, the subject referred to at the close of last Session—the federation of the Australian Colonies. Undoubtedly, as regards the general Business, our views are as already stated; and I should say in the exceptions I have made, and for which I have left the door open, I spoke of Business which, besides being small in character, is what may be called of a non-contentious nature.

SIR JOHN HAY

I hope the Navy is not going to be neglected.

MR. GLADSTONE

There is a pledge that a Government statement shall be made on that subject, which pledge holds good. I am obliged to the right hon. and gallant Gentleman for mentioning the matter.

SIR STAFFORD NORTHCOTE

There is an expression of the Prime Minister which I do not quite understand. Speaking of Lord Northbrook's Report, the right hon. Gentleman said there was no proposal which the Government would have to make. ["No, no!"] That is just what wants clearing up. The right hon. Gentleman said he would give us some information; and I should wish to know whether he means that the Government do not at this moment contemplate calling attention to Lord Northbrook's Report, or whether, having considered it, it would not be necessary to make any proposals at all? If he contemplates having proposals to make hereafter, we should be glad to know when we shall be furnished with any Papers on the subject; and also whether we shall have further Papers as to the Expedition up the Nile?

MR. GLADSTONE

As regards the Expedition up the Nile, I am not in a condition to answer. I am not aware that there are such Papers. The right hon. Gentleman has made reference to Lord Northbrook's Mission, the allusion to which arose out of the Question of my hon. Friend (Mr. J. Cowen). This Question assumes that the Government would have something to propose; and all I wished to convey was that that assumption was premature. I do not mean to convey either that we had or had not anything to propose. My intention was, as I have said, to state that the matter was under our consideration, and that I hoped to be able to announce the course we shall take. With regard to the Papers, I will bear in mind what has been said by the right hon. Gentleman.

SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL

As the Vote for the Soudan is to be laid on the Table this evening, and as there may be some delay on the part of the printers, perhaps the right hon. Gentleman will state what the amount will be?

MR. GLADSTONE

It is no part of my duty to deal with Votes in the nature of Supplementary Estimates. These are entirely under the charge of the Ministers of Departments; and as I believe there are a considerable number of Votes charged under different heads, I do not think it would be possible to enter upon particulars, nor do I think it would be convenient in anticipation of the Vote.