HC Deb 26 July 1883 vol 282 cc667-72
England:— £
Privy Seal Office
Woods, Forests, &c., Office of 1,800
Mercantile Marine Fund, Grant in Aid
Secret Service 1,800
Scotland:—
Exchequer and other Offices 600
Fishery Board 1,200
Lunacy Commission 300
Registrar General's Office 300
Board of Supervision 1,800
Ireland:—
Lord Lieutenant's Household 600
Chief Secretary's Office 3,600
Charitable Donations and Bequests Office 240
Local Government Board 30,000
Public Works Office 6,000
Record Office 600
Registrar General's Office 1,800
Valuation and Boundary Survey 2,400

CLASS III.—LAW AND JUSTICE.

England:—
Law Charges 3,000
Public Prosecutor's Office 240
Chancery Division, High Court of Justice 9,000
Central Office of the Supreme Court, &c 6,000
Probate, &c. Registries, High Court of Justice 3,000
Admiralty Registry, High Court of Justice 600
Wreck Commission 1,200
Bankruptcy Court (London) 3,600
Land Registry 600
Revising Barristers, England
Police Courts (London and Sheerness) 600
Metropolitan Police 60,000
County and Borough Police, Great Britain 600
Convict Establishments in England and the Colonies 30,000
Prisons, England 42,000
Broadmoor Criminal Lunatic Asylum 1,200
Scotland:—
Lord Advocate, and Criminal Proceedings 3,000
Courts of Law and Justice 6,000
Register House Departments 3,000
Prisons, Scotland 3,000
Ireland:—
Law Charges and Criminal Prosecutions 12,000
Supreme Court of Judicature 9,000
Court of Bankruptcy 900
Admiralty Court Registry 90
Registry of Deeds 1,800
Registry of Judgments 180
Land Commission 18,000
County Court Officers, &c. 9,000
Dublin Metropolitan Police (including Police Courts) 12,000
Constabulary 90,000
Prisons, Ireland 12,000
Reformatory and Industrial Schools
Dundrum Criminal Lunatic Asylum 300

CLASS IV.—EDUCATION, SCIENCE, AND ART.

England:—
Science and Art Department 24,000
National Gallery 2,400
National Portrait Gallery 180
Learned Societies, &c. 2,400
London University
Aberyswith College 600
Deep Sea Exploring Expedition (Report) 300
Transit of Venus, 1882
Scotland:—
Universities, &c. 1,200
National Gallery
Ireland:—
Public Education 18,000
Teachers' Pension Office 120
Endowed Schools Commissioners 60
National Gallery 360
Queen's Colleges
Royal Irish Academy

CLASS V.—FOREIGN AND COLONIAL SERVICES.

Suppression of the Slave Trade 900
Tonnage Bounties, &c. 900
Suez Canal (British Directors) 180
Colonies, Grants in Aid 3,000
South Africa and St. Helena 600
Subsidies to Telegraph Companies
Cyprus, Grants in Aid 25,000

CLASS VI.—NON-EFFECTIVE AND CHARI-TABLE SERVICES.

Superannuation and Retired Allowances 18,000
Merchant Seamen's Fund Pensions, &c. 600
Pauper Lunatics, England
Pauper Lunatics, Scotland 12,000
Pauper Lunatics, Ireland 6,000
Hospitals and Infirmaries, Ireland 1,200
Miscellaneous Charitable and other Allowances, Great Britain 900
Miscellaneous Charitable and other Allowances, Ireland 120

CLASS VII.—MISCELLANEOUS.

Temporary Commissions 600
Miscellaneous Expenses
Total for Civil Services £514,570

REVENUE DEPARTMENTS.

Customs 36,000
Inland Revenue 130,000
Post Office 280,000
Post Office Packet Service
Post Office Telegraphs 72,000
Total for Revenue Departments 518,000
Grand Total £1,032,570
SIR JOHN HAY

said, the Vote contained a number of items which deserved some attention. The first was the Privy Seal Office, which was particularly interesting to Scotland at this moment; £1,000 had already been granted, and there was a balance of £1,825. This item, he thought, deserved some explanation from the Government.

THE CHAIRMAN

The Privy Seal Office is not included.

SIR JOHN HAY

said, the Vote contained in the first line "Privy Seal Office."

THE CHAIRMAN

No money is taken for it. The money column is blank.

SIR JOHN HAY

said, he saw there was no amount set down; but it was stated that £1,000 had been granted, and it was as to the appropriation of that amount that he wished for an explanation. There was no amount put down; but the matter was before the Committee, by the statement that £1,000 had already been voted; and, as he understood, he had a right to ask a question of the Government with reference to the appropriation of that amount. They had been informed that there was no person holding this particular Office, and that the money voted for that purpose was to be devoted to local government in Scotland.

THE CHAIRMAN

The right hon. and gallant Baronet is in error. It is not proposed to vote any sum at this moment on account of the Privy Seal Office; and, therefore, the right lion. and gallant Baronet will be out of Order in discussing the Privy Seal Office, which was not included in any way.

SIR JOHN HAY

said, he should not dispute the Chairman's ruling; but he had always understood that when a sum had been voted, as in this case, remarks were allowed upon it, and that questions might be asked with reference to the appropriation of the money.

THE CHAIRMAN

The right hon. and gallant Baronet is in error. There is no sum in the Vote now for the Privy Seal Office, and the right hon. and gallant Baronet will not be in Order in discussing it.

MR. HEALY

asked the Chief Secretary for Ireland, whether, at that hour of the morning, he proposed to go on with the Police Bill? Nearly every item in this Vote was contested. There was the Lord Lieutenant's Household, the Chief Secretary's Household, the Local Government Board, the Public Works Board, the Land Commissioners, the Registrar General's Office, the Dublin Police, the Constabulary, Prisons and Reformatories, and other Votes; and upon all these, he, and his hon. Friends, wished to speak. As this was only a Vote on Account, they did not wish to give the Government too much trouble, and if the Government would postpone the Irish Police Bill, they would endeavour to meet the Government in the same spirit. They wished to know what was the substance of the extraordinary Bill which the Chief Secretary for Ireland proposed to bring in? But lie would suggest that the right hon. Gentleman should postpone the important statement he would have to make upon that Bill, to a more reasonable hour.

MR. TREVELYAN

said, the hon. Member for Monaghan (Mr. Healy) seemed to consider that he was making a concession in agreeing to pass the Vote on Account for the administration of several Offices in Ireland which were generally largely discussed; but he was not quite justified in drawing certain deductions in reference to the Motion which lie (Mr. Trevelyan) was about to make later. Even, at an earlier period of the Session, it was considered not only legitimate, but according to the Rules of the House, at any hour of the evening, to allow such Motions to be made, and he should be very unwilling to recognize the propriety of postponing this Motion upon any account. If the Bill he proposed to introduce was a Bill of enormous importance—one of the two or throe principal Bills of the Session—he could imagine that hon. Members might object to giving leave to introduce it at that hour; but it was a Bill which, however important, was still very moderate in bulk and compass. He could explain, in a few sentences, the nature of the Bill; and, according to the Rules of the House, although it was not technically a Money Bill, it could be taken for second reading after half-past 12, and, therefore, hon. Members would have an opportunity of discussing it. Certainly, at that period of the Session, lie should be very unwilling to forego the right to ask leave to introduce the Bill, even at that hour of the evening; and if the hon. Member wished for in- formation upon it now, he should be glad to give it.

MR. O'BRIEN

said, he was sorry the right hon. Gentleman had not seen his way to making a more satisfactory reply to the hon. Member for Monaghan (Mr. Healy), and he objected to the Committee being asked to go on with a Bill, at that hour of the night, which would make radical and permanent changes in the whole police system of Ireland.

THE CHAIRMAN

I must point out that the whole conversation is irregular. I did not like to stop the hon. Member for Monaghan (Mr. Healy); but it is quite out of Order, upon this Vote, to enter into a discussion upon a Motion which is down later on the Paper. Any remarks made must be on the Vote now before the Committee.

MR. HEALY

rose to Order, and said, that, although it was not competent to the. Committee to discuss a Bill still to come before the House, he thought it was competent to them to discuss a Vote for the Constabulary, and, therefore, it was open to his hon. Friend to make remarks with reference to the Constabulary.

THE CHAIRMAN

That would be perfectly in Order; but I understood the hon. Member to be discussing the provisions of a Bill not before the House.

MR. O'BRIEN

said, he would net continuo the discussion further than to say that he understood it was probable that this matter might occupy considerable time; and, under those circumstances, he hoped the right hon. Gentleman the Chief Secretary for Ireland would not ask leave to bring in the Bill that night, but would endeavour to bring it in to-morrow.

Vote agreed to.

House resumed.

Resolutions to be reported To-morrow, at Two of the clock.

Committee to sit again To-morrow.