HC Deb 16 April 1878 vol 239 cc1413-6

Order for Consideration, as amended, read.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Bill be now taken into Consideration."—(Mr. Raikes.)

MR. PARNELL

in, rising to move— That it is unjust and inexpedient to adopt a method of Imperial Taxation of the United Kingdom which presses more severely on Ireland than on Great Britain, reviewed the position of Ireland as compared with England at the time of the Union, and showed that the problem presented to the English statesmen after the Union was how best that Union could be continued without loss to the Imperial Exchequer; and, indeed, they went beyond that, and endeavoured to make a pecuniary profit out of the transaction. The result, of course, was, that Ireland was compelled from that day to this, to pay a large proportion to the Revenue, and this taxation was raised chiefly from the very poorest classes. The objection now was, and for years had been, that Ireland contributed to the Revenue for Imperial purposes about £8,000,000 out of £78,000,000 or £80,000,000; while she received back in advances for general purposes a very small proportion. It was seen that the ordinary sources of Revenue were in Ireland but scanty, by reason of the absence of that large middle and upper class upon which in England the Revenue could rely. In Ireland were to be found an impoverished people, who, by indirect taxation, could not be expected to return any Revenue worth speaking of. So the various Chancellors of the Exchequer had to consider how this state of affairs could be met, and Ireland remain without being a loss to the Exchequer. Owing to the habits and tastes of the Irish people, it was considered that the only way to raise Revenue was to increase the tax upon spirits, and the result had verified the experiment; and, while in England, taxation was distributed so as to affect all classes with something like equality, in Ireland, the effect was that taxation struck most heavily upon the poorer classes. On looking over the Returns of the amount of duty paid on different articles consumed in the Kingdom, he found that the Revenue paid by Ireland upon spirits was somewhere about £3,500,000, and the Revenue on tobacco was over £1,000,000. In preparing his recent Budget, it appeared that the Chancellor of the Exchequer one time contemplated increasing the spirit duty; but, finding that that was already so high that an increase would probably result in a loss to the Revenue instead of a gain, he came to the conclusion to increase the tobacco duty instead. But it happened that that also pressed most heavily upon the poorer classes, more especially from the way in which it was levied. A large increase in the burden would be placed on the shoulders of those who had no representation in the House; and, therefore, it was the more incumbent upon the House to weigh well the method of imposing the taxation, and to consider if it was just and reasonable. From a speech made in 1875 by the hon. Member for Youghal (Sir Joseph M'Kenna), it appeared that the incomes in Ireland subject to the income tax amounted to £26,572,707, and that the incomes of Great Britain subject to the tax were £455,765,610. Taking these figures was a fair way to estimate the taxpaying abilities of the two countries, and, judged by that test, it was shown that the taxpaying power of Ireland was one-seventeenth of that of Great Britain; but, when he came to the contributions to the Imperial Revenue, he found that Ireland contributed one-eighth of that of Great Britain, or twice as much as she ought to pay. Under a fair and just system of taxation, Ireland's contribution would be £4,000,000. Further statistics went to show that, from 1841 to 1871, the taxation per head of the population throughout England had been reduced from £2 9s. 2d. to £2 4s. 1d.; although England during that period had increased in riches by the developing of her mines, manufactures, and commerce, to an extraordinary extent. On the other hand, in Ireland, taxation had increased from 9s. 6d. per head to £1 6s. 2d. per head in the same time. In 1841, Ireland had not gone through the Famine; but that Famine came, and showed the deplorable state in which the country was. One and a-half millions of people were swept away, besides the numbers of people who emigrated. No doubt, Ireland had made some progress since then; but it was progress from a state of absolute poverty, and not a progress towards prosperity—in spite of the statistics, drawn up by order of the Castle at Dublin, held up to the admiration of the country, and the extravagant eulogies of the Lords Lieutenant at civic banquets. Thus, the taxation in England during the years he had mentioned, had been reduced 10 per cent, and in Ireland it had been increased nearly 300 per cent.; and this had been done chiefly by raising the spirit duties from 2s. to 10s. In England, however, financial movers had been careful not to raise the taxation among the poorer classes. Spanish and Portuguese wines paid 6s. and French wines 4s. for every gallon of proof spirit contained; but these were not consumed by the poorer class, who, upon beer, paid 2s. per gallon of spirit. He did not advocate a reduction of the spirit duty, but rather that ale and porter, and also all foreign wines, should pay duty at the same rate according to their alcoholic strength. This was not a proposition in which a tendency to promote drunkenness could be found; but, on the contrary, it would assist the cause of temperance, while it equalized the incidence of taxation, which experience had shown to be unfair to Ireland and Scotland. When the time arrived, as he hoped it would arrive, when the duties on alcoholic liquors were equalized, then, if a Chancellor of the Exchequer found he had an excess of Revenue, he might proceed to lower the duties all round. It might be said that that would increase drunkenness, and, undoubtedly, in Ireland, that was a great evil; but it was found by statistics that temperance had not decreased since 1841, or that the consumption per head among the population had diminished with the increase of taxation. Indeed, so far from temperance being promoted, the people had suffered from the deterioration in the quality of spirits supplied to them. A trade, alarming both to the health of the people and the Revenue, had sprung up in "silent spirit," manufactured in Scotland and in Germany from refuse of all kinds. This spirit was used for blending, and it was of an intensely poisonous character, though tasteless. Nine or 10 gallons of this, at about 1s. 6d. or 2s. a-gallon, added to a gallon of pure Irish whiskey, was about the proportion used, and, when sold, it was impossible to detect the adulteration except by the result upon the unfortunate consumers. By this means, the Revenue was to some extent defrauded, and the reputation of Irish whiskey materially suffered.

It being ten minutes before Seven of the clock, the Debate stood adjourned till this day.

The House suspended its Sitting at five minutes to Seven of the clock.

The House resumed its Sitting at Nine of the clock.