§ MR. MITCHELL HENRYI wish, Sir, to bring under your notice a matter connected with the order of our proceedings. The First Order of the Day relates to a discussion which is likely to become annual in the House with reference to the Contagious Diseases Acts. The discussion of that question involves painful and repulsive details, insomuch that three years ago an hon. Gentleman, no longer a Member of this House, in the exercise of his right, called your attention to the presence of Strangers. The House was cleared, and the doors were closed against all except Members and persons officially connected with the House. I do not think that such a course, if pursued now, would be in accordance with public opinion. But I believe that there are very few persons, whether in this House or out of it, who will not be of opinion that there are two classes of the community—namely, women and children—who had better be absent during this discussion. I would respectfully ask you, Sir, whether it is in your power, if you find it to be in accordance with the feelings of the 1553 House and with your own desire, to close the Ladies' Gallery to-day. I think it is unfair to those Members of the House who have to take part in the discussion to subject them to an influence which cannot but be of a painful character. We are accustomed to abstain from or approach the discussion of a question like this with almost sacred delicacy, and I defy any hon. Member, unless his constitution be very peculiar, to discuss the details of the Contagious Diseases Act in the presence of ladies without great dismay and apprehension. There is another class of person, who, I think, ought to be protected—I mean ladies who may have come up from the country or elsewhere and sought admission to the Gallery without having the slightest notion as to what subject was to be discussed. Therefore, Sir, I would respectfully ask you whether you will, in the exercise of your authority, direct the Sergeant-at-Arms to pursue the course which is adopted by Judges at Assizes when indelicate cases are for trial, when women and children are ordered out of Court. In order to give other hon. Members an opportunity of expressing their opinions on the subject I move that the House do now adjourn.
§ SIR ALEXANDER GORDONseconded the Motion.
§ Motion made, and Question proposed, "That this House do now adjourn."—(Mr. Mitchell Henry.)
§ MR. SPEAKERI may state for the information of the House that there are two Galleries of this House appropriated to the use of ladies. One of these is under my direct control, and having regard to the subject-matter of the First Order of the Day I have directed that Gallery to be closed. With regard to the other Gallery, as the House is aware, it is available for the use of the friends of Members, under the orders of Members in the usual manner. I have not felt myself at liberty to close that Gallery; but I have desired the messenger in attendance to inform all ladies who may present themselves there of the nature of the subject about to be discussed. If after that caution they think proper to insist upon admittance, I do not feel at liberty, without the authority of the House, to exclude them. With regard to the admission of children, I may state 1554 that last year I desired that some youths should be excluded from the Gallery, and this year I have desired that they shall not be admitted.
§ MR. CALLANI would ask the hon. Member to withdraw his Motion in order that I may present the matter in a different form. I think the course adopted some years ago would be endorsed by public opinion. Therefore, exercising the right vested in me as a Member of the House, I beg to inform Mr. Speaker that I espy Strangers in the House.
§ Notice taken that Strangers are present.
§ MR. SPEAKERI wish to point out to the hon. Member before I act upon his notice that if Strangers are excluded from the House this will not affect ladies, because the Ladies' Gallery is not supposed to be within the House. Of course, if after that intimation the hon. Member persists in calling my attention to the presence of Strangers it will be my duty to act upon the notice.
§ MR. SWANSTONdesired to explain that when, a week ago, he put down his name for an admission to the Ladies' Gallery he did not know what subject was to be brought forward for discussion on the present occasion. When he found what it was, he struck his name off and gave notice to the ladies, who were strangers to him, that they would not be admitted. He was glad that in doing this he had anticipated the Speaker's directions.
§ MR. P. A. TAYLORI think you, Sir, have taken the right course in notifying to the ladies the nature of the discussion, so that if they do not wish to hear it they may have the option of withdrawing. Further than that, I think the House would be wrong in expressing an opinion as to the fitness of the admission of any person of full age of either sex who wished to hear the discussion. I submit the ladies themselves are the best judges of the propriety of remaining. The fact that the Bill itself relates to women is too often ignored. There is nothing immoral, nothing necessarily prurient in this discussion. The analogy, therefore, that has been made as to the exclusion of women from a court of justice when an indelicate case is tried, is no analogy at all. Women, unfortunately, are the subjects of the legislation to be discussed 1555 to-day, and is the House going to say that women are not to feel an interest in what concerns their own sex, and are not to form their own opinion after listening to a debate on a subject so deeply interesting to them? I think the dignified and proper course is to allow women to be the best judges whether they will remain or not. There are many of them who have taken great interest in this matter. There is one gentle lady, the wife of a clergyman in Liverpool, who has spent her life in attempting to relieve the sufferings and to redeem the character of unfortunate women. The real evil consists in the immorality of these Acts, and those women who have come forward to save their sisters from these Acts should surely not be debarred from hearing the question discussed.
§ MR. MITCHELL HENRYAs at present advised, I shall deem it my duty to go to a division. I may be permitted to remark that ladies do not take part in these debates, and are present, therefore, only from curiosity. They can read the discussion afterwards; but Members are placed in a very embarrassing position by the presence of ladies.
§ MR. CALLANthought it preferable that a few ladies should hear the discussion than that reporters should be present to report it. Then hon. Members had held out that ladies would be able to read the discussion afterwards—but he had that confidence in the Press that if the reporters were allowed to remain they would not report the debate, and therefore he again brought under Mr. Speaker's notice that he espied Strangers in the House.
§ MR. SPEAKERreminded the House of the Resolution of the 31st May 1875, and stated that he had, on a previous occasion during the present Session, explained that he considered himself bound to follow the practice prescribed by that Resolution, until otherwise instructed by the House; and that as no such instruction had since been given, he should proceed to put the Question, in pursuance of that Resolution.
§ And Mr. Speakerforthwith put the Question, "That Strangers be ordered to withdraw;" and it passed in the Negative.
§ MR. MITCHELL HENRYsaid, he had gathered from the tone of the House on this Question, that it was not in accordance with their wish that he should press his Motion for the adjournment of the House, and after the remarks made by the Speaker he begged leave to withdraw it.
§ Original Motion, by leave, withdrawn.