HC Deb 05 March 1845 vol 78 cc364-7

On the Order of the Day for the third reading of this Bill having been read,

Mr. Bouverie

said, that the same arguments which had been used with respect to the Income Tax, appeared to have been applied to this Bill; namely, that because it was to be of a temporary character it was not necessary to make it perfect. He could not concur in that argument, for his opinion was, that a Bill imposing taxes, like any other subject of legislation, ought to be made as little onerous to the public as possible. The subject to which he wished to call the attention of the House was a Bill arranging Stamp Duties in Ireland—a Bill which was unequal in its principle, and prejudicial in its operation. Before the English Stamp Acts were extended to Ireland, the Stamp Duties were comparatively light in that country; and he would now call the attention of the right hon. Baronet to the provisions of the Act which it was proposed temporarily to extend to Ireland. In the first place he would remark, that the only just principle which could be extended to the tax upon the transfer of property was, that the amount of the tax should bear a fair and equal proportion to the amount of property transferred. If they looked, however, to the Act 55th George III., the pro- visions of which this Act continued, they would find that instead of the amount of duty bearing a proportion to the amount of property transferred, it was based on a contrary principle, and was imposed in a diminishing ratio to the amount of property to be transferred. He would, in the first place, refer them to the duty on bonds, which they must perceive would fully bear out the character that he had given of the Act. The duty on a bond not exceeding 50l. was 1l. or 2 per cent.; on a bond not exceeding 100l. was 1l. 10s., or 1½ per cent.; 200l. was 2l., or 1 per cent.; on 300l. the duty was 3l., or 1 per cent.; on a bond not exceeding 500l. it was 4l., and it thus went on in a diminishing ratio until it came to 15,000l., and 20,000l., the rate of taxation on bonds for those amounts being 1–10th per cent. only. They had thus imposed a duty of 2½ per cent. on the small bonds, which were used in a great number of transactions, whilst on bonds for such an amount as 20,000l. the duty was no more than 1–10th per cent. With regard to conveyances the same principle was applied, the duty on an amount not exceeding 20l. being 2½ per cent., that on an amount not exceeding 50l. was 2 per cent., and it went on diminishing until the duty on large amounts became so low as seven-eighths, eleven-twelfths, or eight-tenths. With respect to mortgages, likewise, the same principle was observed in imposing the duty; a mortgage for a sum not exceeding 50l. being subject to a duty of 2 percent., for a sum not exceeding 100l. 1½ per cent., whilst a mortgage for 20,000l. paid but l–10th per cent.; and there was a fixed duty on mortgages for all sums exceeding that amount, so that it appeared the greater the amount the less in proportion was the duty. To leave the duty on mortgages for great amounts fifty times less than that on mortgages for small amounts was a gross inequality, and it ought to be remedied. His objections, as regarded the inequality of the proportion, would apply to the Stamp Duties in England as well as in Ireland; but there were circumstances connected with the social condition of Ireland which made it particularly desirable that there should be a great relaxation, if not an entire remission, of those objectionable duties. One of the great objects which they should constantly have in view in connexion with the preservation of tranquillity in Ireland, and the improvement of the country, was that persons should be enabled to obtain small portions of land as permanent property at as cheap a rate as possible; but the Stamp Duties which it was now proposed to continue for a temporary period in Ireland imposed a tax on the person who bought a small quantity of land twenty or thirty times greater than that which was imposed on large transfers of property. It was a very great object in the amelioration of the condition of Ireland that a class of small proprietors should be encouraged, and it could not, therefore, be looked upon as a wise principle to place a greater tax on the small purchases, in proportion, than that which was placed on the transactions involving large transfers of property. Their desire ought to be to encourage persons in obtaining small quantities of land, but this tax had a strong and obvious tendency to prevent that. The principle on which those duties were based was contrary to the just and true principles of taxation, and he thought there were few subjects to which Her Majesty's Government could direct their attention with more beneficial effect.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer

said, that if he followed the hon. Member, he feared he should be obliged to open up the whole question of the proportion which those duties bore to property in this country as well as Ireland. He would not deny that there were some amongst the Stamp Duties which required consideration; but he could assure the hon. Member that so far as the duties affecting the transfer of land were concerned, he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had not forgotten the subject of purchases of smart quantities of land in Ireland when he was about to introduce the Bill for the assimilation of the Stamp Duties. When he proposed to assimilate the English and Irish Stamp Duties, he made an exception in favour of land in Ireland. He had applied that exception in the way in which he believed it would be most advantageous to Ireland; for he was aware that the tenure of land in small quantities in Ireland was usually on lives for a term of years. With reference to the general arguments of the hon. Gentleman, he should remark that those duties were imposed upon Ireland as a substitute for the Property Tax.

Viscount Ebrington

said, that the paucity of small freeholders in fee in Ireland had been noticed by him as productive of diffi- culty in the government of that country; and he thought that every facility ought to be afforded by the Chancellor of the Exchequer to the establishment of such tenements. Such a class of proprietors would be a great advantage to the country.

Bill read a third time.

House adjourned at half-past nine o'clock.