HC Deb 20 January 1840 vol 51 cc238-44

—The Speaker acquainted the House that the House had attended her Majesty with the Address voted on Thursday last, and her Majesty had been pleased to reply in the following gracious terms:— I received with very great satisfaction your loyal and affectionate Address, upon an occasion so deeply affecting the happiness of my future life. I thank you for your support and concurrence in my resolution, arid I am much gratified by the opinion which you have expressed of the prince, and which I am confident he will justify. I thank you for your assurance that you will concur in the measures which may be necessary to provide for such an establishment as may be suitable to the rank of the Prince and the dignity of the Crown. I shall anxiously endeavour lo make my reign conducive to the happiness of all classes of my people.

Sir Edward Knatchhull

hoped he should not be considered out of order in requesting for very few moments the attention of the House, and more especially of the noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) opposite, and the other Members of the Government, whilst he made two or three observations in reference to the presentation of the Address of her Majesty. He was one of those who had that day, perhaps accidentally, certainly very unintentionally, been prevented from doing that, which, in the peculiar circumstances in which the House and the Crown were then placed, it was highly desirable they should do—he had been prevented from attending the House with the Address to her Majesty in reply to her Majesty's most gracious speech from the throne. He did know that the House was to wait upon her Majesty for that purpose that day; and it was the view of calling the attention of the House to this circumstance, which at all times must be considered important, and was certainly especially so upon the present occasion, that he ventured to intrude for a few moments on the indulgence of the House. The speech was delivered in the usual manner from the throne, and the House did that which he trusted it always would do—agreed to a proper and respectful Address in reply. On bringing up the report of the Address, the House came to this resolution—"Address to be presented by the whole House. Privy Councillors humbly to know her Majesty's pleasure when she will be attended." He took it for granted according to the usual practice of the House, that a return should be made lo the Address, in order that the Mouse might know at what time her Majesty might be pleased to receive it. He did not find from the orders of the House, that any return of that kind had been made. It must therefore follow, that any information that Members might obtain, as to the period at which the Address was to be presented, could not be gained from the votes, the source from which alone they could be duly and properly informed. He understood that the House had that day been up with the Address; and he complained that he had been placed in a position of total ignorance as to the period at which it would be her Majesty's pleasure to receive it. No intimation had been made to the House as to the day, or the hour, at which, in compliance with her Majesty's command, the Address should be presented. How this had happened, he could not undertake to say; but he apprehended that the noble Lord would feel it incumbent upon him to offer some explanation to the House upon the subject. He might perhaps be told that what had happened nowwasin the usual course of proceeding, and that no such complaint as that which he now made had ever before been offered. He was not prepared to deny that a similar course of proceeding had been pursued on previous occasions; but he came forward to complain of it in the present instance for this reason—that it had been circulated throughout the town—that the Address was taken up to her Majesty that day by the Government and those Members of the House who sat on the ministerial side, and that none of those who sat on the opposition had attended. It was for the purpose of contradicting the inference that might be drawn from such a statement that he (Sir E. Knatchbull) felt it incumbent upon him to rise in his place in that House, and declare, that he and those who occupied the opposition benches, yielded to no men in a firm and sincere attachment to the throne. Had it not been for the imputation so unjustly cast upon a very large portion of the House, he should, perhaps, have silently acquiesced in the course pursued in the presentation of the Address; but after the insinuations which had been thrown out, he felt bound to take the first opportunity of vindicating, on his own part, and on the part of his friends, their allegiance and affection to the Crown. That was his first object in rising; a second object was, to express a hope, that upon any future occasion no deviation would be made from the strict rules and orders of the House.

Lord John Russell

could only say, that he had acted on this occasion upon what he had understood to be the rule of the House as regarded the presentation of Addresses to the Crown. It was not for him to vindicate the propriety of that rule; and if it were thought better that there should be any change in it he was sure that if he were to represent the wish of the House to her Majesty, her Majesty would most willingly acquiesce in any alteration that might be desired. But he had always been told by those most conversant with the rules of the House, that the rule upon which the House ordinarily acted upon these occasions was this, that the House should meet, and having met, and the Speaker being prepared, it should then be announced to the House that her Majesty was ready to receive the Address, and that within half an hour from the announcement being made, the House should proceed to present the Address. That certainly had been the custom as long as it had been his business to take any part in the matter—it had been the custom not only during the present reign, but during the late reign; and that being the case, he had felt justified in following up the same rule upon the present occasion. He owned, however, that he felt on Friday night that there was some inconvenience in the observance of such a rule. At the same time he did not like to deviate from what he was told had always been the rule of the House. But to prevent, as far as possible, any inconvenience that might arise from the observance of the rule, he stated at the end of the proceedings, either on Friday night or Saturday afternoon, that was her Majesty's pleasure that the Address should be presented at two o'clock on Monday. He could not make a statement of that kind formally to the House, because it would be contrary to what he understood to be the ordinary custom of the House; and, on that account, perhaps, it had failed to reach the ears of many who would be interested in hearing it. It had certainly been his fortune to appear three or four times at the Bar himself, and to state that her Majesty was ready to receive the Address; but it had always been upon the same day, and not more than half an hour before the Address was taken up. He did not think that the right hon. Baronet would be disposed to blame him for following that which for many years past had been the constant rule of the House. Whether that rule were convenient or not, he would not then stay to discuss; but he was rather pleased to hear the right hon. Baronet state that if it had been fully understood on the other side of the House that the Address would be presented that day, there would be such an attendance of the Members of the Opposition, as would have been only respectful to her Majesty upon that interesting occasion. He certainly thought it very difficult to make a matter of this kind properly understood whilst the form remained as he had stated it; and perhaps it would be better, when her Majesty's pleasure upon the subject of receiv- ing addresses was declared to Ministers that it should be immediately communicated to the House, so that every Member might have full notice of the day and hour at which an address should be presented. He recollected but one instance in which this practice had been departed from, in the reign of his late Majesty, when the Sovereign was at Brighton. If any alteration of the rule was thought requisite, he was sure that her Majesty would most cheerfully accede to it, and he would take care that her Majesty should know that it was only an inadvertent error which had created the apparent negligence of Gentlemen opposite on this occasion.

Sir Edward Knatchbull

was not aware, that the noble Lord had made any intimation to the House, either on Friday or Saturday, that the Address would be presented on Monday. He was satisfied, generally, with the noble Lord's explanation; but he begged to repeat again what he had stated before, that had it not been for the imputations which were so unjustly passed upon that side of the House, he should not have thought it worth while to mention the subject at all. The noble Lord now told them that he had intimated on a former evening what the course of proceeding, as regarded the presentation of the Address would be. If that intimation were made to the House generally, of course he could have no ground to complain of it; but if it should happen that it had been given, not to the House at large, but only to certain Members of it—if it should turn out that it had been made by means of circulars issued from a Government office—then he thought that the Members left in ignorance of the circumstance would have some right to complain. All that he asked from the noble Lord, or from any other Government that might be formed was this; that when it was proposed by the House of Commons to take up a dutiful address to the Crown such intimation should be given as would enable every Member to be present.

Mr. Wakley

could state, that he, for one, was certainly not aware that the address was to be taken up that day. It was stated in the votes that the chair would be taken at one o'clock; but he must declare that he had received no intimation, either written or oral, from any quarter, that the Address would be taken up to the Queen that day. He believed that the noble Lord had stated that which was strictly correct when he said that the course pursued on the present occasion was in strict accordance with that which had been followed upon all previous occasions of a similar kind. But he must confess that, when he saw in the chambers of the palace more than 100 Members of that House, and had it not in his power, with all the observation and scrutiny he could employ, to discover a single Member belonging to the Opposition side of the House, he owned it struck him as being a most extraordinary circumstance. He should have thought that hon. Members on that side of the House—considering what had transpired of late at public meetings and in a portion of the press—would have felt a most earnest desire to rescue themselves from the imputation of sympathizing with persons who had attacked the possessor of the Crown of this country in a manner that was wholly unprecedented in the annals of the kingdom—a manner, in his opinion, so disgraceful, as to reflect upon the character of the country, and to leave a stain upon a portion of the press, which, in his Opinion would not be easily effaced. The party to which he belonged had for a long period, been accused of disloyalty. He called upon the hon. Gentlemen opposite, if they had aught to state upon the subject, to declare what had been said by any Radical Reformer against the possessor of the Crown of these realms. He maintained, that if there were disloyalty it belonged not to them. [Order],

The Speaker

There is no question before the House.

Mr. Bradshaw

trusted he migght be allowed to say a few words, ["Chair," "order."] He would move, then, that the House do now adjourn. He believed he should now be perfectly in order in addressing a very few words to the House, and as he was not often in the habit of troubling them, he hoped he should receive their indulgence for one moment. He wished merely to state, in reference to what had fallen from the hon. Member for Finsbury, (Mr. Wakley) that he was one of, he believed, only four individuals, belonging to the opposition side of the House who had gone up with the address to her Majesty that day. But he took no credit to himself for that, and he begged it to be understood that he did not do it to rescue himself from any imputation. But having seen in the votes that morning that the House was to meet at one o'clock—not being at all aware that it was for the purpose of going up with the address—he had made it a point of attending; and on his way to the House, shortly after one o'clock, meeting the Speaker in his state coach, and guessing that he was going up with the address, he immediately turned round, and had the honour of being one amongst those who were received at the palace.

Mr. Blackstone

felt himself in precisely the same situation as his hon. Friend who had just addressed the House. He had seen that the Speaker was to take the chair at one o'clock, and had come down to the House in consequence of seeing that announcement, and on his way down he had met the Speaker going in procession to the palace. He had followed, and had had the satisfaction of having been admitted into the palace of her Majesty. One thing more he wished to say. When those who sat on the opposition side of the House were accused of disloyalty, he must confess that he for one was ashamed to see Members of that House going into her Majesty's presence—at a time when her royal aunt was lying dead—with cut-off green coats and brass buttons. He might add, that he was still more astonished to see in that costume the brother of a cabinet Minister.

Motion to adjourn withdrawn.

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