HC Deb 19 August 1831 vol 6 cc292-4
Mr. Hume

presented a Petition from the North Western District of the National Union, complaining of the profligate expenditure of the public money in granting the Queen 100,0001. per annum in the event of her surviving his Majesty; and praying for a legislative enactment, by which the widow of every operative in the kingdom should receive 251. per annum, in case her husband should not die worth 100l., and adding, they could not apprehend any objection to this, as those individuals had much better claims upon the nation for this small sum, as belonging to the productive classes, being in fact the only producers of wealth, than her Majesty to the grant of 100,000l.

The Speaker

said, the petition was irregular, as no grant of the sort could take place, unless it originated in a Message from the Throne.

Mr. Hume

said, the petition simply prayed, that a certain sum of money should be given to the widows of a particular class, as a law had been passed for granting dower to the Queen.

Mr. C. W. Wynn

objected to the petition being received. It was absurd and mischievous, disrespectful to the Sovereign, and an insult to every loyal subject. It was evidently intended to insult the House, and cast discredit on it. He would oppose its reception if he stood alone.

Sir James Graham

hoped his hon. friend would withdraw the petition; it was of such an extravagant description that it was impossible to receive it.

Mr. Courtenay

thought, the petition was clearly meant to ridicule the proceedings of the House. The petitioners never could have imagined that the prayer of their petition would or could be granted.

Mr. Stanley

said, that the petition was most ridiculously worded, and that the petitioners themselves could have entertained no idea that its prayer would be acceded to. He feared, however, the House would give greater importance to the petition by refusing to receive it, than by suffering it at once to lie on the Table. He should most decidedly oppose the printing of the petition.

Mr. Hunt

said, that he thought the petitioners were right in calling the grant of 100,000l. a-year to the Queen a profligate expenditure of the public money. Perhaps he had neglected his duty in not voting against it, but it came on at two o'clock in the morning, while he was absent.

The Speaker

called the hon. Member to order. Every Member of the House was presumed always to be present, and when an Act passed the House, it was considered as the Act of the House, and no hon. Member had a right to apply to it such harsh language.

Mr. Hunt

would be sorry to use harsh or unparliamentary language, but in the present condition of the poor of this country such an Act—

The Speaker

again called the hon. Member to order. He was pursuing a course which was neither becoming nor proper.

Mr. Hume

said, he dissented altogether from the opinion laid down, for he had himself, hundreds of times, designated as mischievous many Acts which had passed the House. He, had often condemned them, and might, in the exercise of his duty, be called upon to do so again. Had he written the petition, he should certainly not have applied the epithet contained in it; but still he thought they ought not to scrutinize too closely any unguarded expression coming from the petitioners. He felt, that he ought to press the question of receiving the petition to a division.

Sir John Newport

said, that no hon. Member was warranted in applying such an epithet to a bill passed in the same Parliament that passed the Act to which it was applied. It might be applied to Acts of former Parliaments, because they might be made the subjects of discussion as matters of history.

Mr. Hume

admitted the correctness of the distinction drawn by the right hon Gentleman, but still thought, that allowances should be made for those who were not acquainted with the rules of the House.

Sir James Graham

thought, as the hon. member for Middlesex had admitted the justice of the rule laid down by the right hon. Baronet near him (Sir J. Newport), whose experience made him a competent judge upon such matters, perhaps his discretion would point out to him not to press the matter to a division, but to withdraw the petition.

Sir Richard Vyvyan

objected to the reception of the petition upon broader grounds than the irregularity of expression. He considered, that it would be establishing a most mischievous precedent, if they received a petition which was meant only to censure an act of the House. If they sanctioned such a petition as this, they would inevitably be subjected to the infliction of many more, which would assume even a bolder tone, and interfere with legislative acts of higher importance. If, therefore, the hon. Member persisted in pressing the question to a division, he would decidedly vote against the reception of the petition.

Mr. Hume

then consented to withdraw the petition, in deference to the opinion of the right hon. Gentleman opposite, and not for the reason assigned by the hon. Baronet near him (Sir Richard Vyvyan).

Petition withdrawn.