§ Lord Melchettasked Her Majesty's Government:
Whether they will confirm that in May 1983 an application for forestry planting grant for about 1,000 acres on Kinnell Estate near Killin, in Perthshire, was opposed by the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland and turned down by the Forestry Commission's Regional Advisory Committee, and whether they will confirm that subsequently in the year ended 31st March 1984:
- (i) planting grant was given by the Forestry Commission for afforestation of this area of land;
- (ii) on this occasion the application for planting grant was not opposed by the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland and if so, why not;
245 - (iii) on this occasion the application was not opposed by the Forestry Commission's Regional Advisory Committee; and
- (iv) the application for planting grant was submitted after preparatory work for planning the ground had been started, which would in normal circumstances have made the application ineligible for grant.
§ The Minister of State, Scottish Office (Lord Gray of Contin)The Forestry Commission considered two Forestry Grant Scheme applications in 1983 and 1984 for planting parts of Acharn Farm on the Kinnell Estate.
The Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland objected to the planting proposals in the first application on the grounds that the farm should be retained as a viable agricultural unit, and the application was referred to the Forestry Commission's West Scotland Regional Advisory Committee in May 1983. The committee was unable to reconcile the views of the parties concerned and recommended to the Forestry Commissioners that the department's objections should be upheld. After seeking the views of the Secretary of State for Scotland, the commissioners decided in August 1983 that the application should be refused.
Shortly before this decision was given—but after the matter had been considered by the Regional Advisory Committee—the land concerned was sold. The new owners subsequently made a fresh application to enter land at Acharn Farm into the Forestry Grant Scheme. Consultations on this second application were undertaken with the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland, the Stirling District Council and the Central Regional Council Water Department. The Department of Agriculture was again opposed to any of the land being taken out of agriculture, but the other authorities consulted found the planting proposals acceptable provided certain amenity requirements were met and the ploughing and draining practices agreed for the earlier application were followed. As regards the second application:
- (i) the Forestry Commissioners decided in February 1984, following consultation with the Secretary of State for Scotland, to accept a reduced area into the Forestry Grant Scheme. No grants had been paid by year ended 31st March 1984;
- (ii) the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland opposed the application but eventually accepted a compromise which allowed part of the farm to be afforested;
- (iii) on this second occasion the Regional Advisory Committee was again unable to find a solution to the differences between the parties concerned. There was no question of the application being supported or opposed by the committee, since their role in such cases is solely a conciliatory one. They did, however, repeat their earlier advice to the Forestry Commissioners that the agricultural objections should be accepted;
- (iv) the application was submitted after ploughing had started, but in normal circumstances this would not have made the application ineligible for grant. It is a condition of the Forestry Grant
246 Scheme that claims for grant can be considered only if the application has been approved before planting is carried out; that condition was fulfilled in the present case.
§ Lord Melchettasked Her Majesty's Government:
Whether they will confirm that the Forestry Commission's usual rule is that after the refusal of an application for planting grant five years should pass before a fresh application can be made, whether this rule was applied in the case of an application for planting grant for about 1,500 acres of land on the Kinnell Estate, near Killin, in Perthshire that was granted in the year ended 31st March 1984, and if not, why not.
§ Lord Gray of ContinA decision on an application to enter one of the Forestry Commission's grant schemes will normally stand for a period of five years. However, if there is a material change in circumstances in respect of the area concerned or significantly different planting proposals are made, the commission may be prepared to consider a fresh application. The second application for planting part of Acharn Farm was accepted for consideration on the grounds that the sale of the farm had resulted in the farm house, buildings, in-bye and arable land passing into a different ownership from the hill ground, thereby creating a change in circumstances which called into question the continuing viability of the farm as an agricultural unit.
§ Lord Melchettasked Her Majesty's Government:
Whether they will confirm that the planting of 1,500 acres of land at Kinnell Estate, near Killin in Perthshire with conifers in the year ended 31st March 1984 was carried out on land owned by Captain Baillie-Hamilton by Tilhill Limited, and whether they will confirm that Captain Baillie-Hamilton and Mr. David Brierton, Managing Director of Tilhill Limited, were at the time members of the Forestry Commission's Regional Advisory Committee which had previously turned down an application for a planting grant on this land, but which approved an application in the year ended 31st March 1984, and whether Captain Baillie-Hamilton and Mr. David Brierton are still members of that Regional Advisory Committee.
§ Lord Gray of ContinNo grants were paid by the Forestry Commission in the year ended 31st March 1984 for planting by Tilhill Limited on land on the Kinnel Estate in which Captain Baillie-Hamilton had an interest. However, grants have since been paid on 188.8 hectares (467 acres).
Captain Baillie-Hamilton and Mr. David Brierton were members of the Forestry Commission's West Scotland Regional Advisory Committee at the time that that committee considered the two applications to which I referred in my reply to the noble Lord's previous question. They both took part in the consideration of the first application, when the committee recommended to the Forestry Commissioners that the objections by the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland to the proposed planting' should be upheld. Captain Baillie-Hamilton acquired 247WA an interest in the hill ground of Acharn Farm in July 1983 shortly before a decision was given on the first application, but more than two months after the committee's involvement.
When the second application was referred to the committee in December 1983, both Captain Baillie-Hamilton and Mr. Brierton declared an interest and took no part in the committee's consideration of the case. The committee, having failed to reconcile the views of the parties concerned, repeated their earlier advice that the agricultural objections should be upheld. Following consideration of the application by the Forestry Commissioners, in the course of which they sought the views of the Secretary of State for Scotland, a compromise was agreed with the applicant and the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland by which part of the area concerned was withdrawn from the application while the remainder was accepted into the Forestry Grant Scheme.
Captain Baillie-Hamilton and Mr. David Brierton are still members of the Regional Advisory Committee (now the Mid Scotland Regional Advisory Committee).
§ Lord Melchettasked Her Majesty's Government:
Whether they can give an assurance that neither the Forestry Commission, nor the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries for Scotland, nor the Forestry Commission's Regional Advisory Committee was influenced in any way by the fact that deep ploughing for forestry planting had started on 1,500 acres of land on the Kinnel Estate, near Killin in Perthshire, when they came to consider an application for a planting grant on this area of land.
§ Lord Gray of ContinThe fact that ploughing had been undertaken on part of the area covered by Captain Baillie-Hamilton's Forestry Grant Scheme application did not in itself influence consideration of the case by the Forestry Commission, the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries of Scotland or the Regional Advisory Committee on the application. However, it was one of the aspects, along with the fact that Acharn Farm had been sold in separate lots and was no longer in a single ownership, which was taken into account in the commission's decision to entertain a second application for the areas concerned.