HC Deb 25 October 1920 vol 133 cc1356-9W
Mr. STEVENS

asked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Munitions the number and description of all railway wagons owned or controlled by his Department, setting out separately those which are for disposal from those which his Department are operating; what reasons, if any, he can advance why the latter are more usefully employed under the control of his Department than they would be if controlled by the Minister of Transport; and if he will give particulars as to the time railway wagons owned by his Department were underload, empty, and in transit, for the four weeks ended 20th June, 1920, the four weeks ended 18th July, and for the four weeks ended 17th October, respectively?

Sir J. BAIRD

The disposal of all Ministry of Munitions wagons (5,770 in number) to the Ministry of Transport has recently been effected, and arrangements for the transfer of administration are in progress. On these wagons becoming surplus, they were let out on hire to private users, who have been responsible for their working.

Mr. STEVENS

asked the Minister of Transport the number of railway wagons owned or controlled by the various Government Departments, naming the number of wagons owned and/or controlled by each Department; what reasons, if any, can be advanced why railway wagons are more usefully employed under the separate control of Departments than they would be if controlled by him and allocated by him in the general interest; why in the railway statistics published by the Ministry of Transport no information is given in regard to Government-owned railway rolling stock; and why information as to the average miles run and the average time occupied per wagon is not based on the stock of Government-owned wagons as well as on the stock of railway-owned and private-owned wagons?

Sir E. GEDDES

I would refer the hon. Member to the replies given by the First Commissioner of Works and the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Shipping on the 21st instant in regard to the wagons controlled by their respective Departments. So far as I am aware the only additional wagons owned or controlled by other Government Departments are 5,817 wagons mainly for the conveyance of home ore owned by the Ministry of Munitions and 1,505 wagons controlled by the Admiralty consisting of 1,200 hired coal wagons which are being released as quickly as possible and 305 special type vehicles required for the Admiralty purposes. It is proposed that the whole of the wagons owned by the Ministry of Munitions should be taken into the Ministry of Transport Pool and allocated to the railways, but I do not think that any advantage would accrue from taking over wagons of special types required by the Admiralty. So far as the statistics referred to are concerned, I would refer the hon. Member to the Census of Private Traders' wagons taken by the Board of Trade in 1918 from which he will gather that Government owned and controlled wagons are included in the total of 628,344 privately owned wagons, and are covered by the four-weekly statistics of operation. Separate figures for particular groups of wagons could not be compiled.

Mr. STEVENS

asked the Secretary of State for War the number and description of railway wagons owned or controlled by his Department; what reasons, if any, he can advance why they are more usefully employed under the control of his Department than they would be if controlled by the Minister of Transport; if he will give particulars as to the time railway wagons owned by his Department were underload, empty, and in transit for the four weeks ended 20th June, 1920, the four weeks ended 16th July, and for the four weeks ended 17th October, respectively'

Sir A. WILLIAMSON

The War Department does not own or control any railway wagons in this country, with the exception of those required for internal use in depots and on camp railways. The majority of these wagons are unfit for main-line traffic. All wagons from overseas, owned by the War Department pass into the hands of the Ministry of Munitions as soon as they reach this country, for inclusion in the pool of Government wagons under the control of the Ministry of Transport. These wagons, and also those belonging to British railway companies which are on the way from overseas, still bear the old War Department identification marks, and this may have given rise to the misunderstanding that they are still owned and controlled by the War Department.

Mr. STEVENS

asked the First Lord of the Admiralty the number and description of railway wagons owned or controlled by his Department; what reasons, if any, he can advance why they are more usefuly employed under the control of his Department than they would be if controlled by the Minister of Transport; if he will give particulars as to the time railway wagons owned by his Department were under-load, empty, and in transit for the four weeks ended 20th June, 1920, the four weeks ended 18th July, and for the four weeks ended 17th October, respectively?

Sir J. CRAIG

The only railway rolling stock owned by the Admiralty, apart from that for internal use in H. M. naval establishments, is of a special character for particular work, such as the carriage of propellers, Admiralty fuel, oils, etc., and and it is assumed that the hon. Member is not referring to such stock. The Admiralty has on hire a number of coal wagons, the number on 30th September last being 1,319, and about 100 less to-day. These wagons, which represent all that are left of 16,030 on Admiralty hire at the Armistice, are in process of being returned to their owners. Some are in regular use for delivering coal from South Wales to naval establishments; the rest are being released to their owners day by day as quickly as they can be collected and hauled to South Wales sidings.