Sitting of 23 November 1943

Preamble
[MR. SPEAKER in the Chair]
NEW WRIT
For the County of Middlesex (Acton Division) in the room of Captain Hubert John Duggan, deceased.—[Mr. James Stuart.]
ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS

  REPATRIATED PRISONERS OF WAR
  Mr. Rhys Daviesasked the Secretary of State for War whether all the men recently repatriated from German prisoner-of-war camps are to be allowed their discharge from His Majesty's Forces?
  The Secretary of State for War (Sir James Grigg): It is likely that most of those repatriated, after examination by a mixed medical commission, will be discharged from the Army. Those who are found to be fit for further military service of the kind permitted by the Geneva Convention will be retained.
  Mr. Davies: Are we to understand that these men, who have suffered so much, will not be entitled to their discharge if the War Office decides to retain them?
  Sir J. Grigg: Hon. Members can understand exactly what I said, namely, that if their medical condition justifies it, they will be discharged, and that most of them will be. Those who are fit will be retained for such service as the Geneva Convention permits.
  Mr. Davies: Were they not repatriated because they were wounded, and too sick to be in any Army?
  Sir J. Grigg: Some have improved in condition after being repatriated. But, as I said, the majority will be discharged.
  Mr. Barrasked the Secretary of State for War by what authority supplies of
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  beer, which had been prepared for the reception of repatriated Service-men landing at Leith, were withdrawn?
  Sir J. Grigg: It was decided by the military authorities that it was more convenient, and in the case of sick and wounded better from a medical point of view, for the beer prepared for the ex-prisoners of war landing at Leith to be sent to the reception stations and medical centres, and served with the evening meal rather than handed out on the quay or in the train.
  Mr. Barr: Why did the B.B.C. rush in so eagerly on this subject? Is the whole matter not explained by the desire of the brewing industry for self-advertisement?

  COMBINED SERVICES ADVISORY BUREAU
  Mr. G. Straussasked the Secretary of State for War whether the organisation entitled "Combined Services Advisory Bureau," which invites members of the public to put any claim for damage in respect of accidents in its hands and which purports to exist only for the benefit of those who have served in His Majesty's Forces, has the official sanction of his Department; and if not, will he take steps to make that clear to the general public?
  Sir J. Grigg: I understand that the certificate of registration of this body has been returned to the Registrar of Business Names, and has been cancelled.

  BRITISH ARMY

    War Decorations and Medals
    Sir Douglas Hackingasked the Secretary of State for War whether he is aware of the feeling in the Army that separate medals should be given for service in each different part of the world during this war; and whether he will favourably consider this request?
    Sir J. Grigg: I am not aware of any such feeling, but if it exists in some quarters, it is probably balanced by an equal volume of opinion that some other course is desirable. It is intended that these questions should form the subject of debate, and I cannot at present add anything to the reply given by the Prime Minister on 22nd September, in answer to a number of hon. Members.
    Sir D. Hacking: Does that mean that my right hon. Friend has not entirely closed his mind to the possibility of further medals being issued?
    Sir J. Grigg: It means exactly what I said: that there is nothing I can add at present to the answer given by the Prime Minister, particularly as the matter is to be the subject of debate in this House.
    Mr. Glenvil Hall: Is that Debate likely to take place soon?
    Sir J. Grigg: That question should be addressed to the Leader of the House.

    Pre-Natal Allowance
    Major Nieldasked the Secretary of State for War whether the pre-natal allowance under Army Order 1, of 1943, is now applied only to other ranks; and whether he will consider extending its application to junior officers?
    Sir J. Grigg: The answer to the first part of the Question is, "Yes, Sir." As to the second, I am not in a position to add anything to the reply given by the then Lord President to the hon. Member for Basset-law (Mr. Bellenger) on 26th January, of which I will send my hon. and gallant Friend a copy.
    Major Nield: Is my right hon. Friend not aware of the difficulty which a married subaltern without private means has in making ends meet when a baby is on the way? Would not this concession be a modest one?
    Sir J. Grigg: The question was dealt with very fully in the House on two occasions by the Lord President of the Council. Perhaps my hon. and gallant Friend would refresh his memory about those statements by the Lord President.

    Overseas Service
    Major Nieldasked the Secretary of State for War when the hope, which he has expressed, to be able to reduce the term of a soldier's service overseas from six to five years may be expected to fructify?
    Sir J. Grigg: I hope that a start will be made at the end of this year with those who have been overseas for over five years.
    Mr. John Dugdale: Does this apply also to men serving in the Indian Army, or does it apply only to the British Army?
    Sir J. Grigg: I am not sure. I would like to have notice of the question. It certainly applies to the British Army serving in India. So far as I can remember, there are no British other ranks serving in the Indian Army; the only British personnel in the Indian Army are officers. But perhaps the hon. Member will put the question down.

    Officers' Courts-Martial (Punishment)
    Major Nieldasked the Secretary of State for War whether he has considered the recommendations that courts-martial should, upon the conviction of officers for certain offences, be empowered to impose some effective form of punishment between dismissal from the service and severe reprimand, as for example, fines, reduction in rank or disciplinary courses; and whether he intends to act upon such recommendations?
    Sir J. Grigg: This question has been considered on more than one occasion, but no recommendation has so far been made to me which I regard as practicable.

    Auxiliary Territorial Service (Complaints)
    Mr. Parkerasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will carry out an immediate investigation into the conditions existing at the A.T.S. Palace Camp, Establishment A, Douglas Bay Hotel, Douglas, Isle of Man, where girls are frequently molested by mice and rats at night, and where the food at times is so unappetising that it is necessary for them to spend their pay in purchasing additional food after 5 p.m. at local cafés?
    Sir J. Grigg: A.T.S. personnel at Palace Camp, Douglas, are accommodated in various requisitioned hotels and boarding houses, some of which it is difficult to keep entirely clear of rats and mice. Arrangements have, however, been made for a professional rat-catcher to visit the camp. The reports received hitherto indicate that the messing at this camp is good. In fact, only one complaint has been received in four months prior to the hon. Member's Question, and that was that the meat was too fatty. The specific complaints which the hon. Member has forwarded to me and conditions generally at this camp are, however, being investigated by an officer who is being sent there especially for the purpose.
    Mr. Parkerasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will investigate

    1415
    conditions at Establishment C, Shenley, Hertfordshire, where there have been cases where putrid fish, refused by A.T.S. girls for lunch, has been served up again as fish cakes in the evening?
    Sir J. Grigg: A few members of this unit complained about the fish on one occasion recently. The complaint was investigated by the messing officer, who found the fish quite palatable. I understand that cold meat and salad, not fish cakes, were served in the evening. I should add that this is the only complaint about food in this unit which has so far been made.
    Mr. Parkerasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will investigate the case of 60 A.T.S. girls, medically examined at Queen Ethelburga's Camp, Harrogate, while scantily clad, waiting in a draughtly corridor, as a result of which Private Sheridan, M.O. No. W.237320, who joined the A.T.S. on 18th December, 1942, contracted a chill, from which she subsequently died at the University college Hospital?
    Sir J. Grigg: These A.T.S. auxiliaries were medically examined on 26th October at this camp at Harrogate in a hall which was centrally heated. They wore greatcoats over their underwear. I am informed that, having regard to the history of the case of the auxiliary referred to, it is most unlikely that the circumstances of this medical inspection, which have been closely investigated, were a material factor in the cause of her illness, or that they had any effect on the course it took.

    Directorate for Civil Affairs (Senior Officers)
    Mr. Liddallasked the Secretary of State for War how many major-generals, brigadiers, colonels and lieutenant-colonels, respectively, are employed in the Directorate for Civil Affairs, at office headquarters and otherwise; and whether he will place a limit to the number of high-ranking officers so graded and employed?
    Sir J. Grigg: I am circulating the particulars asked for by my hon. Friend in the OFFICIAL REPORT. No increase in the present numbers of these officers will be authorised unless it is unavoidable for essential work. But it is impossible at present to foresee what additional re-
    1416
    sponsibilities may be thrown on the directorate, and it would therefore not be possible to guarantee that no addition will be found necessary in the future.
    Mr. Liddall: Is it necessary to have all these appointments made, when a small number of competent people can do the work?
    Sir J. Grigg: I do not accept the hon. Member's estimate of what a small number of competent people can do in running a country behind an advancing Army, when no civil administration exists. That is not a small job.
    Following are the particulars:
    The numbers of senior officers employed in the Directorate of Civil Affairs are as follow: At the War Office, 1 Major-General; 1 Brigadier (local Major-General), 3 Brigadiers, 1 Colonel, 1 Lieutenant-Colonel (local Colonel), 16 Lieutenant-Colonels; and at the Civil Affairs Staff Centre, 1 Brigadier and 5 Lieutenant-Colonels.

    Disabled Soldiers (Troopship Accommodation and Excess Luggage).
    Mr. Loverseedasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will ensure that disabled soldiers returning to this country on troopships are provided with adequate and satisfactory sleeping accommodation?
    Sir J. Grigg: The medical boards decide in each case which they examine whether the individual is fit to travel in a troopship or should be embarked in a hospital ship. If a disabled man travels in a troopship special consideration is given to him in allocating his berth. If my hon. Friend knows of a case where unsuitable arrangements were made and if he will send me particulars, I will have them investigated.
    Mr. Loverseedasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will issue instructions to the appropriate officers that disabled men proceeding on leave from ports of disembarkation from overseas and who are carrying crutches or spare equipment for artificial limbs, shall be provided with a railway warrant to cover the cost of the excess weight carried?
    Sir J. Grigg: I understand that it is most unlikely that a charge would be raised in these circumstances, and I do

    1417
    not think it is necessary to issue any general instructions. But if a charge has been raised in any particular case, the War Office will certainly bear the cost.
    Mr. Loverseed: Would the right hon. Gentleman investigate the case—which is not an isolated one—of a soldier who was charged excess weight of £1 12s. 11d. for crutches and equipment for artificial limbs?
    Sir J. Grigg: As I said in answer to the hon. Member's Question, I will certainly investigate it, and I will also investigate the evidence on which he says that it is not an isolated case.

    Soldiers front Overseas (Credit Balances)
    Mr. Loverseedasked the Secretary of State for War whether he will issue instructions to ensure that soldiers proceeding on leave from ports of disembarkation from overseas, and who have accumulated credit balances in their pay accounts, shall be paid a substantial part of such balances before proceeding on leave?
    Sir J. Grigg: Generally speaking, soldiers are not sent on leave from the port at which they disembark but from a unit or place of reception. In the few cases where they do go on leave from the port arrangements are being made to give them advances of pay. In some places these arrangements are, I understand, already in force.
    Mr. Loverseed: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that many of these soldiers have been in hospital for some months and have accumulated, as a result, large credits, in some cases £70 or £80, while they are paid only £7 for 14 days' leave, out of which they have to pay such charges as are necessary?
    Sir J. Grigg: As I say, the amount of their credit is not available at the port, and so some rough and ready fixed figure must be adopted.

    Eighth Army, Italy (Commodity Prices)
    Mr. Molsonasked the Secretary of State for War whether steps have been taken to prevent the Italian population from profiteering in shops, restaurants and cafés at the expense of the men of the Eighth Army?
    Sir J. Grigg: Proclamations have been issued by the Allied Military Government
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    fixing detailed schedules of prices for all classes of foods and other goods offered for sale and providing for the display of these prices in the shops. Reports received from Italy show that observance of the price-lists is being strictly enforced and that prompt and severe fines and sentences of imprisonment are inflicted on offenders, together with confiscation of stocks and, in the case of flagrant offenders, the closing of their shops.

    Publication, "Eighth Army News"
    Commander Locker-Lampsonasked the Secretary of State for War whether his attention has been drawn to the character of the "Eighth Army News," published in Africa; who is the proprietor of this organ, the editor, and the author of the attacks on Gracie Fields and upon E.N.S.A., respectively?
    Sir J. Grigg: This paper is issued for the Eighth Army and is run by an editorial staff responsible to the General Officer Commanding. It owes its popularity with the troops to the freedom with which it expresses the Army's views, and I am naturally anxious to interfere with this as little as possible. A new branch has, however, been formed in the War Office to give advice to editors of these Army newspapers and to help them in supplying material for them. These newspapers are principally intended to provide news, and the commands concerned have been reminded that the editors must exercise circumspection in expressing their views particularly as they may be very widely quoted.
    Colonel Arthur Evans: Can my right hon. Friend tell me whether the personnel of the new branch which has been formed in the War Office has been drawn on generally from professional classes or journalists?
    Sir J. Grigg: The head of the branch certainly is a journalist.
    Mr. Shinwell: Is it to be understood that no restriction will be imposed by the War Office upon this paper and those associated with it, so long as it does not interfere with the war effort and merely expresses an opinion about comedians, artists or politicians? Surely, that is to be allowed?
    Sir J. Grigg: I would not like to give a categorical answer to that question,

    1419
    because some objections have been made on political grounds by members of the hon. Gentleman's own party.
    Commander Locker-Lampson: Has not the time come to have fair play for Gracie Fields?

    N.A.A.F.I. (Stores, Sicily)
    Mr. Norman Bowerasked the Secretary of State for War whether his attention has been drawn to a N.A.A.F.I. advertisement in the Press implying that canteen supplies were available to the troops within a few days of the initial landing in Sicily, whereas, in fact, no canteen was opened for three weeks; and whether he will see that the publication of such misleading advertisements is discontinued?
    Sir J. Grigg: I understand that some N.A.A.F.I. stores were in fact landed within 80 hours of the first landing of troops, but owing to more pressing military demands on the transport in Sicily the stores did not reach the troops for the first three weeks.

    Injured Personnel (Demotion)
    Mr. Quintin Hoggasked the Secretary of State for War whether his attention has been drawn to the case of 6134709, Corporal Crouch, R.A.S.C., who was reverted to corporal from company sergeant-major owing to injuries received on war service; and whether steps will be taken to grant war substantive rank in this and similar cases?
    Sir J. Grigg: It has been necessary in inquiring into this case to communicate with the command overseas where this soldier is serving. I will write to the hon. Member as soon as the inquiries have been completed.
    Mr. Hogg: In pursuing these investigations, will my right hon. Friend consider the possibility of the necessity of changing the Regulations in regard to these reversions, which arouse a good deal of feeling?
    Sir J. Grigg: That consideration has been examined very exhaustively as an inter-Service matter on several occasions. It was considered in conjunction with the general inquiry in the last Debate, in which the Lord President made a statement earlier this year.
    Mr. Manderasked the Secretary of State for War whether he is aware that certain repatriated soldiers, of a regiment of which he has been informed, in Wolverhampton, holding the rank of lance-corporal, have been informed that they will revert to the rank of private on 29th November next; and whether in such cases he will consider the advisability of allowing the N.C.O. rank to be retained at any rate until the men have been before a medical board and been discharged?
    Sir J. Grigg: Acting ranks and lance appointments are normally relinquished when the holder ceases to perform the duties of the rank or appointment. But an exception has been made in the case of prisoners of war. They retain these appointments during the whole period of captivity and for 28 days after they have disembarked in this country on being released or repatriated. I am anxious to ensure that these repatriated prisoners should be well treated, but any further concession on the lines suggested by my hon. Friend would hardly be fair on other soldiers in the Army to whom the general rule I have mentioned applies.
    Mr. Mander: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that these men, after having been prisoners of war for over three years and having held the rank of lance-corporal, feel very keenly indeed that now, having come home, they should lose that rank and have to go back to private; and will he consider the matter in the light of these men's feelings?
    Sir J. Grigg: If the hon. Member has been listening to one of the earlier Questions asked me to-day, he will see that other people who have not been prisoners of war feel deeply about this matter too, and I am well aware of that. The matter has been exhaustively considered, and the present arrangements are considered to be the best calculated to be fair to all parties. I might remind the hon. Member that prisoners of war are already considerably better treated in this respect than others.
    Mr. Glenvil Hall: Does the right hon. Gentleman believe that two blacks make a white?
    Sir J. Grigg: I do not admit that they are black.

  ROAD ACCIDENTS (UNITED STATES SERVICE VEHICLES)
  Sir John Mellorasked the Secretary of State for War whether the British Claims Commission will accept responsibility to British claimants for the assessment and settlement of claims arising out of personal injuries and material damage caused by American Army vehicles in the United Kingdom in the same manner as agricultural claims arising out of American Army exercises?
  Sir J. Grigg: I have nothing at present to add to the reply given by the Minister of State to my hon. Friend the Member for Ilkeston (Mr. Oliver) on 10th November.
  Sir J. Mellor: Will my right hon. Friend explain the reason for the distinction between the two?
  Sir J. Grigg: No, Sir, not at present.

  SCOTLAND

    Institution Inmates (Pocket Money)
    Mr. Pethick-Lawrenceasked the Secretary of State for Scotland which authorities in Scotland do not make use of the permissive powers of the Poor Law (Amendment) Act of 1938 to give pocket money to the old people in their institutions; and whether he proposes to take any action in the matter?
    The Secretary of State for Scotland (Mr. T. Johnston): I am sending my hon. Friend the names of the local authorities in Scotland who do not give pocket money to aged persons in their Poor Law institutions and of the authorities who give it to pensioners only. Allowances of tobacco and sweets are sometimes made instead. I propose to write to the local authorities concerned drawing their attention to the Act, but, as my hon. Friend will appreciate, the powers conferred by it are permissive.
    Mr. Neil Maclean: Will the names of these authorities appear in the printed Hansard Report of the right hon. Gentleman's answer?
    Mr. Johnston: I cannot tell off-hand. I do not think so, but, if not, I will try to make it clear in another way.
    Mr. Pethick-Lawrence: Is there any reason to keep the names secret?
    Mr. Johnston: No, Sir.

    Building Trade Workers (Civil Defence and National Fire Service)
    Mr. Pethick-Lawrenceasked the Secretary of State for Scotland the number of building trade workers, skilled, semi-skilled and unskilled, serving in full capacity in Civil Defence and National Fire Services in Scotland?
    Mr. Johnston: According to my information, the total number of workers referred to is 1,933, of whom 1,452 are skilled, 118 are semi-skilled, and 363 are unskilled. As I informed the hon. Member for East Renfrewshire on 1st June, 1943, arrangements have been in operation for the temporary release of whole-time firemen for essential local work and I am presently in consultation with the Minister of Labour and National Service as to how these arrangements can be improved and made more use of. Similar consultations are taking place with the Minister of Home Security in regard to the Civil Defence General Services.

    War Factories (Closing)
    Mr. Kirkwoodasked the Secretary of State for Scotland whether he is aware that, following the change in the character of war production, there is a danger of factories being closed down in Scotland and the labour so released being directed to England; what steps he is taking to prevent this further depopulation of Scotland; and what plans he is making to ensure that Scotland is fairly treated in the transition of industry from a war to a peace basis?
    Mr. Johnston: Questions relating to war production should be addressed to my right hon. Friend the Minister of Production, or, if they relate to particular cases, to the Supply Minister concerned. With regard to Scottish industry generally, my hon. Friend will be aware of the statement which has just been issued by the Scottish Council on Industry, of which I am sending him a copy. I have conveyed the Council's representations and recommendations on this subject to the appropriate quarters. It will be seen from the statement that, since the establishment of the Council early in 1942, over 369 new projects or extensions, covering all kinds

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    of production, with a total employment value estimated at more than 50,000 workers, have been authorised in Scotland, and that in the past 12 months the additional work authorised in Scotland represented nearly 20 per cent. of the total new employment provided in Great Britain. Moreover, the percentage of floor space in existing premises in Scotland now being allocated for production, as compared with the space allocated for storage, is now three times as great as in 1941. As regards the future, plans covering a wide range of post-war development are being actively prepared, including in particular a considerable housing programme, the utilisation of hydro-electric power and of Scottish coal resources, and the development of agriculture and the fishing industry.
    Mr. Gallacher: In view of the very deep feeling that exists in Scotland in regard to the continued drainage of heavy industries from Scotland to England, would the right hon. Gentleman arrange for an early meeting of Scottish Members at St. Andrew's House to discuss the matter and work out measures for dealing with this serious problem?
    Mr. Johnston: If the hon. Member will look at the lengthy answer I have given, he will see that there is now a Council of Industry going in detail into the matters to which he has referred.
    Major Lloyd: Would the right hon. Gentleman draw the attention of his English colleagues to the fact that many of these decisions are made without sufficient notice being given so that there is consequently no time for alternative arrangements to be made? This is a very great handicap to the workers and managements concerned.
    Mr. Johnston: Yes, Sir.
    Mr. Sloan: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that in spite of his lengthy answer there has been a distinct upward curve of emigration of Scottish girls to England in recent months? Does he intend to take any action to stop this?
    Mr. Johnston: I have indicated in that lengthy answer what we are doing. As regards the first part of the hon. Gentleman's Supplementary Question, the answer is in the affirmative.

    Land Settlement Committee (Report)
    Major Lloydasked the Secretary of State for Scotland what progress has been made by the Scottish Committee on Post-war Land Settlement; and whether he can make any statement in this connection?
    Mr. Johnston: The Land Settlement Committee has, I believe, completed its hearing of evidence and local investigations and is now engaged in framing its recommendations. I understand that the Committee hopes to report early in the New Year.
    Mr. McLaren: Will these recommendations be issued in the form of a White Paper or a Report of any kind?
    Mr. Johnston: They will be issued in a Report.

    Juvenile Courts (Birching)
    Sir Frank Sandersonasked the Secretary of State for Scotland what action he proposes to take about the statement made by the chief constable of Renfrewshire at a youth conference to the effect that he would use a green birch on offenders and cut them with it; and will he consider the setting up of an official committee to review the matter with a view to the abolition of birching as a sentence by juvenile courts?
    Mr. Johnston: Under the existing Statutes the approval of suitable instruments for punishment is the responsibility of the sheriff, and not of the police, and the opinions publicly expressed by the Chief Constable of Renfrewshire recently are, therefore, open to misunderstanding as to his powers and responsibility. I have so informed him. The whole question of the use of corporal punishment as a court penalty was examined and reported upon adversely by the Departmental Committee in 1938. As the House is aware, the Government in 1939 introduced a Criminal Justice Bill which included provision for implementing the Committee's recommendations; but considerable controversy ensued and, as the war intervened, the Measure was dropped.
    Sir F. Sanderson: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that it is wholly un-British to address a youth conference in this manner, and, further, is he aware that one can only lead boys and not force them?
    Miss Rathbone: Will the right hon. Gentleman consider whether this chief constable, in expressing this sadistic spirit, did not show himself to be unfit for his office?
    Mrs. Hardieasked the Secretary of State for Scotland how many sentences of birching were passed on young people in Scotland during the last year; and in what districts these birchings took place?
    Mr. Johnston: As the reply consists of a table of figures, I propose, with my hon. Friend's permission, to circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.
    Mrs. Hardie: Will my right hon. Friend use his influence to prevent this form of punishment being administered, as it injures not only the child but the mind of the man who administers it?
    Mr. Johnston: As my hon. Friend is aware, these matters are entirely in the purview of the sheriffs. The Statutes give them discretion in the matter, and with that I have no power whatever to interfere.
    Following is the table referred to:
    The number of persons under the age of 16 ordered by the courts in Scotland to be birched in 1942; the number of cases in which the court's order was carried out; and the areas concerned are shown in the following table:

    County or Large Burgh.

    No. of Orders made.

    No. of Orders carried out.

    Aberdeen City

    1

    1

    Angus

    15

    15

    Banff

    3

    3

    Dumbarton

    3

    3

    Dundee

    1

    1

    East Lothian

    3

    3

    Edinburgh

    21

    21

    Fife

    3

    3

    Glasgow

    111

    110

    Hamilton

    2

    2

    Inverness

    4

    4

    Invernessshire

    5

    4

    Moray and Nairn

    7

    6

    Stirling

    2

    2

    West Lothian

    2

    1

    183

    179

  COAL INDUSTRY

    Miners' Pensions
    Mr. MacLarenasked the Minister of Fuel and Power whether he has examined
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    the proposed scheme for pensions at 55 years of age for coalminers; and what progress he has made in the matter?
    The Minister of Fuel and Power (Major Lloyd George): The scheme to which my hon. Friend refers is under examination in my Ministry. It must, however, in addition, be the subject of discussion with the other Departments concerned.

    Prosecutions (Imprisonment Sentences)
    Mr. Rhys Daviesasked the Minister of Fuel and Power whether he will now abandon the policy of instigating prosecutions of persons employed in and around coalmines for offences not punishable in this way before the war in view of the sympathetic strikes provoked by such prosecutions and the consequent manner in which the law is brought into disrepute?
    Major Lloyd George: I have nothing to add to the reply which I gave to my hon. Friend on this subject on 12th October last.
    Mr. Davies: Does not the right hon. and gallant Gentleman think that the loss of production of coal is sometimes due to these prosecutions? Would it not be worth while giving consideration to that point?
    Major Lloyd George: As I told my hon. Friend last time, I am most anxious not to prosecute. We prosecute only when an offence has been committed, and the best thing to do is not to commit an offence.
    Mr. Shinwell: Does not my right hon. and gallant Friend realise that these and have not contributed towards increased production of coal? As the Government are now in a very lenient mood, cannot he now do something in the matter?
    Major Lloyd George: I am most anxious to do anything I can to avoid prosecutions. I have asked everybody I can think of to find a better way. But when an offence against the law of the land has been committed and proceedings take place, I have no alternative if the fine is not paid.
    Mr. Gallacher: The miners go in and Mosley comes out.
    Mr. Austin Hopkinson: Is it not a fact that it is not possible to take any other steps so long as the Essential Work Order is applied to collieries?
    Mr. Cocks: Will my right hon. and gallant Friend consider setting up special industrial courts to deal with these cases?
    Major Lloyd George: I have tried several experiments, some of them of a voluntary nature with the consent of both sides. Those which have been tried show every hope of being successful. I am watching them carefully, and I will extend them to other coalfields if they are successful.
    Mr. Sloan: Is the Minister aware that as a result of a Durham boy being sent to prison it will require 50 years' work to make up the shifts which have been lost by the men who went on strike?

  AUSTRIANS, GREAT BRITAIN (NATIONALITY)
  Mr. Manderasked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether in view of the decision of the Moscow Conference that the annexation of Austria by Germany on 15th March, 1938, is null and void, it is now proposed to treat those at present in this country who were citizens of Austria before that date as Austrians and not German subjects?
  The Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mr. Peake): As my right hon. Friend has explained on previous occasions, it makes no difference to the treatment or status of an alien in this country if his nationality is described as Austrian instead of German. His treatment depends upon whether or not he is whole-heartedly sympathetic with the allied cause and willing to assist our war effort. If he is, he can obtain exemption from the special restrictions applicable to aliens of enemy nationality.
  Mr. Mander: Is not the right hon. Gentleman aware that these Austrians feel deeply humiliated at being wrongly described as Germans? In the light of the Moscow Conference and what was decided there, will he give the matter further cosideration?
  Mr Peake: The hon. Member's Question was read as dealing with the treatment of these people. As I have explained,
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  it makes no difference whether they are described as Germans or Austrians. But as regards registration with the police, I will take note of the hon. Member's point.

  SIR OSWALD AND LADY MOSLEY (RELEASE)
  Dr. Haden Guestasked the Home Secretary why, as the medical and nursing services provided in Holloway prison are adequate for prisoners there confined, supplemented where necessary by arrangements for operation or other treatment in London hospitals, it is necessary, for medical reasons, to remove Sir Oswald Mosley and Lady Mosley for detention in that establishment?
  Mr. Peake: My right hon. Friend proposes to make a statement on this case at the end of Questions. This will cover the point raised in my hon. Friend's Question.
  Dr. Guest: Can I have an answer to the specific Question on the medical side? I represent this institution in Parliament; it is in my constituency and I think it would be better if I could have an answer now.
  Mr. Peake: I am sure the hon. Member will have an opportunity of putting a Supplementary Question at the end of Questions.
  Later—
  Mr. Speaker: The Home Secretary.
  Mr. Gallacher: On a point of Order. In view of the very important character of the statement which is now to be made, should it not be made upon a Motion for the Adjournment?
  Mr. Speaker: A Minister can make a statement in any way he pleases.
  Mr. Gallacher: Further to that point of Order. This is a very special question. This is something different from an ordinary statement, and it seems to me that it could only be considered the most cowardly evasion on the part of the Government if they did not make the statement on the Adjournment. I therefore ask you whether it is not possible to get this statement made to the House on the Motion for the Adjournment.
  The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mr. Herbert Morrison): Further to the point of Order. May I submit

  1429
  that, in view of the controversy and the abuse to which I have been submitted from quarters with which the hon. Member is associated, is it not due to me and to the House of Commons that this statement should be made at the earliest practicable moment? There is a Question on the Order Paper by the hon. Member for North Islington (Dr. Haden Guest), and I am answering that Question and certain other considerations as well.
  In view of the importance of this matter, I would ask permission to make a somewhat full statement. As the House will be aware, Sir Oswald Mosley was detained some 3½ years ago, in May, 1940, because my predecessor was satisfied that his British Union activities were prejudicial to national security, and that it was necessary to exercise control over him. The decision to release him does not imply that the Government take a different view of the potentialities for mischief of any revival of this organisation. The Order applying Defence Regulation 18AA to this organisation remains in force and prohibits any renewal of its activities.
  The case of each of the individuals detained under Regulation 18B has to be determined in the light both of the facts of the particular case and of general conditions. In view of the improvement in our national fortunes, it has been possible without endangering national security to release a large number of former members of the British Union on the ground that their detention is not necessary in present circumstances. The improvement in our national fortunes would not by itself, however, have justified the immediate release of Sir Oswald Mosley: as the leader and most influential person in the movement, he would have been the last to be released.
  From time to time representations have been made to me as to the state of his health, and it accordingly became the duty of the prison medical authorities to advise me as to the nature and degree of the risk to his health which his continued detention would involve. For this purpose it was arranged that there should be consultation between the prison medical authorities and Lord Dawson of Penn and Dr. Geoffrey Evans. A consultation accordingly took place between the Medical Commissioner of Prisons, two prison doctors and these two medical practitioners. The opinion of these five doctors was unanimous: it was that if
  1430
  the patient remained under the conditions which are inseparable from detention, there would be substantial risk of the thrombo-phlebitis from which he is suffering extending, and thus producing permanent damage to health and even danger to life. This complaint is of long standing, and the question was not whether the appropriate medical treatment could be given in a prison establishment, but whether there was a reasonable chance of checking serious deterioration of his health unless the patient were allowed a greater measure of freedom for outdoor exercise and varied occupations than is possible in a place of detention. The opinion of all these medical men was that, if the matter were considered purely on medical grounds, release from detention was essential for the purpose of checking the extension of his complaint and providing any reasonable prospect of recovery.
  On receipt of this authoritative medical advice, there were only two courses open to me. First, I had to consider whether I ought to take the responsibility of detaining this suspect to the permanent damage of his health and possibly to the danger of his life. On this point I can only say that, while considerations of national security must come first, I am not prepared, subject to this overriding consideration, to let anyone die in detention unnecessarily. This policy is based not on the inexpediency of making martyrs of persons who do not deserve the honour, but on the general principle that those extraordinary powers of detention without trial must not be used except in so far as they are essential for national security.
  The alternative course was to consider whether there should be substituted for detention some system of control approximating to house arrest. Under the provisions of Regulation 18B the Secretary of State is empowered to suspend an Order of Detention subject to conditions imposing various restrictions. Failure to comply with any conditions so imposed renders the person concerned liable not only to prosecution for an offence but also to be brought back to detention. Knowing that severe restrictions could be imposed and enforced and that the Detention Order itself could be re-imposed at need, I came to the conclusion that my right course was to substitute for detention a stringent system of

  1431
  control and that release subject to the restrictions I had in mind would not entail any undue risk to national security in the circumstances of the present day.
  In reaching this conclusion, I kept two considerations prominently in mind. First, conditions imposed on a person released from detention, however stringent those conditions may be, cannot provide as effective a method of control as confinement. The release under such conditions of a person who would otherwise be detained can, therefore, be justified only if there is some exceptional reason, such as the medical considerations arising in the present case. Secondly, while it is right that account should be taken of medical considerations, especially when, as in the present case, there is a risk of permanent injury to health or danger to life, such considerations cannot be paramount. They must be subordinate to considerations of national security. My justification for taking on medical grounds a course which would not otherwise have been taken, even at this stage of the war, is that I was satisfied that no undue risk to national security would be incurred by the release of this man, subject to stringent conditions, in the circumstances obtaining at the present day. Had a similar question arisen at an earlier date, when the dangers to be apprehended from any attempt at interference with our war effort were much greater than they are to-day, the position would have been different.
  I have authorised the release of Sir Oswald Mosley in the belief that in present circumstances adequate control can be maintained over him by the restrictions which I have imposed. But let there be no misunderstanding. If for any reason, whether because of evasion of any restrictions imposed on him or because of any change in the situation, it became necessary, on grounds of public security, to bring him back to detention, medical considerations would not be an obstacle to the course dictated by the national interests.
  The restrictions which I decided to impose as a condition of his release are as follow: He is to reside at a specified house in the country and is prohibited from travelling more than seven miles from that house; he is to report in person to the police monthly; he is not to associate
  1432
  or directly or indirectly communicate with any person who has been a member of the British Union, other than members of his family or his wife's family; he is not to associate or directly or indirectly communicate with any other person for the purpose of promoting or assisting in the promotion of political activities; he is not to publish or cause or permit to be published any book, article, newspaper, news-letter, periodical, pamphlet, leaflet, poster or circular; he is not to make any public speech; he is not to give any interview to a journalist or other person for the purpose of publication. In short, as regards public activities, he is still subject to the same kind of restrictions as are imposed on persons in detention. These restrictions were communicated to him at the time of his release.
  In the case of Lady Mosley, medical considerations were not in question. But one of the main reasons for the detention of Lady Mosley was the risk that she might act as an agent for her husband if, while he was detained, she were left at liberty. With the release of her husband this ground for detention ceased to operate, and, having regard to this consideration together with the consideration affecting his health, I thought it right that both should be released from detention subject to the same restrictions.
  I mention—merely to dismiss it as an absurdity—the suggestion made in certain quarters that the decision to release at this date on medical grounds a man who stands for a doctrine almost universally detested in this country and whose influence is greatly diminished, indicated that there is a weakening on the part of the Government or myself in our determination to root out the evil cancer of Fascism. If I were to allow myself, in the exercise of the drastic power of detention without trial entrusted to me by Parliament as an exceptional war-time measure, to depart from the judicial frame of mind and to be influenced—not by considerations of the public safety—but by personal dislike or political opposition, I should no doubt be able to give entire satisfaction to many of my present critics, but I should be abusing the powers afforded by Regulation 18B and betraying the trust reposed in to me by Parliament that those powers would be exercised in a judicial spirit and solely

  1433
  for the purpose of national security. Any departure from these principles of administration would involve grave danger to the maintenance of constitutional democratic government and might set a precedent which in other circumstances no one would regret more than many of my critics of to-day.
  Mr. Ivor Thomas: Is it not clear that if a statement on those lines had been issued at the same time as the release of Sir Oswald Mosley the public would have got a very different impression of the whole matter; and is it not the case that the news was released to the public in the manner most prejudicial to the interests of the right hon. Gentleman's own Department?
  Mr. Morrison: I caused to be issued at the time a statement in which there were two points. One concerned the health grounds, and the other was that proper security restrictions would have to be put on him. If people did not believe me, I cannot help it. Secondly, if ever there was a power exercised by a Minister, which is both exceptional and on which Parliament has a primary responsibility for seeing that the Minister does his job well, this is that power, and as the House was meeting within a few days I thought—and I hope I was not wrong—that my first duty and my first obligation were to Parliament.
  Mr. Lipson: May I ask whether the decision to release Sir Oswald and Lady Mosley was made on the right hon. Gentleman's own individual responsibility or whether the Cabinet was consulted before it was done?
  Mr. Morrison: The responsibility is mine. The Regulation places the responsibility fairly on me. This is one of the awkward jobs that go with the office of Home Secretary. Any Home Secretary contemplating this decision would have been most foolish if he did not inform his Cabinet colleagues and consult them about it, and I did so.
  Commander Locker-Lampson: May I ask my right hon. Friend whether Sir Oswald Mosley is not Enemy No. 1; and whether he would have been released if he had not been a millionaire; and may I also ask my right hon. Friend whether he will allow five doctors from this House to examine Sir Oswald Mosley?
  Mr. Morrison: If I may say so, that question, with the insulting implication in the middle, is hardly worthy of an answer.
  Dr. Haden Guest: In view of my right hon. Friend's statement, which shows quite clearly that there was no immediate urgency for a few days about the release of Sir Oswald Mosley, may I ask him why he did not wait until Parliament was in session, in order that he might make a preliminary statement to Parliament instead of, as it appears, flouting the House of Commons?
  Mr. Morrison: I have often been attacked on this side of the House for being unwilling, in effect, to transfer my responsibility, either to a Committee of this House or to a committee outside. This responsibility is placed upon me, and just as I could not transfer my responsibility to Parliament for my action, if I keep people in, so I cannot do so if I let people out. Parliament has its remedy if it is dissatisfied. It can always get rid of a Minister. That is open to Parliament, but as long as I am discharging this function, I shall discharge it judicially, on my responsibility, and answer for my actions in the House.
  Sir Alfred Beit: May I ask a question which may appear somewhat technical? Is it not a fact that phlebitis in its various forms needs absolute quiet and rest; and how can it be said that a person suffering from that illness must have greater freedom of movement and opportunities for exercise?
  Mr. Morrison: I am not a doctor, but I understood that it requires both things—rest, and also vigorous exercise. I can only say that it is not for me to pronounce a medical opinion. It was for me either to accept this formidable body of medical opinion, or to take the responsibility of saying that these medical men were not telling the truth or were not competent. I did not feel that I could do that.
  Mr. Ellis Smith: I understood my right hon. Friend to say that he received representations. Has he at any time received representations with regard to this man, apart from the medical representations?
  Mr. Morrison: I have received representations about all sorts of people, and my hon. Friend would be surprised at where some of the representations come from.
  Mr. Gallacher: Following the highly unsatisfactory reply which the right hon. Gentleman has given, I want to ask him whether there is another case in this country, where such medical attention and such concern and care have been shown to anyone as in this case? Was such attention ever shown to Terence MacSwiney or Mr. Gandhi?
  Mr. Morrison: There have been other cases, both of 18B British subjects and enemy aliens, who have been released on health grounds, and who would not otherwise have been released.
  Mr. Gallacher: But did they get such medical attention?
  Mr. Morrison: But the medical attention is not wholly mine. As far as the prison doctor is concerned, certainly they all get the same medical attention. Let me remind the hon. Member, who is very indignant about this, that in the early days of the war there were very similar arguments against the war, both by his friends and—[Interruption].
  Several Hon. Members rose—
  Mr. Speaker: While I am on my feet hon. Members will please sit down. This is becoming a Debate, and I do not think it should go any further.
  Mr. Shinwell: Is it not clear that this matter cannot be properly discussed by process of question and answer, and may I ask the Deputy Prime Minister whether, in all the circumstances and for the purpose of clarification, it would not be more appropriate to have a Debate on this matter?
  Mr. Attlee: If there is a general desire in the House for a Debate on this matter, time can be provided. May I remind the House, however, that a message is expected to be received shortly desiring our attendance in another place? I have also to inform the House that before then it will be necessary for me to espy Strangers in order that a statement can be made in Secret Session. Therefore, I suggest that if further discussion is to take place on this matter, it should take place as a Debate, rather than by way of question and answer.
  Mr. Shinwell: On a point of Order. I am not aware that under the Standing Orders of this House—and this is a matter
  1436
  upon which I seek your guidance, Mr. Speaker—we are compelled automatically to disturb or suspend our proceedings when there is a knock at that door. If this House so decides, it is within its prerogative to continue to discuss this matter either by question and answer, or in debate. It is a matter for the House itself to decide I understand that this is the position.
  Mr. A. Bevan: Further to that point of Order and quite apart from the merits of the Debate, does not the form which this has taken show the undesirability of making such important pronouncements, except on a Motion for the Adjournment? May I respectfully submit that although on many occasions you, Mr. Speaker, have given Ministers great latitude in this matter, it is clear that Parliament is being injured by the abuse to which it is being subjected; and further may I suggest to the Government, again without regard to the merits of the matter, that as there is such universal interest in it—I use the word "interest" advisedly—it is to the good of Parliament that Parliament should adequately discuss the subject at the earliest possible moment? Further, ought we not to resist knocks on the door in order to discuss it?
  Mr. Speaker: In reply to the point of Order, while it may not be laid down in the Standing Orders, it would be regarded, I think, as an act of gross discourtesy if we refused to acknowledge the knocks at the door.

  POLICE POWERS AND DUTIES
  Sir Herbert Williamsasked the Home Secretary what steps he proposes to take to prevent the police acting in future as agents provocateurs, as they did in the case against Dr. Goldsmith, which was heard at the North London Police Court on 16th November?
  Mr. Peake: The limits within which the police are justified in giving opportunities to a person to commit an offence in order to obtain evidence against him are set out in the Report of the Royal Commission on Police Powers and Duties, which recognised that there are certain types of case in which it would be impossible for the police to carry out their duty of enforcing the law without the adoption of such methods. The police are, however, well

  1437
  aware that the Courts will always scrutinise most narrowly the evidence of any witness who can be represented as having encouraged or procured an offence which would not otherwise have been committed, and no action on the part of my right hon. Friend is required to remind the police of the great care which must be taken in cases of this kind. I may, perhaps, add that I am not aware of anything in the case to which my hon. Friend refers which need cause anxiety to a doctor who accepts in good faith a statement made to him by one of his patients.
  Sir H. Williams: In this case were not three men encouraged by the police to go to a doctor and make a statement which they and the police knew to be false? Is not this a most undesirable procedure?
  Mr. Peake: I think there is a clear distinction, which is well understood by the police, between incitement to commit an offence, which is wholly wrong and which is a disciplinary offence, and the employment of subterfuges in order to obtain evidence where habitual offences are reasonably suspected and there are no other means available to the police of procuring the necessary evidence.
  Sir H. Williams: Does my right hon. Friend think that the action of the police in this case was justified?
  Mr. Peake: We have noted the view of the learned magistrate, and any necessary action will be taken.
  Dr. Haden Guest: Does the right hon. Gentleman really think it is necessary to employ these offensive Gestapo methods against anyone in the medical profession? Does he not know that it is intensely resented that this should be done and that it is possible to find out what a doctor is doing otherwise than by this unfortunate procedure?
  Commander Sir Archibald Southby: Has my right hon. Friend's attention been called to the remarks of the learned magistrate who tried the case, and does he not think it most unfair to the police themselves that they should have to take this kind of action?
  Mr. Peake: I have said that we have taken note of the remarks of the learned magistrate and that any necessary action will be taken.
  Mr. Levy: Are we to understand that the Government recognise the employment of agents provocateurs in these cases, because that is what they are doing in a number of instances, and provoking the very evils which we are endeavouring to avoid?
  Mr. Peake: I have made it quite clear that the police would not countenance the employment of agents provocateurs. It it not a case where there was incitement to commit an offence.

  IRISH TURKEYS (DISTRIBUTION)
  Lieut.-Commander Hutchisonasked the Minister of Food (1) on what basis the Scottish quota of turkeys for Christmas from Northern Ireland is to be distributed;
  (2) whether his attention has been drawn to the protest made by butchers and poulterers in Edinburgh in regard to the proposed distribution of turkeys imported from Northern Ireland; and why the capital of Scotland is to be deprived of its fair allocation of these birds?
  Mr. Toucheasked the Minister of Food whether he is aware that many retail butchers in Surrey have had their applications for Irish turkeys refused on the ground that they were situated outside the Metropolitan police area; and whether he will arrange for a more equitable distribution?
  The Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Food (Mr. Mabane): As the answer is long, I will, with the permission of the House, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.
  Mr. Touche: Is it the case that retail shops in the home counties outside the Metropolitan Police area can supplies only if they are multiple shops?
  Mr. Mabane: If the hon. Member will read the answer, which is very comprehensive, he will appreciate that the matter with which he is concerned is limited to a very small proportion of all the supplies of turkeys.
  Following is the answer:
  Turkeys are available for the public this year from three sources of supplies, Great Britain, Eire, and Northern Ireland. Turkeys produced in Great Britain and

  1439
  shipped from Eire, which together represent four-fifths of the total supplies, will not be limited in the area of their distribution. The distribution of turkeys produced in Great Britain, which constitute about one-half of the total supply, will remain as at present uncontrolled, except in regard to price, and should be available for purchase through the ordinary channels provided producers, traders and the public co-operate to assist in a fair distribution.
  As regards turkeys from Eire, these are being sent, as was the case last year, to wholesalers in 11 large distributing centres, who will supply their retail and caterer customers wherever situated with their fair proportion based on pre-war purchases. The arrangements for the distribution of turkeys and other poultry shipped from Northern Ireland came into operation on 22nd November. It is understood that the turkeys expected to be received from Northern Ireland will amount to no more than one-fifth of the total supplies available in Great Britain. The Northern Ireland supplies will be directed to five Poultry Retailers' Buying Groups in Great Britain, which have been set up under the guidance of my Department by the trade organisations concerned. These groups will arrange for the allocation of supplies amongst poultry retailers in the Birmingham, Glasgow, Liverpool, and Manchester and Salford Food Office areas, and the London Metropolitan Police District. These areas, before the war, bought a large proportion of the Northern Ireland supplies.
  All traders licensed to sell poultry by retail in the selected areas are eligible to receive supplies, provided they handled more than reasonable minimum quantities in either 1938 or 1939 and undertake to comply with the rules of the group. One of these rules is that traders shall sell all goods received to householder customers and to caterers in the same relative proportions as in the datum year and, as far as practicable, share supplies amongst the purchasers as were supplied in the datum year. The control of the supplies from Northern Ireland has been introduced to ensures that a much larger proportion should reach the domestic consumer than in previous war years. It has not been practicable at the outset to make arrangements for the reception of supplies in a
  1440
  larger number of areas than those selected, or for the allocation of supplies to traders in districts adjacent to those areas.

  WINES AND SPIRITS (PRICES)
  Major Lyonsasked the Minister of Food whether his attention has been called to a resolution of the Price Regulation Committee for the North Midland region urging an enforceable controlled maximum price for wines and spirits and stating that this was pressed a year ago without action taken; and whether, in view of the ring stated to have been formed to the knowledge of this committee for still further public exploitation, he will inquire into this with a view to imposing such provisions for control as will effectively protect the public against this ramp?
  Mr. Mabane: I have seen reports in the Press of an announcement on this subject attributed to the Chairman of the North Midland Region Price Regulation Committee. If the Committee will furnish my Department with the information stated to be in their possession, I shall be glad to inquire into the matter as my hon. and gallant Friend desires.
  Major Lyons: Is it not a fact that 12 months have elapsed since they made their representations and that nothing has been done up to now to stop this ramp?
  Mr. Mabane: The hon. Member had better put that Question down.

  AGRICULTURAL WORKERS (CLOTHING AND BOOTS)
  Sir J. Mellorasked the President of the Board of Trade what special facilities are allowed to agricultural workers to obtain clothing and boots; and whether, having regard to wear, tear and exposure to weather, such facilities are calculated to be adequate by reference to current civilian standards?
  The President of the Board of Trade (Mr. Dalton): In addition to the ordinary civilian ration, agricultural workers received 10 extra coupons in the last rationing period and will receive a further 10 during the present period. They can also obtain oilskin clothing and milkingsmocks coupon-free against certificates issued by

  1441
  a county agricultural committee. High priority is granted to agricultural workers in the allocation of the limited supplies of rubber boots, for which buying permits are issued by the county agricultural committees.
  Sir J. Mellor: Will the right hon. Gentleman make further inquiries, as it is clear that there is a great hardship to agricultural workers?
  Mr. Dalton: I am not quite clear what the hon. Baronet wants me to inquire into. I have given particulars as to the treatment accorded in regard to coupons and clothing to agricultural workers. I have them very much in mind and I have no evidence that the arrangements are proving inadequate.
  Sir J. Mellor: Will the right hon. Gentleman inquire whether agricultural workers obtain sufficient clothing for replacement?
  Mr. Dalton: Perhaps the hon. Baronet will give me any evidence that he has.

  RETAIL FURNITURE DEALERS (CONVICTIONS)
  Mr. Robertsonasked the President of the Board of Trade whether he will take immediate steps to apply to the court for an order to close the Jays Campbell group of retail furniture shops who have been convicted of a long series of price-control overcharges, resulting in fines ranging from £50 to £2,470, which have had no effect because of the large profits derived from illegal trading?
  Mr. Dalton: Between April and November, 1943, five convictions, under the Goods and Services (Price Control) Acts, were obtained against one firm and four convictions against another in this group of furniture dealers. I am advised that, until proceedings are instituted for further offences and convictions have been obtained, the courts cannot make closing orders under the Act of 1941. If such proceedings are instituted, I shall certainly consider asking the Attorney-General, or, if the proceedings are in Scotland, the Lord Advocate, to take action.
  Mr. Robertson: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the victims of these parasites are mainly people who have been bombed out and have lost their furniture,
  1442
  or young married people, and is he also aware that this group—
  Mr. Speaker: The hon. Member is giving information and not asking for it.

  WOMEN WORKERS (MATERNITY)
  Mr. William Brownasked the Prime Minister whether the Government have now considered the view expressed by the Select Committee on National Expenditure in paragraph 48 of its Third Report, that the question of financial assistance to women workers shortly before, during and after confinement, requires immediate attention; and whether he will introduce emergency legislation to enable women workers to draw unemployment benefit for two months before confinement and for a suitable period thereafter, to be determined on medical advice, in order to safeguard their health and that of their children?
  The Deputy Prime Minister (Mr. Attlee): Inquiries have been instituted by the Government through a number of sources to ascertain the extent to which women engaged in industry do in fact remain at work to a late stage in pregnancy or return to work too Noon after childbirth. It is anticipated chat these inquiries will be completed in time to enable a full statement to be made as to the information obtained and the Government's decision early in the New Year.

  DODECANESE ISLANDS
  Mr. Ammonasked the Prime Minister whether he has any statement to make concerning the military situation in the Dodecanese Islands?
  Sir H. Williamsasked the Prime Minister whether he has any statement to make on the situation in the Dodecanese?
  Mr. Hoggasked the Prime Minister whether he has any statement to make on the operations in the Dodecanese?
  Mr. Attlee: Perhaps my hon. Friends would be good enough to await the statement which it is proposed to make on the next Sitting Day.
  At the end of Questions:
  Mr. Shinwell: May I ask the Deputy Prime Minister a question on what he said

  1443
  about the reply to certain Questions on the Paper relating to the Dodecanese?
  Mr. Speaker: Perhaps it would be better if the hon. Member waited until the Secret Session to ask his question.
  Mr. Shinwell: It is not on the merits of the matter but merely to know from the Deputy Prime Minister, who said that these matters would be referred to at the next Sitting, how it is possible, since Questions will not be permissible at the next Sitting?
  Mr. Attlee: Questions are already on the Paper. It is not possible to give a full answer at Question time. A full statement will be made in the course of the Debate.

  MINISTER WITHOUT PORTFOLIO (DUTIES)
  Mr. Molsonasked the Prime Minister whether he will define the duties and functions of the Minister without Portfolio and his relationship to the Minister of Reconstruction in the War Cabinet?
  Mr. Attlee: The Minister without Portfolio (Sir William Jowitt) will assist Lord Woolton in carrying out his duties as Minister of Reconstruction.
  Mr. Molson: In what way do these duties differ from those of an Under-Secretary or Parliamentary Secretary when the Minister is in another place?
  Major Petherick: Is the right hon. Gentleman really satisfied that there is any necessity for the continued existence of the Minister without Portfolio now that he has even less of a portfolio than before?
  Mr. A. Bevan: Is it the intention of the Government in the Debate on the Address to make a fuller statement on the matter?
  Mr. Attlee: Certainly, if the matter is raised in Debate there will be a full opportunity of discussing it.
  Mr. Bevan: In the Government's own statement on the Address, is it intended to make a fuller statement so that this very important office may be considered in all its implications?
  Mr. Molson: May I have an answer to my question?
  Mr. Attlee: I should like to see it on the Paper.
  Mr. Kirkwood: Is it not possible for them to hound all the Labour Ministers out of the Cabinet?

  OLD AGE PENSIONS
  Mr. Kirbyasked the Prime Minister whether he proposes to give time for the consideration of the Petition which was presented in the House on 2nd November, 1943, in which 4,090,000 persons prayed for an increase in payments made to old age pensioners; and what is the Government's policy in regard thereto?
  Mr. Attlee: There will be opportunities for discussing this question in the course of the forthcoming Session. As at present advised, I do not think it is necessary to fix a day for the purpose.
  Mr. Kirby: Have the Government any policy in regard to this matter, and, if so, when will an announcement be made?
  Mr. Attlee: Perhaps the hon. Member will wait for the statement.
  Sir H. Williamsasked the Minister of Health whether he can furnish an estimate of the present annual increase in the number of persons of old age pension age, that is to say, of men over 65 years of age and women over 60 years of age?
  The Minister of Health (Mr. Willink): The increases in the number of men over 65 were, during each of the past two years, estimated at about 50,000 and 60,000 respectively. These figures represent an average percentage increase of about 3¼ per cent. per annum. Comparable figures for women over 60 were about 93,000 and 102,000 and 2.9 per cent. respectively.

  POST-WAR HOUSING (MINISTERIAL RESPONSIBILITY)
  Sir Irving Alberyasked the Prime Minister whether he will explain the Ministerial chain of responsibility for urgent post-war housing and state which Minister will be directly or mainly responsible for this action?
  Mr. Attlee: The primary responsibility will continue to rest with the Minister of Health and the Secretary of State for Scotland, the Ministry of Works giving to these two Departments technical advice on design, methods of construction and

  1445
  building materials. The proposals for a post-war housing programme must, of course, be co-ordinated with the rest of the Government's plans for reconstruction in the years immediately following the end of the war, and this will be one of the duties of my noble Friend the Minister of Reconstruction.
  Sir I. Albery: May we understand that in that case the Minister of Town and Country Planning is not concerned?
  Mr. Attlee: The Minister of Town and Country Planning is not primarily concerned with this particular function.
  Sir I. Albery: Are we not compelled to understand that no Minister is actually and directly responsible for post-war housing?
  Mr. Attlee: No, Sir, quite the contrary.

  GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS

    Women (Equal Pay)
    Sir D. Hackingasked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he is aware that women civil servants are frequently doing exactly the same work as men civil servants and in many cases performing even more important and responsible duties and yet are in receipt of much lower salaries; and whether he will recommend the appointment of a select or departmental committee to institute a comprehensive inquiry into existing anomalies amongst men and women civil servants, both permanent and temporary, with a view to the adoption of the principle now becoming common amongst industrial workers of equal pay for equal work?
    The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Sir John Anderson): As was stated by my predecessor on 1st July this year in answer to the hon. Member for Rugby (Mr. W. Brown), the Government are not prepared at present to adopt the principle of equal pay for women employed in the common classes of the Civil Service.
    Sir D. Hacking: If it is right and proper for Members of this House and Ministers to receive equal pay for equal work, irrespective—
    Mr. Speaker: The right hon. Gentleman is putting an argument and not a question.
    Sir D. Hacking: Yes, Mr. Speaker, it is a question I am asking. If that is right and proper, surely it is right—
    Hon. Members: Order.
    Mrs. Tate: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that the United States of America, Russia, China, Brazil, Mexico, Greece, Jugo-slavia and Czecho-Slovakia give equal payment for equal service, and does he not think we should rise above the level of Japan and Germany and our co-belligerent Italy?
    Sir J. Anderson: I thank my hon. Friend for that information.
    Mr. W. Brown: Is the Minister not aware that this House has on two occasions passed Resolutions in favour of the application of the principle of equal pay for equal work, and may I ask what point there is in this House coming to decisions if the Government do not act upon them?
    Sir J. Anderson: I would refer my hon. Friend to the statement made in this House by a predecessor of mine after one of the incidents to which he referred.
    Mr. Pritt: Should not the right hon. Gentleman be encouraged to reconsider the whole matter, having regard to the Government's demonstration of equality between the sexes in the case of Sir Oswald and Lady Mosley?

    Man-power
    Mr. Keelingasked the Financial Sercetary to the Treasury whether he will name the Departments in which the full utilisation of man power and the elimination of wasteful methods are discussed by the Whitley Councils?
    The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr. Assheton): Collaboration with the staff in this field takes various forms according to the circumstances in each Department at various times; in war-time especially it is often effected by way of informal contacts rather than by the use of Whitley Councils or their sub-committees. Inquiry has been made of the 27 Departments whose staff number r,000 or more whether they use inter alia the method of more or less formal discussion under Whitley machinery in handling man-power problems, and I am circulating a list of the Departments where there is such discussion.
    Mr. W. Brown: Is not the Minister aware that trade unions are profoundly dissatis-

    1447
    fied with the co-operation they receive from the administration in the handling of man-power problems in the public service and the saving of unnecessary labour?
    Mr. Assheton: I am afraid that I cannot accept the implications in that question. If the hon. Member looks at the list, he will see how widespread the consultations are.
    Following are the Departments:

    Post Office.

    Ministry of Supply.

    Admiralty.

    Ministry of Labour and National Service.

    Air Ministry.

    Board of Inland Revenue.

    Ministry of Aircraft Production.

    Ministry of War Transport.

    Ministry of Works.

    Board of Customs and Excise.

    Ministry of Pensions.

    Assistance Board.

    Ministry of Health.

    Board of Trade.

    Ministry of Agriculture and Fisheries.

    Ministry of Fuel and Power.

    National Savings Committee.

  UNITED KINGDOM COMMERCIAL CORPORATION (EXPENSES)
  Mr. Evelyn Walkdenasked the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many luncheons have been given by the United Kingdom Commercial Corporation at the Savoy Hotel, and other West End hotels, during the past six months; what is the total cost and the average cost per guest for food and drinks; what purpose the holding of such functions serves; and whether he will reconsider such expenditure from public funds which is contrary to the national interest on grounds of economy?
  Sir J. Anderson: A Question on this subject was asked by my hon. Friend the Member for North Battersea (Mr. Douglas) on 27th July last, and I would refer my hon. Friend to the answer given by the late Chancellor of the Exchequer on that occasion.
  Mr. Walkden: Has the Minister no power to stop this inexcusable form of waste, which seems to do nothing other than glorify the officials of the U.K.C.C.?
  Sir J. Anderson: I rather deprecate the implications contained in that question. This Corporation is performing a very valuable public service, as my predecessor stated in the reply to which I have
  1448
  referred. These arrangements are not made without some consultation, and I am quite sure it would not be possible for the Corporation to go on doing the work it is doing if it were subjected to the close and detailed control which my hon. Friend's Question seeks to apply.
  Sir H. Williams: Is not the right hon. Gentleman virtually the sole shareholder in this Corporation, and should he not keep a closer eye on it, having regard to the great criticisms which have been expressed?
  Sir J. Anderson: I am not aware of those great criticisms. It is the fact that the Government are the sole shareholder, but it would be quite wrong to suppose that the Government do not keep themselves adequately informed of what is going on.

  FIRE-GUARD DUTIES (SUBSISTENCE ALLOWANCES)
  Mr. Evelyn Walkdenasked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury the total cost to the Exchequer for the last financial year of subsistence allowances paid to fire-guards under the Fire Prevention (Business Premises) Order and other Statutory Orders under which subsistence allowance is payable for fireguard duties?
  Mr. Assheton: Reimbursement of subsistence allowances made to fire-guards is made by a number of different authorities and Departments, and it will take some little time to obtain the information asked for in the Question. I am making inquiries and will communicate with the hon. Member as soon as possible.

  GENERALS AMBROSIO AND ROATTA
  Mr. Manderasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he has any further statement to make with reference to the cases of Generals Ambrosio and Roatta?
  The Minister of State (Mr. Richard Law): I understand that both Generals have been relieved of their posts.
  Mr. Mander: Can my right hon. Friend say who have been appointed in their places?
  Mr. Law: I believe Marshal Messe has been appointed.
  Mr. John Dugdale: Is it to be understood that they have only been removed on medical grounds and that no disgrace at all attaches to their removal, as reported in the newspapers?
  Mr. Law: I know nothing whatever of medical grounds. To the best of my belief they have been removed at the request of the Allied Commander-in-Chief.
  Commander Locker-Lampson: Will Sir Oswald Mosley be appointed in their place?

  SWISS CORRESPONDENCE (GERMAN CENSORSHIP)
  Mr. Kirbyasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he is aware that business letters from firms in Switzerland sent by air mail to firms in this country travel via Stuttgart, Germany, where they are censored by the enemy; whether similar letters sent to Switzerland from Great Britain are also subject to being read and censored by the Germans; and, if so, is he taking steps to ensure that in future no such letters shall pass through enemy hands?
  The Assistant Postmaster-General (Mr. Grimston): I have been asked to reply. It is not possible to get mails into or out of Switzerland without their coming under enemy control. The public in this country have been warned that the mails to Switzerland are liable to censorship by the enemy and advised to exercise the utmost discretion as to what they send and write. Correspondence for Switzerland is subject to censorship in this country before despatch.
  Mr. Kirby: Is it not possible for the British Government to approach the Swiss Government with a view to getting the mails transferred via Spain or Portugal?
  Mr. Grimston: If my hon. Friend will accompany me to the map room afterwards, he will see that it is quite impossible to get letters to and from Switzerland without their passing through enemy territory.

  LEBANON (SITUATION)
  Mr. Astorasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he can make a statement on the situation in the Lebanon?
  Mr. Hoggasked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he has any statement to make on the situation in Syria and Lebanon?
  Mr. Law: His Majesty's Government have been gravely concerned at the development of the recent dispute between the French Committee of National Liberation and the Lebanese Government, in the course of which the French Delegate General in Beirut ordered the arrest and imprisonment of the newly elected President and member:, of the Lebanese Government. Great public excitement was aroused both in Lebanon itself and in other Middle East countries, where the arrests were regarded as unjustified by the circumstances.
  The interest of His Majesty's Government in this dispute is two-fold. First of all, we have endorsed the promises of independence given to the Lebanese people by General Catroux in 1941. His Majesty's Government have followed with sympathy and interest the subsequent development of constitutional government in the Lebanon. Secondly, the Lebanon is of vital importance to the war effort both as as operational base and from the point of view of communications. Any threat of a breakdown of law and order is therefore of direct concern to His Majesty's Government.
  Our overriding desire, which we have made clear to both parties, has been to secure a solution of the dispute which would enable calm to be restored and constitutional development to be resumed in an orderly and agreed manner as soon as possible. General Catroux, who has gone specially to Beirut and has taken the situation in hand on behalf of French Committee, is in close touch with Mr. Casey, the Minister of State Resident in Cairo, and with His Majesty's Minister in Beirut who have explained our views to him. We have also explained our views direct to the French Committee in Algiers.
  I am glad to say that the Lebanese President and Ministers have been released, that the President has been

  1451
  reinstated and that the French Delegate General has been recalled. His Majesty's Government welcome these developments. At the same time they hope that they will lead to further progress and to the re-establishment of constitutional government. The American and Soviet Governments have been kept fully informed throughout.
  Mr. Astor: Is my right hon. Friend aware of the deep satisfaction at the part played by the Minister of State, by our Minister and by General Catroux in clearing up the situation; and is he aware that, if His Majesty's Government took any similar action in Iraq or Egypt, they would get exactly the same opposition as has been displayed in this matter in this House?
  Mr. Hogg: While expressing my satisfaction at the reply, may I ask my right hon. Friend to make it clear that, in view of the fact that the Lebanese people are among the most gifted of the Arabs, no undue pressure will be brought upon them to enter into any treaty with any particular Power as a prerequisite to their complete freedom?
  Mr. Law: I think that our views on this matter have been made quite clear to both parties in the dispute. As I say, we are most anxious that the constitutional development of the Lebanon should proceed in as orderly a manner and as rapidly as possible.
  Mr. Shinwell: Will the right hon. Gentleman make it abundantly clear that, apart from purely military or strategic reasons in this theatre of war, there is no intention on the part of the British Government and those associated with the British Government, to restrict the purely political operations of the French Committee of National Liberation?
  Mr. Law: I think that is abundantly clear in my statement. I explained fully what the position is. It is that we wish to see the pledges that we have endorsed implemented, and we wish to see our military position fully safeguarded. Obviously we have no desire to get any kind of political advantage for ourselves whatever.
  Mr. A. Bevan: Is it intended that we should extend our enthusiasm for self-government to the British Empire, or
  1452
  will it be only at the expense of the French Empire?
  Colonel Sir A. Lambert Ward: Has my right hon. Friend any information as to the number of Lebanese citizens who lost their lives as a result of these disturbances?
  Mr. Law: I think that is another question altogether.

  CYPRUS (COST OF LIVING)
  Mr. Mathersasked the Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he will make a statement regarding efforts to check the increasing cost of living in Cyprus, and the treatment of persons who demonstrated publicly against the Government's failure effectively to prevent hardship arising from this cause?
  The Secretary of State for the Colonies (Colonel Oliver Stanley): I have nothing to add to the statements made by my hon. Friend the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Dominions on 13th October and by myself on 3rd November in reply to similar Questions by the hon. Member.
  Mr. Mathers: Does not the right hon. and gallant Gentleman realise that an instrument passed a number of years ago for an entirely different purpose is hardly one to use in what is quite a constitutional effort to have attention drawn to a serious grievance in the island?
  Colonel Stanley: It is true that the Measure has been in force for some time, but even had such a Measure not been in force before, it would have been necessary in the war-time conditions of Cyprus to introduce it.

  WEST-END BUILDING (REPAIRS)
  Mr. Norman Bowerasked the Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Works whether, and on what grounds, a licence has been granted for the repainting of the building on the south corner of King Street and St. James's Street, S.W.1, the premises of the Motor Union Insurance Company, Limited?
  The Parliamentary Secretary to the Ministry of Works (Mr. Hicks): The District Surveyor of the London County

  1453
  Council required the owners of the building to take immediate action in respect of the stucco work of the building, a portion of the cornice having fallen and injured a woman. Licences were issued for the necessary repairs to the cornices, balcony, parapet and stucco work generally, including painting to prevent further deterioration by damp penetration.

  NEW MEMBER SWORN
  Francis William Beech, Esquire, for the Borough of Woolwich (West Division).
  NEW MEMBER MAKES AFFIRMATION
  James Edward Glanville, Esquire, for the County of Durham (Consett Division).

SECRET SESSION
Mr. Attlee: I beg to call your attention, Mr. Speaker, to the fact that Strangers are present.
Mr. Gallacher: On a point of Order.
Mr. Speaker: As soon as Strangers are espied, the Question has to be put.
Whereupon Mr. SPEAKER,pursuant to Standing Order No. 89, put the Question, That Strangers be ordered to withdraw."
Question agreed to.
Strangers withdrew accordingly.
The House subsequently resumed in Public Session.

PROROGATION

  HIS MAJESTY'S MOST GRACIOUS SPEECH
  Message to attend the Lords Commissioners.
  The House went; and, having returned—
  Mr. Speaker(standing in the Clerk's place at the Table): I have to acquaint the House that the House has been to the House of Peers, where a Commission under the Great Seal was read. The LORD CHANCELLOR, being one of the Lords Commissioners, delivered His Majesty's Most Gracious Speech to both Houses of Parliament, in pursuance of His Majesty's Commands, as followeth:
  My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
  During the past year My peoples and those of My Allies have been brought, by God's providence, to a turning point in their unceasing fight for freedom. The mounting strength of the United Nations has enabled them to wrest the initiative from the enemy and to take rite offensive in all parts of the world.
  Our common purpose has been furthered by an ever closer co-operation between the United Nations—above all between My Governments and those of our Allies in the United States and the Soviet Union. My Prime Minister has three times met in conference the President of the United States. The Foreign Secretary has recently returned from concerting with M. Molotov
  1476
  and Mr. Cordell Hull plans for the joint conduct of the war and for a united approach to the problems of the transition from war to peace. It is a matter for gratification that the Chinese Government associated themselves with one of the more important instruments resulting from that Conference. The results of this most fruitful meeting in Moscow have brought new hope to all who look to a speedy victory over our enemies and a just and enduring peace. I rejoice in the warmth of the reception accorded to My Ministers in Washington and Moscow and in the historic city of Quebec in My Dominion of Canada.
  In the various theatres of war throughout the world My Navy, Army and Air Force have fought in, close and continuous fellowship with their comrades from My Dominions and India and My Colonial Empire, and with the forces of the United States and My other Allies. Their united efforts have produced solid and striking achievements in every theatre of war.
  The dangerous attack of the U-boats has been largely broken by our Navies and Air Forces, whose continued success rejoices all our hearts. Their task will be notably eased by the facilities granted by My oldest Ally, Portugal, in her Atlantic islands. Over Germany itself our Air Forces are striking increasingly heavy blows at the heart of the enemy, in the face of the most desperate opposition. Throughout Europe a mounting tide of resistance is rising against the oppressor.
  In the Mediterranean resounding victories have been won. The enemy has been driven from the soil of Africa; Sicily, Sardinia and Corsica have been liberated; the Italian fleet is in our hands; one-third of Italy has been occupied; and My troops and those of the United States confront the foe on the mainland of Europe. The Italian people's repudiation of their false leader and their readiness to strike against their German oppressors have shaken the guilty confederacy of our enemies to its foundation.
  It was a special pleasure to Me to visit My Navies, Armies and Air Forces in the midst of these memorable operations and Myself to witness their courage and ardour.
  I continue with My people to watch with admiration the increasing successes of the armies of our heroic Russian Allies, and rejoice with them in the liberation of great regions from the ravages of our common foe.
  In the Far East the advance of the enemy has been halted and the offensive of the United Nations has begun. I trust that this may soon bring some relief to our Chinese Allies, whose long struggle against the Japanese invader has inspired our deepest sympathy. In South-East Asia a new Command has been created and new Commanders appointed. In the Western Pacific freedom has already been restored to some of the islands which were overrun by the enemy. I look forward to the day when we shall, with God's help, restore to all My peoples the blessings of peace and progress.
  These successful operations in all theatres of war have been sustained and supplied by the untiring efforts of the men and women working in the industries and services essential to the prosecution of the war—in the great manufacturing industries, in agriculture, in the mines, and in transport by land and by sea. For the third successive year we have been blessed with a bounteous harvest.
  The splendid courage and determination of My merchant seamen and those of the United Nations, and of the men of the fishing fleets, with the untiring aid of the minesweepers, have continued to assure the flow of supplies essential to the prosecution of the war and to the life of My peoples.
  I have also watched with pride the fortitude and endurance shown by those whose duties, though no less necessary, are less directly concerned with the activities of war—the women at home, so many of whom combine their domestic duties with other work, and the men and women working in the industries supplying the essential civil needs of My people.
  The perseverance and industry of My people in the United Kingdom has been emulated by My peoples in My Dominions and Colonial territories and in India. I trust that the special hardships which the war has lately brought to many among My Indian subjects will
  1478
  be relieved; and that the steps My Government have already taken will assist the Governments in India in relieving the grave shortage of food in certain areas of India.
  The unity of My peoples with those of My Allies has contined to hearten our friends and confound our enemies. Once again we have had the advantage of the wise counsel of My Prime Minister of the Union of South Africa; and several of My Ministers from other Dominions have also been able to visit us, with beneficial results. The Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs has visited My Dominion of Canada and Newfoundland; and the Secretary of State for the Colonies has recently returned from a visit to My territories in East and West Africa. We have been happy to welcome here many distinguished members of the United States Administration.
  Matters of great import for the future of the United Nations and of freedom loving peoples everywhere have been considered at international discussions; and My Ministers here have welcomed the opportunity of exploratory conversations on the future of civil air transport with representatives from My Commonwealth and Empire.
  The Treaty for the abolition of extraterritorial rights has been successfully concluded with My Chinese Ally. In the summer we had the pleasure of welcoming Dr. T.V. Soong, the Chinese Minister for Foreign Affairs, on a brief visit, which unhappily was overshadowed by the death of the Chinese President, Dr. Lin Sen.
  My Government have welcomed the establishment of the French Committee of National Liberation at Algiers, and have recognised it as the body qualified to ensure the conduct of the French effort in the war within the framework of inter-Allied co-operation. We look forward to the liberation of France and her restoration to the ranks of the Great Powers.
  Members of the House of Commons,
  I thank you for the provision that you have made towards the cost of the war. The ready support given by My people to the measures you have adopted has ensured that the very heavy

  1479
  expenditure required by the war has been met with due regard to the social and economic interests of My country.
  My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
  It is a matter of especial satisfaction to The Queen and Myself that Parliament has complied with My request that the Regency Act should be so amended as to enable Our beloved daughter Princess Elizabeth, when she attains the age of eighteen, to serve as one of the Counsellors of State should occasion arise for their appointment.
  I have given My Assent to a number of measures which have been brought before you during the course of the year. These have included Acts providing for the reorganisation of My Foreign Service, for strengthening public control over the planning of town and country, and for the development of hydro-electric power in Scotland. Legislation has been passed to introduce a new system of taxation of wages and salaries, which will be of substantial convenience to all employees, particularly those whose earnings are liable to fluctuation. An Act has been passed to facilitate electoral registration under war conditions. Provision has been made for the development of the catering trades and for regulating the conditions of employment in those trades, for improving the administration of pensions, and for further temporary increases in the rates of workmen's compensation.
  Steps have also been taken to establish machinery for dealing with questions of wages and conditions in the coat-mining industry.
  My Government have taken the necessary action to ratify the International Labour Conventions concerning
  1480
  the Regulation of Written Contracts of Employment of Indigenous Workers and Penal Sanctions for Breaches of Contracts of Employment by Indigenous Workers.
  With you, I thank Almighty God for having brought us victoriously through a year of peril and anxiety, and I pray that His blessing may attend you at all times.
  Then a Commission for Proroguing the Parliament was read in the House of Lords.
  After which the LORD CHANCELLOR said:
  "My Lords and Members of the House of Commons:
  By virtue of His Majesty's Commission, under the Great Seal, to us and other Lords directed, and now read, we do, in His Majesty's Name and in obedience to His Majesty's Commands, prorogue this Parliament to Wednesday, the twenty-fourth day of November, one thousand nine hundred and forty-three, to be then here holden; and this Parliament is accordingly prorogued Until Wednesday, the twenty-fourth day of November, one thousand nine hundred and forty-three."
  Mr. Speaker: I propose to dispense with the usual ceremony of shaking hands, in view of the shortness of the period of Prorogation, in accordance with the precedent set by my predecessor.
  End of the Eighth Session (opened 11th November, 1942) of the Thirty-Seventh Parliament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, in the Seventh Year of the Reign of His Majesty King George the Sixth.

GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS
  Ministry of Labour (Welfare Staff)
  Ministry of Labour (Welfare Staff)
  Requisitioned Buildings, London
  Requisitioned Buildings, London
  Overseas Trade Department
  Overseas Trade Department
  MILITARY SERVICE (THATCHERS)
  MILITARY SERVICE (THATCHERS)
BRITISH ARMY
  Home Guard
  Home Guard
  Requisitioned Guest House, Wales
  Requisitioned Guest House, Wales
  Lectures, India
  Lectures, India
  Troops (Employment)
  Troops (Employment)
  Pay Offices (Civilian Personnel)
  Pay Offices (Civilian Personnel)
  WEST INDIES (LOCAL FORCES)
  WEST INDIES (LOCAL FORCES)
  TOLL-GATE, PENARTH
  TOLL-GATE, PENARTH
  CHINA (POST-WAR ECONOMIC ASSISTANCE)
  CHINA (POST-WAR ECONOMIC ASSISTANCE)
  SUN-RAY LAMP (ALBION WORKS, BILSTON)
  SUN-RAY LAMP (ALBION WORKS, BILSTON)
  POST-WAR PLANS, LONDON (PLANETARIUM)
  POST-WAR PLANS, LONDON (PLANETARIUM)
FOOD SUPPLIES
  National Milk Scheme
  National Milk Scheme
  Irish Turkeys (Distribution)
  Irish Turkeys (Distribution)
  Potatoes (Purchase Contracts)
  Potatoes (Purchase Contracts)
  Ministry of Food (Trading Activities)
  Ministry of Food (Trading Activities)
NATIONAL FINANCE
  Land Tax (Net Receipt)
  Land Tax (Net Receipt)
  Income Tax and Sur-Tax
  Income Tax and Sur-Tax
  Tobacco Duty (Old Age Pensioners)
  Tobacco Duty (Old Age Pensioners)
  War Damage Claims
  War Damage Claims
  MEDICAL POLICY ASSOCIATION (BULLETIN)
  MEDICAL POLICY ASSOCIATION (BULLETIN)
  BRITISH SUBJECTS (COLOUR DISCRIMINATION)
  BRITISH SUBJECTS (COLOUR DISCRIMINATION)
  COMBINED OPERATIONS TRAINING (EVACUATED AREA)
  COMBINED OPERATIONS TRAINING (EVACUATED AREA)
  POWER OF ARREST (DEFENCE REGULATION 88c)
  POWER OF ARREST (DEFENCE REGULATION 88c)
COAL INDUSTRY
  Absenteeism
  Absenteeism
  Domestic Supplies (Allocation)
  Domestic Supplies (Allocation)
  CONTROL OF HOUSE COAL DISTRIBUTION
  CONTROL OF HOUSE COAL DISTRIBUTION
  Government and Local Government Offices (Supplies)
  Government and Local Government Offices (Supplies)
  Shifts Worked
  Shifts Worked
AGRICULTURE
  Dairy Herds (Inspection)
  Dairy Herds (Inspection)
  Thatching (Instruction)
  Thatching (Instruction)
  Tenancies (Termination)
  Tenancies (Termination)
  Women's Land Army
  Women's Land Army
  Post-War Policy
  Post-War Policy
  Prices
  Prices
ROYAL AIR FORCE
  Recruitment (Eire and Northern Ireland)
  Recruitment (Eire and Northern Ireland)
  Canteen Prices, Middle East
  Canteen Prices, Middle East
  AGRICULTURAL AND SPORTING ESTATES, SCOTLAND
  AGRICULTURAL AND SPORTING ESTATES, SCOTLAND
POST OFFICE
  Telephone Call Boxes, London Railway Termini
  Telephone Call Boxes, London Railway Termini
  Telephone Directory, London
  Telephone Directory, London

Preamble
The House met, The LORD CHANCELLOR on the Woolsack.
The Lord Cullen of Ashbourne—Sat first in Parliament after the death of his father.

SECRET SESSION.
LORD SNELL: My Lords, I beg to move that the House do sit in Secret Session.
Moved, That the House do now sit in Secret Session.—(Lord Snell.)
On Question, Motion agreed to, and ordered accordingly.
The Official Reporter then withdrew.
House in Secret Session.
Sitting resumed in Open Session.

PROROGATION: HIS MAJESTY'S SPEECH.
And afterwards His Majesty's most gracious Speech was delivered to both Houses of Parliament by the Lord Chancellor (in pursuance of His Majesty's Command) as followeth:
"My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
"During the past year my peoples and those of my Allies have been brought, by God's providence, to a turning point in their unceasing fight for freedom. The mounting strength of the United Nations has enabled them to wrest the initiative from the enemy and to take the offensive in all parts of the world.
"Our common purpose has been furthered by an ever closer co-operation between the United Nations—above all between my Governments and those of our Allies in the United States and the Soviet Union. My Prime Minister has three times met in conference the President of the United States. The Foreign Secretary has recently returned from concerting with M. Molotov and Mr. Cordell Hull plans for the joint conduct of the war and for a united
702
approach to the problems of the transition from war to peace. It is a matter for gratification that the Chinese Government associated themselves with one of the more important instruments resulting from that Conference. The results of this most fruitful meeting in Moscow have brought new hope to all who look to a speedy victory over our enemies and a just and enduring peace. I rejoice in the warmth of the reception accorded to my Ministers in Washington and Moscow and in the historic city of Quebec in my Dominion of Canada.
"In the various theatres of war throughout the world my Navy, Army and Air Force have fought in close and continuous fellowship with their comrades from my Dominions and India and my Colonial Empire, and with the forces of the United States and my other Allies. Their united efforts have produced solid and striking achievements in every theatre of war.
"The dangerous attack of the U-boats has been largely broken by our Navies and Air Forces, whose continued success rejoices all our hearts. Their task will be notably eased by the facilities granted by my oldest Ally, Portugal, in her Atlantic islands. Over Germany itself our Air Forces are striking increasingly heavy blows at the heart of the enemy, in the face of the most desperate opposition. Throughout Europe a mounting tide of resistance is rising against the oppressor.
"In the Mediterranean resounding victories have been won. The enemy has been driven from the soil of Africa; Sicily, Sardinia and Corsica have been liberated; the Italian fleet is in our hands; one-third of Italy has been occupied; and my troops and those of the United States confront the foe on the mainland of Europe. The Italian people's repudiation of their false leader and their readiness to strike against their German oppressors have shaken the guilty confederacy of our enemies to its foundation.
"It was a special pleasure to me to visit my Navies, Armies and Air Forces in the midst of these memorable operations and myself to witness their courage and ardour.
"I continue with my people to watch with admiration the increasing successes of the Armies of our heroic Russian

703
Allies, and rejoice with them in the liberation of great regions from the ravages of our common foe.
"In the Far East the advance of the enemy has been halted and the offensive of the United Nations has begun. I trust that this may soon bring some relief to our Chinese Allies, whose long struggle against the Japanese invader has inspired our deepest sympathy. In South-East Asia a new Command has been created and new Commanders appointed. In the Western Pacific freedom has already been restored to some of the islands which were overrun by the enemy. I look forward to the day when we shall, with God's help, restore to all my peoples the blessings of peace and progress.
"These successful operations in all theatres of war have been sustained and supplied by the untiring efforts of the men and women working in the industries and services essential to the prosecution of the war—in the great manufacturing industries, in agriculture, in the mines, and in transport by land and by sea. For the third successive year we have been blessed with a bounteous harvest.
"The splendid courage and determination of my merchant seamen and those of the United Nations, and of the men of the fishing fleets, with the untiring aid of the minesweepers, have continued to assure the flow of supplies essential to the prosecution of the war and to the life of my peoples.
"I have also watched with pride the fortitude and endurance shown by those whose duties, though no less necessary, are less directly concerned with the activities of war—the women at home, so many of whom combine their domestic duties with other work, and the men and women working in the industries supplying the essential civil needs of my people.
"The perseverance and industry of my people in the United Kingdom has been emulated by my peoples in my Dominions and Colonial territories and in India. I trust that the special hardships which the war has lately brought to many among my Indian subjects will be relieved; and that the steps my Government have already taken will assist the Governments in India in re-
704
lieving the grave shortage of food in certain areas of India.
"The unity of my peoples with those of my Allies has continued to hearten our friends and confound our enemies. Once again we have had the advantage-of the wise counsel of my Prime Minister of the Union of South Africa; and several of my Ministers from other Dominions have also been able to visit us, with beneficial results. The Secretary of State for Dominion Affairs has visited my Dominion of Canada and Newfoundland; and the Secretary of State for the Colonies has recently returned from a visit to my territories in East and West Africa. We have been happy to welcome here many distinguished members of the United States Administration.
"Matters of great import for the future of the United Nations and of freedom-loving peoples everywhere have been considered at international discussions; and my Ministers here have welcomed the opportunity of exploratory conversations on the future of civil air transport with representatives from my Commonwealth and Empire.
"The Treaty for the abolition of extraterritorial rights has been successfully concluded with my Chinese Ally. In the summer we had the pleasure of welcoming Dr. T. V. Soong, the Chinese Minister for Foreign Affairs, on a brief visit, which unhappily was overshadowed by the death of the Chinese President, Dr. Lin Sen.
"My Government have welcomed the establishment of the French Committee of National Liberation at Algiers, and have recognized it as the body qualified to ensure the conduct of the French effort in the war within the framework of inter-Allied co-operation. We look forward to the liberation of France and her restoration to the ranks of the Great Powers.
"Members of the House of Commons,
"I thank you for the provision that you have made towards the cost of the war. The ready support given by my people to the measures you have adopted has ensured that the very heavy expenditure required by the war has been met with due regard to the social and economic interests of my country.
"My Lords and Members of the House of Commons,
"It is a matter of especial satisfaction to the Queen and myself that Parliament has complied with my request that the Regency Act should be so amended as to enable our beloved daughter Princess Elizabeth, when she attains the age of eighteen, to serve as one of the Counsellors of State should occasion arise for their appointment.
"I have given my Assent to a number of measures which have been brought before you during the course of the year. These have included Acts providing for the reorganization of my Foreign Service, for strengthening public control over the planning of town and country, and for the development of hydro-electric power in Scotland. Legislation has been passed to introduce a new system of taxation of wages and salaries, which will be of substantial convenience to all employees, particularly those whose earnings are liable to fluctuation. An Act has been passed to facilitate electoral registration under war conditions. Provision has been made for the development of the catering trades and for regulating the conditions of employment in those trades, for improving the administration of pensions, and for further temporary increases in the rates of workmen's compensation.
"Steps have also been taken to establish machinery for dealing with
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questions of wages and conditions in the coal-mining industry.
"My Government have taken the necessary action to ratify the International Labour Conventions concerning the Regulation of Written Contracts of Employment of Indigenous Workers and Penal Sanctions for Breaches of Contracts of Employment by Indigenous Workers.
"With you, I thank Almighty God for having brought us victoriously through a year of peril and anxiety, and I pray that His blessing may attend you at all times."
After which the LORD CHANCELLOR said:
My Lords and Members of the House of Commons, by virtue of His Majesty's Commission, under the Great Seal, to us and other Lords directed we do, in His Majesty's name and in obedience to His Commands, prorogue this Parliament to the day in the said Commission mentioned, to be then here holden, and this Parliament is accordingly prorogued to the said day in the said Commission mentioned.
End of the Eighth Session of the Thirty-seventh Parliament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland in the seventh year of the Reign of His Majesty King George VI.