Sitting of 6 December 1884

Preamble
The House met at a quarter after One of the clock.
Message to attend The LORDS COMMISSIONERS:—
The House went; — and being returned; —Mr. SPEAKER reported the Royal Assent to several Bills.

ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE.
LORD RICHARD GROSVENOR: As I understand that it is the general desire of the House to be released at once from its labours, I beg to move the adjournment of the House. [Cries of "No!" from Irish Members.]
Motion made, and Question proposed, "That this House do now adjourn."— (Lord Richard Grosvenor.)
MR. T. P. O'CONNOR: The Motion just made by the noble Lord maybe in Order; but I can scarcely describe it as particularly courteous to the House. There stand upon the Paper Notices of no less than 52 Questions, and five
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Orders of the Day. The Questions refer to almost every Department of Administration, especially in reference to Ireland. The House is about to separate until late in February; and the Irish Administration will practically be freed, for a considerable period, from that close supervision of Parliament which is the only guarantee we have against reckless despotism practised in that country under the present system of coercion. I complain that the Government are exhibiting a want of common decency in endeavouring to shirk the important Questions proposed to be put to them in this House in regard to their action in Ireland. I will certainly express a hope that if the Irish Members oppose, as they undoubtedly intend to do, the Motion for Adjournment, they will receive the assistance of the hon. and learned Gentleman the Solicitor General for Ireland.
SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF: I wish to put a Question to you, Sir, on a point of Order. In the Rules of Procedure laid down in November, 1882, the Ninth Standing Order provided that—
"No Motion for the Adjournment of The House shall be made until all the Questions on the Notice Paper have been disposed of, and no such Motion shall be made before the Orders of the Day or Notices of Motion have been entered upon, except by leave of The House."
There is no qualification whatever to the Rule that no Motion for the Adjournment shall be made until all the Questions on the Notice Paper have been disposed of; and, under the circumstances, I submit to you, Sir, that the noble Lord the Member for Flintshire (Lord Richard Grosvenor) is not in Order in moving the Adjournment of the House.
MR. SPEAKER: Under the exceptional circumstances of the case, the noble Lord was justified in making the Motion. Of course it may be objected to—as, indeed, it has been objected to— by the hon. Member for Galway (Mr. T. P. O'Connor)
SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF: I would ask, Sir, with all due deference to your opinion, what are the exceptional circumstances which would warrant a Member of the Government in flying in the face of a distinct Order of this House made two years ago, on the Motion of the Government themselves? I would humbly ask you, Sir, to explain what

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the exceptional circumstances are which would justify the setting aside of the Rule?
MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR: May I ask, Sir, if, in the face of the Standing Order, there are in this case any exceptional circumstances that would justify its being set aside? Has not a single Member a perfect right to call upon you, Sir, to enforce the Standing Order?
MR. SPEAKER: The exceptional circumstances, which, in my view, justify the course which has been taken by the noble Lord, are that it is the close of an exceptional Sitting of the House, and also the announcement that no Government Business will be taken to-day. The Standing Order applies solely to Motions made for the purpose of raising a debate, and not to a Motion made by the Government for the purpose of closing the Business of the House.
MR. CALLAN: May I ask, Sir, whether the exceptional circumstance of the Government having no Business is not met by the words—
"No Motion for the Adjournment of The House shall he made until all the Questions on the Notice Paper have been disposed of, and no such Motion shall be made before the Orders of the Day or Notices of Motion have been entered upon, except by leave of The House."
Do not the words "except by leave of The House" provide for such an accidental matter as there being no Government Business? I wish to know whether the Sittings of this House are merely for the convenience of the Government, to enable them to meet and discuss their Business only; and if it is in the power of the Government to move the Adjournment of the House whenever they have no Business on the Paper and have an objection to discuss Questions proposed to be raised by other Members, which do appear on the Paper?
MR. ARTHUR O'CONNOR: I must ask the Speaker for a decision on the point of Order which I submitted a short time ago — namely, whether a single Member has not the right of calling on the Chair to enforce the Standing Order?
MR. T. P. O'CONNOR: Before, Sir, you give your ruling upon the point of Order, I desire to call attention to the concluding words of the Standing Order, which, after providing that no Motion
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for Adjournment shall be made before the Orders of the Day or Notices of Motion have been entered upon, "except by leave of The House," goes on to say—
"unless a Member rising in his place shall propose to move the Adjournment for the purpose of discussing a definite matter of urgent public importance, and not less than Forty Members shall thereupon rise in their places to support the Motion."
Allow me, Sir, to recall your recollection to the circumstances under which that Order was passed. It was passed distinctly for the purpose of putting an end to the practice of making Motions for Adjournment during Question time, or during the progress of Business. In order to save the time of the House from being unnecessarily wasted, but not with a view of too largely gagging Motions for Adjournment, but of preserving perfect freedom of action to the House, a special Rule was made in which it was permitted that Motions for Adjournment might be made under certain conditions; and this Rule was laid down distinctly—first, that the Member proposing an Adjournment should state that it was for the purpose of "discussing a definite matter of urgent public importance;" and, in the next place, if the statement was challenged, not less than Forty Members were required to give their sanction to the Motion for Adjournment.
MR. STAVELEY HILL: I wish to call special attention to the words of the Standing Order, which are—
"That no Motion for Adjournment shall be made before the Orders of the Day or Notices of Motion have been entered upon."
A certain exception is provided in the Order; but it has not been obeyed in the present case, because there are Orders of the Day down upon the Paper. Therefore, I submit that this Rule really does apply in every single word to the present case. [Cries of "Withdraw the Motion!"]
SIR HENRY TYLER: Perhaps the Speaker will be kind enough, under the circumstances, to put the Question to the House, whether the Motion of the noble Lord was made with the leave of the House. [Cries of "No!"]
MR. SPEAKER: No; I shall not adopt that course; but I will point out to hon. Members who have spoken what was the spirit of the Ninth Rule, which is now a Standing Order of the House.

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It was passed in order to prevent vexatious or obstructive Motions for the Adjournment of the House.
MR. CALLAN: Such as this. ["Order!"]
MR. SPEAKER: And, further, to prevent the interposition of such Motions at Question time, it was laid down that it must be a "definite matter of urgent public importance." If hon. Members will look at the Rule they will see it is specified there—
"unless a Member rising in his place shall propose to move the Adjournment, for the purpose of discussing a definite matter of urgent public importance."
That was to be the operation of the Rule. As I have stated before, the noble Lord (Lord Richard Grosvenor), at this period of the Session, when there is no Public Business, and no matter of public importance to be brought forward by the Government, is justified in the course which he has taken.
MR. CALLAN: What justification can the Motion of the noble Lord have, except a vexatious interference with the rights of hon. Members?
MR. SPEAKER: Order, order! The hon. Gentleman is not entitled to use that expression, nor to argue with the Chair.
MR. MONTAGUE GUEST: I beg to call your attention, Sir, to the fact that there are not Forty Members present.
SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF (speaking seated and covered): May I ask a Question of you, Sir?
MR. SPEAKER (also seated): The hon. Member cannot speak now, until I have ascertained if there is a quorum of the House.
SIR H. DRUMMOND WOLFF (still seated): I wish to call attention to a point of Order.
MR. SPEAKER: No question of Order can be raised at this stage.
House counted, and Mr. SPEAKER declared that 37 Members only were present.
ME. CALLAN: I desire, Sir, to call your attention to the fact that there are several Members behind your Chair who have not been counted.
MR. T. P. O'CONNOR: I wish to ask you, Sir, as a matter of Order—
MR. SPEAKER: Order, order! As there are only Thirty-seven Members present, the Sitting is suspended until
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Four o'clock, when the House will be adjourned.
LORD HENRY LENNOX: Can the Standing Order be taken at Four o'clock in the event of there being a House?
MR. SPEAKERwas understood to reply in the negative.
MR. CALLAN: Mr. Errington, Lord Edmond Fitzmaurice, Mr.Blennerhassett, and the Government "Whips" were behind the Chair.
The Sitting was then suspended at five minutes to Two o'clock.

CORRUPT PRACTICES AT ELECTIONS.
Address for "Returns showing (1) present number of registered electors in boroughs in which corrupt practices were reported by a Royal Commission to have prevailed during the election of 1880, and (2) the number of persons whoso names were included in the Schedules of each such Report respectively as having been guilty of corrupt practices at such election."
"And, showing (1) the number of male householders now registered as qualified to vote at municipal elections in the borough of Great Yarmouth, and (2) the number of persons whoso names were included in the Schedule of the Report of the Election Commissioners appointed to investigate the last election for that borough."—(Mr. Warton.)

POPULATION AND REPRESENTATION.
Return ordered, "of the Population of England, Scotland, and Ireland, as estimated by the Registrar General for the middle of the year 1884, together with the number of Members of Parliament which each of the three kingdoms would obtain if 670 Members were allotted according to the population of each." — (Mr. Buchanan.)

SOUTH AERICA (ANGRA PEQUENA).
Copy presented,—of a Despatch from the Right honourable the Earl of Derby, K.G., to Her Majesty's High Commissioner in South Africa, relative to the establishment of a German Protectorate at Angra Pequena and along the neighbouring Coast [by Command]; to lie upon the Table.
Copy presented,—of Further Correspondence respecting the settlement at Angra Pequena on the South West Coast of Africa (in continuation of [C. 4190] August 1884) [by Command]; to lie upon the Table.

EDUCATION DEPARTMENT (OVEE-PRESSURE).
Copy ordered, "of Return of Cases which have been reported to the Department in which Over-pressure has been alleged as the cause of illness."—(Mr. Mundella.)
Copy presented accordingly; to lie upon the Table, and to be printed. [No. 44.]
The House was adjourned at two minutes after Four o'clock till Thursday 19th February.

MINUTES.
PUBLIC BILLS — Second Reading — Scottish, and Irish, Peerages* (10), discharged.
Royal Assent—Consolidated Fund (No. 1) [47 & 48 Vict. c. 2]; Tramways and Public Companies (Ireland) Act Amendment [47 & 48 Vict. c. 5]; Yorkshire Registries Act (1884) Amendment [47 & 48 Vict. c. 4]; Representation of the People [47 & 48 Vict. c. 3].
Their Lordships met;—And the Commons being come with their SFEAKER, and a Royal Commission to that effect having been read, the ROYAL ASSENT was given to several Bills.
On the Motion of The Earl of KIMBERLEY,
House adjourned at a quarter before Two o'clock, to Thursday the 19th of February next, a quarter past Four o'clock.