Sitting of 9 February 1872

CHOICE OF A SPEAKER.
THE Serjeant came, and brought the Mace, and laid it under the Table.
Then the RIGHT HONOURABLE WILLIAM EWART GLADSTONEaddressing himself to the Clerk, who (standing up pointed to him, and then sat down) said: I have to acquaint the House of Commons that Her Majesty having been informed of the resignation of the Eight Hon. John Evelyn Denison, the late Speaker of this House, gives leave to the House to proceed forthwith to the choice of a new Speaker.
Then SIR ROUNDELL PALMERstood up, and, addressing himself to the
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Clerk, said:—Sir Erskine May—On former occasions when we have been called on to elect a new Speaker, it has generally been at the beginning of a New Parliament; and, under such circumstances, the minds of those who have undertaken the duty which, imperfectly, I am about to endeavour to discharge, have naturally been led, in the first place, to dwell on the merits and services of the Speaker who has last left the Chair. The circumstances under which I now address the House are different. It is not quite 24 hours since we all had the pleasure of listening to the two greatest orators in this House—of all men the fittest to be our spokesmen on such an occasion—when they tasked the choicest powers of their eloquence to pay the tribute which was justly due to the great services and exalted character of Mr. Evelyn Denison, and to express in appropriate terms the sentiments of respect—I might say of reverence and regard—for his person which are entertained by all the Members of this House. That duty both of them discharged, I venture to say, in a manner thoroughly satisfactory to us all. It was worthy of the occasion, worthy of Mr. Denison, worthy of the speakers themselves, and worthy of this House. The touching words in which the tribute paid to him was acknowledged by Mr. Denison showed that he deeply felt that the House had been worthily represented on that occasion. It showed also, if I may venture to say so, how worthy he himself was of the tribute which had been paid him. Under these circumstances, I do not feel it to be any part of my duty to attempt to gild refined gold, or to add anything to what was then said on a subject so interesting to us all. And although, of course, I feel—as probably everyone feels who for some years past has taken any active part in the business of this House—my own individual share of obligation to Mr. Denison to be so great that it would be a pleasure to me adequately to express my sense of it, still I think it would be unbecoming and almost inexcusable if I were to dwell longer on a topic to which such ample justice has been done. I pass, therefore, to the immediate business of the day. With the example of Mr. Denison and his predecessor before us, and with the echoes of the speeches to which I have just referred still ringing in our ears, it cannot be a matter of

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great difficulty to us to realize what the Speaker of this House ought to be. He should be a man of long Parliamentary experience and great knowledge, who has habitually paid much attention to the public and also to the private business of Parliament. He should be a man of a high personal bearing, of spirit, and of dignity of character such as befits a thorough English gentleman, and such as will make him fit to preside over an Assembly which, having to discharge the most august functions of any assembly in the world, has always been proud of bringing to those functions the essential qualities which distinguish gentlemen, qualities without which doubtless it would never be able rightly to discharge those duties. He should be, of course, a man of strict justice and impartiality, beyond impeachment or suspicion. He should be a man of large attainments and of a mind fitted for business. He should be a man of a kindly and genial temperament, of good practical sense, of firmness, and at the same time of sound judgment. He should understand our privileges, and be capable, on all proper occasions, of maintaining them with authority and dignity, and at the same time with wisdom and moderation. He should also be able—especially in the times in which we live—to discharge the still more important and far more difficult duty of maintaining, by moral authority, the order of our debates and the dignity of our proceedings, helping us all, both in seen and in unseen ways, to maintain that self-respect and self-discipline, that mutual respect for each other, and that spirit of obedience to the laws of this Assembly, which are essential to the discharge of the duties of Parliament, and by reason of which Parliament, in the most difficult times, has hitherto been able to discharge those duties to the satisfaction and advantage of the country. I believe, looking around me, and looking before me, that there are, as there always have been, and I trust always will be, more than a few men in this House equal, if they should be called upon, to the discharge of these duties—
"Primo avulso, non deficit alter Aureus; et simili frondescit virga metallo."
Our present duty is to choose one such man to occupy the chair lately and so worthily filled by Mr. Evelyn Denison.
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And I propose to you to choose a Member of this House well known, and I venture to think universally popular among us—the Eight Hon. Henry Bouverie William Brand. It appears to me that it may be justly said of him, that he possesses all the qualities which I have ventured to enumerate as necessary for that great office. He has had 20 years' Parliamentary experience—first as Member for the borough of Lewes, and afterwards for the county of Cambridge—during which period he has paid the most intelligent and unremitting attention to the business, both public and private, of the House, and has become familiar with all those special branches of knowledge which are important to a Speaker. He is distinguished, if any man in this House is, by his genial, kindly, cordial, hearty temperament. He is a man of uniform courtesy, and has the bearing of a thorough gentleman. He has also the qualities, as those who know him best can testify, and as the House in general, I think, must be aware, of firmness and decision. I do not doubt that whatever duty he may be called on to discharge, he will discharge it with such a courtesy as will win him the affections of all, and with such tact and discretion as will accomplish all those great objects which we desire to see accomplished by any one who fills that Chair. If I were to search for any possessor of these qualities in a higher degree than Mr. Brand I should search in vain. I have not yet spoken of that quality which perhaps of all is the most important—strict justice and impartiality. I feel very confident that there is not a Member of this House who doubts that this requisite also will be fulfilled in the person of Mr. Brand. Of course, every one of us sits here upon one side of the House or on the other; but in these political divisions—which, after all, are of very great service in the due conduct of public business and in the maintenance of public virtue—in these political divisions, as they are and have been known among us through so many generations and under so long a succession of illustrious Speakers, there is not ordinarily—I might almost say there never has been—the element of personal acrimony, personal ill-will, or personal prejudice against those with whom in politics we may not happen to agree. Every Speaker

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must be taken from one side of the House or the other, as a matter of necessity; yet the history of that long roll of illustrious men has been a history of impartiality and justice. I will not say that in remote times there may not have been exceptions; but in modern times, and speaking generally, to each of them in succession as he left the Chair, and to many of them who were re-elected after their first election—not merely from one side of the House, but from the other—a just tribute has been paid, acknowledging their merits; and the sentiment of the House has found expression in the desire that as long as possible they should continue to serve. I recollect that on one or two former occasions it was mentioned as a circumstance attaching to the distinguished man who was then proposed for the Chair, that he had no experience of office. Well, I cannot say that of my right hon. Friend Mr. Brand. He has undoubtedly had some experience of office. But it never was the rule of this House—and I hope it never will be—that men who serve their country in offices of the State are therefore to be disqualified, if the House should think fit to ask for their services in the important place of Speaker. As long as office is filled with honour and without reproach, why, office shows the man. And if the qualities which make a man fit for the Chair have been already shown by him in an office in which he was brought into contact continually with all the Members of the House on both sides, who thereby had the opportunity of becoming thoroughly conversant with his character and with his abilities; and if such a man conducted the duties of such an office with tact, discretion, and courtesy, making hosts of friends on both sides and not an enemy anywhere, then I say we have an additional proof of his fitness for the Chair. I feel that I have said enough, and I now conclude by moving "That the Right Honourable Henry Bouverie William Brand do take the Chair of this House as Speaker."
The HONOURABLE PETER JOHN LOCKE KINGsaid: I beg to second the Motion of my hon. and learned Friend, that the Right Hon. Henry Bouverie William Brand do take the Chair. My hon. and learned Friend has spoken with his usual eloquence and clearness, and so fully and truly
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with regard to the qualifications of my right hon. Friend that, concurring as I do in all that he said, he has left me but very little to add. I may, however, be permitted to say that it is with the greatest satisfaction and pleasure that I second this Motion, for I feel conscientiously that there is no one who is better qualified than my right hon. Friend to fill the distinguished post of Representative of the House of Commons and to be the first Commoner in the land. But while the honour is very great, the duties are not only arduous, but at times onerous in the extreme, and almost overwhelming. I venture, however, to think, from the well-known habits of business which my right hon. Friend possesses, and from his knowledge of the forms of the House, that he will be able to discharge those duties to the satisfaction of the House of Commons. We cannot disguise from ourselves that from the vast number of Members who now attend, from their various dispositions and tempers, and from the great freedom of debate which exists, the Speaker of this House should be one who is well acquainted with mankind generally, and possesses unusual delicacy of feeling, to enable him to deal successfully with every circumstance that may arise. There are, it seems to me, so many qualities required in a Speaker—they are so essential, and at the same time so different, so opposed to one another—that they are very rarely to be found in the same individual; but, from the acquaintance which I have had with my right hon. Friend, extending over many years, and which, if he will permit me to say it, has grown into friendship, I feel convinced that all these qualities, however opposite, are united in him. On the one hand, there are the qualities which have been referred to by my hon. and learned Friend, of firmness, decision, vigour, and, I will add, promptness; of knowing how and when to interfere, at the right time and in the right manner, so as to prevent and nip in the bud, as it were, any threatened attempt at disorder, and of doing this before any cry has arisen, or party spirit—which is so much to be deprecated—has been aroused. On the other hand, there are the qualities of urbanity, courtesy, frankness, and—in these days more especially—patience, which are so important in the daily intercourse of the Speaker

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with the different Members of the House. I remember in my early Parliamentary life an incident which struck me very forcibly. A Member was trying an experiment of a somewhat questionable and of a novel kind. The Speaker of that day, with an expression which I could not describe, but which I shall never forget—there was nothing in it harsh or severe, for it was mild and gracious—but yet the mere expression of his countenance conveyed to this Member the disapprobation of the House, and caused him to discontinue the experiment which he was trying. I do not know whether we may look to my right hon. Friend to possess a faculty which is really requisite in these days—whether he may be able to devise some means of shortening our hours of labour, of curtailing, if it be possible, these tedious and procrastinating debates, and of inventing some way—without interfering with the rights and privileges of Members—by which an alteration may be effected in the system of moving incessantly the Adjournment of the Debate and the Adjournment of the House. If my right hon. Friend would make a discovery of some kind by which this could be effected, I feel that he would deserve not only the thanks of the House, but the thanks of the nation also. Time was when Representative Assemblies were somewhat rare, when we were anxious that our example should be followed in other countries, and that Representative Assemblies should increase throughout the world. They have increased since then; and, happily, it is still in our power to furnish an example of how the affairs of a great nation may be conducted with dignity in a popular Assembly. And to this end nothing is more important than the fitness of the person who, as Speaker of this House, is called on to preside over the most ancient, the freest, and the most independent Representative Assembly in the world. I beg to second the Motion.
And the House unanimously calling Mr. BRAND to the Chair,
The Right Honourable Gentleman stood up in his place, and said:—To my hon. Friends who have brought my name under the notice of the House I owe my very best thanks. Their partiality has induced them to say more of me than I deserve. I am very sen-
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sible that there are many hon. Members who might be selected from all parts of this House more worthy than I am to fill the high station of Speaker of this honourable House. I say this not as mere words of form, but in all sincerity. When I think of the growing powers and responsibilities of this House, and of the momentous issues which depend on its judgment, I hesitate to take so prominent a part in its proceedings. But I place myself at the service of this House, and I know no higher service to which a man can devote his life. If it be the pleasure of this House that I shall occupy that Chair, I shall look for my guidance to the Rules and Orders established from time to time by the wisdom of this House. I shall look for my examples to the long roll of distinguished men who have occupied the Chair; and among them are two eminent living Speakers who will give me good advice. I shall look for my assistance from day to day to the learning, experience, and tried ability of the officers of this House. But, above all, I shall rely on that which I prize most highly—the generous indulgence of this Assembly of English gentlemen. I am reminded of a happy phrase applied to the Speaker, whose presence to day we all miss and whose retirement we all regret. The right hon. Gentleman the Member for Buckinghamshire (Mr. Disraeli), who is a master of happy phrases, when supporting the re-election of the Speaker in 1859, spoke of him as manifesting, among other qualities, the purity of an English judge, and the spirit of an English gentleman. If, after faithful service of this House, I could obtain such a character from this House, I should reach the summit of my ambition, and I should feel that I had lived to some purpose. I place myself, with all humility, at the will of the House.
The House then again unanimously calling Mr. BRAND to the Chair, he was taken out of his place by the said Sir ROUNDELL PALMER and the Honourable PETER JOHN LOCKE KING, and by them conducted to the Chair.
MR. SPEAKER ELECT, standing on the upper step, said: I am very sensible of the high honour which you have just conferred. I can only say that as long as I have to carry on the functions of the Chair, I will do my duty to the best of my ability to this House, and I will

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carry on the functions of the Chair with fairness and impartiality:
—and then sat down; and the Mace was laid upon the Table.
Then MR. GLADSTONE said: Mr. Speaker Elect: Sir, that share of duty which has fallen to my lot during the last few days, in connection with the lamented retirement of Mr. Denison, has been chiefly tinged with regret. I am now called on to discharge an office which is one of unmixed satisfaction in rising to congratulate you upon your having received, in your election to the high office which I trust you will long enjoy, the unanimous suffrage of the House. Sir, I need hardly remind you, or remind the House, of the nature of the place you will be called upon to fill, or of the influence you will have upon our acts. We all rejoice to regard our Speaker, as in some substantial sense, the Chief Commoner of the Realm. To that Chief Commoner we seek to pay every special honour that we can devise. In social relations we rejoice to surround him with some of those marks which we do not render except to Royalty itself. It is our general desire and the fixed habit of the House of Commons to magnify the office of Speaker. And, Sir, that is partly because we have been accustomed to chose from among us the very worthiest class of men whom these benches on the one or the other side of the House could supply; and it is also partly because we feel that the respect and deference so paid to the occupant of the Chair are reflected upon the House of Commons itself, and form an important contribution to the satisfactory discharge of its high duties. Sir, in bearing such an office, you well know how much will be expected from you—how many qualities, the exercise of which we have all had for many years more or less extensive opportunities of admiring. For my own part, having had the honour of enjoying your friendship, and having lived for no small length of time in daily intercourse with you, through evil and through good report, I may claim peculiar opportunities for appreciating the qualities which have recommended you to the House and the distinction you have received. My hon. and learned Friend (Sir Round ell Palmer) has enumerated those qualities in a manner
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which I shall not attempt to emulate, and he well and wisely reserved for the climax of all the impartiality which is expected from the Chair. No more evil sign ever could attend the proceedings or darken the prospects of this House than the slightest remission in the strictness of that rule which establishes for the Speaker, in the discharge of the duties of his office, a total absence of preference for any party association. In this House, Sir, party associations are made; they give animation to our proceedings; they are, I believe, among the conditions of the truest patriotism. They may more or less darken our views of questions and events; but the Speaker rises above them all, and that is true of him which was well said by the poet—
"Like some tall cliff that lifts its awful form,
Swells from the vale and midway leaves the storm,
Though round its base the gathering clouds may spread,
Eternal sunshine settles on its head."
And the view of the Speaker has never been clouded by those party associations of which we are so conscious. Sir, I am persuaded it is a promise of your happy destiny to maintain the elevated standard which has been established by a long series of predecessors for the occupant of the Chair. In your endeavours for that purpose, you will have the support of your own accomplishments and knowledge, and of your own high intellectual and moral qualities; you will have the support of those official assistants, who never at any time were more competent to give aid and guidance in the discharge of your arduous duties; and you will be inspired during your labours by the traditions of the Chair; and, lastly, I feel confident that that appeal which you have made to the candid consideration of the House, in the appropriate words you have pronounced, is an appeal which will strike home to every heart and every mind; and, so far as it is in our power, will cheer and sustain you in your labours, and that while you remain the occupant of the Chair you will receive that cordial and unfailing support which is derived from the confidence and approval of the House of Commons. Having signified that Her Majesty has permitted the House to proceed with the immediate election of a Speaker, I have now to inform the House that it is Her Majesty's pleasure that the House shall

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present their Speaker upon Monday next, at Four of the clock, in the House of Peers, for Her Majesty's Royal Approbation. Having done that, Sir, I believe the next step is to move "That the House do adjourn till Monday next."
Motion agreed to.
House adjourned at a quarter before Five o'clock.

MINUTES.
SELECT COMMITTEE—Thanksgiving in the Metropolitan Cathedral, nominated.
ROLL OF THE LORDS.
The LORD CHANCELLOR The LORD CHANCELLOR acquainted the House that the Clerk of the Parliaments had prepared and laid it on the Table: The same was ordered to be printed. (No. 10.)

QUEEN'S SPEECH—HER MAJESTY'S ANSWER TO THE ADDRESS.
THE LORD STEWARD (The Earl of BESSBOROUGH)reported Her Majesty's Answer to the Address, as follows:—
MY LORDS,
I THANK you for your loyal Address.
IT gives me sincere gratification to receive the assurance of your sympathy with me during the recent alarming illness of my dear son The Prince of Wales, and your congratulations on the prospect of his complete recovery.
I RELY with the same confidence as heretofore on your cordial assistance in all measures which may be calculated to promote the prosperity of my people.

IRISH CHURCH TEMPORALITIES COMMISSIONERS—QUESTION.
THE EARL OF LONGFORDasked, When it is intended to appoint a Commissioner of Church Temporalities in Ireland, to fill the vacancy caused by the death of the late Eight Honourable G. A. Hamilton? The noble Earl said, that under the Irish Church Act of 1869, three Commissioners were appointed to carry out its provisions, and very large powers were given to them. Any person affected by an Order of one of the Commissioners was entitled to have his case brought before the three; but, by the death of Mr. George Alexander Hamilton, which occurred last year, a vacancy had been created, and since there had been only two Commissioners. One of these was a noble Lord, who very properly desired to take part in the business of that House; and he had also other engagements. The other Commissioner was a learned Judge, who had his judicial duties to perform on

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the Irish Bench. Again, any person who now desired to appeal from an Order made by one of the Commissioners was obliged to have his appeal heard by only two, one of whom was the Commissioner who had decided the matter in the first instance. It was not alleged that there had been any failure of justice, or any neglect of business on the part of either of the Commissioners; but he submitted that, as the Act provided for three Commissioners, it was not a satisfactory state of things to have only two.
THE EARL OF DUFFERINreplied, that it was not the intention of Her Majesty's Government to fill up the vacancy caused by the death of Mr. Hamilton, because, in their opinion, two Commissioners were amply sufficient to perform the duties for which three had been originally appointed. A Bill would be introduced for the amendment of that portion of the Act providing for the hearing of appeals by three Commissioners.
THE EARL OF LONGFORDsaid, he should oppose that Bill whenever it was brought in.
LORD ROMILLYdesired to bear testimony to the efficient manner in which the late Mr. Hamilton had performed his public duties.
House adjourned at a quarter past Five o'clock, to Monday next, a quarter before Four o'clock.