Sitting of 13 April 1809

MINUTES.
Lord Archibald Hamilton rose to give notice, that in consequence of the disclosures that had been made in the Report of the East India Committee, he should, on to-morrow se'nnight, submit to the house a motion respecting the same; and, as the disclosures were of so voluminous a nature, he thought it necessary distinctly to state, that on that day he should call the attention of the house to that part exclusively relating to the Conduct of lord Castlereagh.—Lord Ossulston moved for an Address to his majesty, praying that there be laid before the house a Return of all places, posts, and offices held immediately from the crown, whether during pleasure or good behaviour, or by reversion, or any other tenure, and, whether in the home department or the colonies, together with the nature, duty, and salaries of the respective offices, and the duties of their several institutions. Ordered.—Mr. Henry Martin moved, that there be laid before the house an Account of the Balance in the hands of the Register of the High Court of Admiralty, the Register of the Court of Prize Appeals, and the Register of the High Court of Delegates, as far as the said balances were the property of persons suitors in that court, distinguishing the balance for each year, from the 5th of Jan. 1793, to the 5th of Jan. 1809. Ordered.

CHELSEA HOSPITAL—COLONEL GORDON.
Sir Francis Burdett, seeing a noble lord in his place, expressed a wish to know from that noble lord, if what he had heard with respect to the disposal of the public property to an individual was founded in fact. The circumstance he alluded to was
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this: he had understood that a portion of the ground belonging to Chelsea Hospital, lying along the bank of the River Thames, and particularly calculated for the air and exercise of the pensioners, had been lately consigned over to the use and possession of col. Gordon. He should forbear from commenting on the nature of such a consignment until he learned from the noble lord whether it was true, or how far it was so; and, according to the answer he should receive, he would be guided as to the nature of the parliamentary proceeding he might then think it advisable subsequently to adopt.
Lord Castlereagh, observing that he was particularly applied to by the hon. baronet, begged leave to assure him, that that was the first time he had heard any thing of the circumstance alluded to, and that therefore it was not in his power to give the hon. baronet any information whatever on the subject.
Mr. Huskissonadmitted that what the hon. baronet alluded to was not altogether unfounded in fact. The state of the grounds belonging to Chelsea hospital had been submitted to the Commissioners, and it did appear that the Infirmary was inconveniently situated. It was considered that it would prove most advantageous to the interests of that institution, to have the ground that could not be better disposed of let out for building. Under these circumstances it was, he believed, that colonel Gordon had become a holder of that part of the ground.
Sir Francis Burdettsaid, that he was glad he had brought the matter before the house, as it was evident that the statement which had been made to him did appear to be founded in fact. It was clear that it ought to be followed up by every possible investigation. He thought it would be requisite that a committee of the house should be appointed to inspect the ground in question, or at least some means should be resorted to for the purpose of ascertaining the value of the ground disposed of, and the manner in which it had been disposed of; for certain it was, that if it had been disposed of in the manner in which he had been informed it was, there could be no doubt whatever that a great and serious abuse had been committed.
Mr. Roseprofessed his entire ignorance of the transaction alluded to.
Mr. Longconfirmed the statement of Mr. Huskisson; when sir F. Burdett again rising,
The Speakerhere suggested that there was then no question before the house, and asked the hon. baronet, whether it was his pleasure forthwith to submit a motion to the house, or to give notice of such a motion?
Sir Francis Burdettsaid, that he would to-morrow submit to the he a motion on the subject.

BREACH OF PRIVILEGE.
Sir C. Hamiltoncomplained that a Sheriff's Officer had yesterday seized his person, in his own house, and treated him with great rudeness, which he deemed to be a breach of the privileges of the house. He moved therefore, "That Daniel Butler, the officer alluded to, do attend at the bar of the house to-morrow, to answer for the said breach of privilege."—Ordered.

LOCAL MILITIA BILL.
The order of the day for the further consideration of the report of the Local Militia bill having been read, the bill was recommitted on the motion of lord Castlereagh, for the purpose of introducing several amendments, which he felt it necessary to propose in various provisions of the bill—In reply to a suggestion made by sir Thomas Turton, relative to a particular amendment, lord Castlereagh stated, that it was his intention in this stage of the measure to propose the several amendments which occurred to him as necessary, after which he would move to have the bill re-printed, and should then be happy to hear and attend to any suggestion or amendment, which the hon. baronet, or any other hon. member, might have to propose.—Much desultory conversation then took place upon each clause and amendment, as the committee proceeded through the bill. The period for completing the local militia was extended to January next, and the bounty to volunteers raised from one to two guineas. The rank of the officers of the local militia, was fixed next after the rank of officers of the original militia, and rank for rank above that of officers of yeomanry cavalry, whose rank was to follow that of officers of local militia, as the rank of the latter came next after that of the original militia. This arrangement was objected to, as insulting to yeomanry officers, by sir Thomas Turton; but his objection was over-ruled, as was also a suggestion of Mr. Dundas, that the yeomanry and local militia officers should take rank from the date of their commissions, whereby volunteer officers who should transfer their services to the local militia, would take rank from the date of
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their commission as volunteer officers.—On the clause to authorise lord lieutenants, upon representation to government in certain cases, to order regiments of local militia from the county for which they may have been raised, into an adjacent one to be trained, lord Castlereagh felt it necessary to explain the ground upon which this clause rested, in order to remove a misapprehension which had taken place respecting it. The sole object of the clause was to consult the convenience of the men. In many counties there were no great towns large enough to afford quarters for the local militia of the counties, in which cases it was thought desirable that there should be a power to march the regiments to be trained into an adjacent, county. There were other cases in which the regiments would have to march 25 or 31 miles within their own counties, to a town capable of affording them proper quarter, whilst by being sent into the adjoining counties, they would have but a inarch of five or six miles to convenient accommodation during their period of training. It was solely, therefore, to remedy the unavoidable inconvenience that would result in such cases from training the regiments of local militia in their proper counties, and to promote the accommodation of the men themselves, that this clause had been introduced.—After a few words from Mr. Cues and sir T. Turton, this explanation was considered satisfactory, and the clause agreed to.—Lord Castlereagh then brought up a number of clauses which were agreed to without opposition.—The bill then went through the committee, the report was received, and ordered to be taken into further consideration on Monday next.

IRISH SPIRIT DUTY BILL.
The house then went into a committee on the Irish Spirit Duty Bill.
Mr. Fosterobserved, that when the duty should be reduced so low as to meet the wishes of the gentlemen on the other side of the house, the Irish distiller would have an advantage over the English distiller, as the latter was obliged to produce 21 gallons of spirits from 200 weight of sugar, whereas the Irish distiller need only produce 18. It therefore followed that the Irish spirits would be made stronger for the same duty. He thought it but fair to take notice of this circumstance, although he was ready to conform the duty to the wishes of other gentlemen.
Mr. Barhamsaid, that while there was no spirit intercourse between Great Bri-

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tain and Ireland, there could be no advantage gained by one over the other. He wished much that the duty should be lowered in Ireland, in order to prevent illicit distilleries.
Mr. Marryatwas of the same opinion.
Mr. Fostersaid, that it had been his intention to reduce the duties, in consequence of the suggestions which had been made to him, from 3s. 2d. to 2s. 10 d. a gallon. He should, however, keep himself unfettered until the next Report of the committee which were then sitting. When that Report should be presented, which would probably take place in less than five weeks, he would still hold himself at liberty to alter the present bill, or bring in an entire new one, as it should then appear proper.
After some further conversation, the Bill went through the committee, and was ordered to be reprinted, with the amendments.