Sitting of 15 January 1805

Preamble
The house met this day, pursuant to, his majesty's proclamation, for the dispatch of business. At three o'clock Mr. Quarme,, deputy usher of the black rod, appeared within the bar, and delivered a message from the lords, desiring the immediate attendance of that house in the house of peers to hear his majesty's most gracious speech from the throne. The Speaker, accompanied by several members, accordingly attended. On their return, the Speaker took the chair, and acquainted the house, that in pursuance of the directions of an act, passed in the 24th year of his present majesty, he had issued his warrant to the clerk or the crown, to make out new writs for the election of members to serve in parliament for the following places: viz. for Warwick, in the room of G. A. W. Shuckburgh Evelyn, baronet, deceased; for

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Horsham, in the room of P. Ross, esq., deceased; for Dumfries, in the room of Sir R. Laurie, baronet, deceased; and for Tolness, in the room of John Berkley Burland, esq. deceased. The right; honourable John Foster, Sir Evan Nepean, G. B. Mainwaring, esq. and several other members, took the oaths and their seats. A bill for the more effectual presenting clandestine out-lawries, was, according to custom, read a first, and ordered to be read a second time.—New writs were ordered to be issued for members to serve in parliament for the following places, viz. for Rutland, in the room of Lord Carberry, deceased; for Devizes, in the room of the right hon. H. Addington, now lord visc. Sidmouth, called up to the House of Peers; for Buckingham, in the room of Lord Proby, deceased; for Leitrim, in the room of Lord Clements, now earl of Leitrim; for Haddington, Jedburgh, Dunbar, N. Berwick, and Lauder, in the room of the right hon. T. Mainland, who, since his election, hath accepted the office of governor of Ceylon; for Peebles, in the room of Sir James Montgomery, bart. who, since his election, hath accepted the office of his majesty's advocate for Scotland; for Edinburgh, in the room of the right hon. C. Hope, who, since his election, hath accepted the office of lord chief justice Clerk, of Scotland.

KING'S SPEECH.—
The Speakeracquainted the house, that the house had this day attended his Majesty in the House of Peers, where his Majesty was pleased to make a most gracious speech from the throne; of which, to prevent mistakes, he had obtained a copy. He then proceeded to read the speech from the chair, for which we refer to our report of the proceedings of the Lords, (see p. 1.) After the speaker had finished reading the speech,
The Hon. Henry Augustus Dillonrose, and spoke as follows:—I rise, sir, for the purpose of moving an address to his majesty for the most gracious speech we have just heard. I am aware of the importance of many of the topics which, in the speech that has now been read, arc submitted to the consideration of the house. But, at the same time, I believe, that there are few-points which can disturb the unanimity which ought to prevail at this momentous crisis. Our situation requires unanimity, and therefore I trust that none will be disposed to take any unreasonable grounds of objection to the address, which I shall by.
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and-by have the honour of moving. I am perfectly persuaded, that there are many paragraphs in his majesty's speech which must occasion universal joy and satisfaction to all those who have the good of their country, and the tranquillity of the world at heart; but I am aware, at the same; time, that there are others where the in formation given may not seem to many gentlemen so complete as they could have wished. These are points, however, which at present ought not to be rashly and prematurely introduced into discussion, till the desirable information relating to them can be conveniently laid before the house. Of these I would particularly advert to the second paragraph, which refers to the war with Spain. Upon this subject the opinions entertained will probably be very different, a cording to the particular view in which each individual may be disposed to regard it. But till the papers which his Majesty has been graciously pleased to order to be laid before us, for the purpose of bringing the affair completely under our view, shall be produced, the propriety of refraining from any long discussion on this head must he obvious to every impartial person. It is impossible that any man can with justice pretend to give any clear and decided opinion on a point, relative to which his information must as yet be considered as extremely defective. Considering the times and the circumstances in which we are placed, every possible regard, it must be obvious, ought to be paid to candour and moderation.—With regard to the pacific overtures which, we are informed, have been made to his majesty, these, I am sure, must have afforded the highest plea, sure and satisfaction to every one; and after the variety of opinions that have been, delivered by many gentlemen in this house on the situation of this country and the continent, it must indeed be highly gratifying that the present state of affairs afford so flattering and cheering a prospect. All of us must have felt no small degree of delight and satisfaction at receiving proofs off the just sense which the Emperor of Russia appears to entertain of the aggressions and outrageous conduct of France. There are now the best grounds of hope that the continental nations will be awakened to a proper sense of what is due to themselves and to the liberties of Europe, in case France should persist in a line of conduct which may render it impossible to restore the blessings of peacet—Sir, with regard to the

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defence of the country, the measures that lave been adopted for the furtherance of that great object, have, as his majesty Informs us, been attended with the most happy effect. Much of the merit that belongs to this circumstance, may be justly claimed by the wisdom of parliament, and the zeal and ardour of the people. Yet, for the respectability of our defensive situation, much is also due to the exertions of the executive govt. To his majesty's ministers we owe the excellent state of defence in which Ireland has been placed, a part of the empire which the enemy may, per-laps, be disposed to consider as the most eligible point of attack. His majesty has directed us to turn our attention to another point, which he justly states as of the utmost importance. He has requested that we should give him that support which alone can enable him to bring the present contest to a safe and honourable termination. The greatest eagerness has been manifested by this house, to give his majesty the most effectual support in its power, and I trust that, at this moment, the exertions of parliament will not be discontinued. His majesty has particularly adverted to the support of public credit, and I have no doubt that in this respect the house will feel every disposition to concur with his majesty. That the burdens which the people must endure are heavy and unpleasing, must be confessed; but considering the magnitude of the object for which we are contending, and the great efforts that must necessarily be made, I hope that these burdens will be borne with patience and unanimity.—These, Sir, are the principal circumstances to which I have thought it right to advert. With regard to the war with Spain, I trust that we shall not press to a rash and premature conclusion; but that gentlemen will wait with patience till the information ordered by his majesty shall bring that affair completely before them: Without trespassing further on the house, or going more minutely into the particulars contained in his majesty's address, I shall conclude with moving, that the following address be presented to his majesty, viz.—"Most gracious sovereign, we, your majesty's most dutiful and loyal subjects, the commons of the united kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, in parliament assembled, beg leave to return your majesty the thanks of this house for your most gracious speech from the throne. —We have witnessed with pride and satis-
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faction the skill and intrepidity of your majesty's navy, the respectable and formidable state of your majesty's army and militia, the unabated zeal and improved discipline of a numerous volunteer force, and the general ardour manifested by all classes of your majesty's subjects. Although the preparations for the invasion of this kingdom have been continued with incessant activity, we are firmly persuaded that while this spirit animates the country, and its voluntary exertions for its own defence subsist in their full vigour, they will be found sufficient to deter the enemy from attempting to carry their repeated menaces into effect; and we shall never forget that as our security has arisen from the resolution with which we have met-and provided against the danger, we can be preserved only by steady perseverance and unremitting activity.—We beg leave to return your majesty our humble thanks, for having been graciously pleased to direct that a copy of the manifesto which you have caused to be prepared in consequence of the rupture with Spain should be laid before us, together with such papers as are necessary to explain the discussions which, have taken place between your majesty arid, that court; and we assure your majesty that we will take them into our early and serious consideration.— While we regret the extension of hostilities, your majesty may rely on our constant support to such measures as may be necessary for maintaining the honour of your crown, and asserting the just rights of your people.— We feel in common with your majesty, that on the continent the general conduct of the French govt. has been marked by the utmost violence and outrage, and has shewn a wanton defiance of the rights of neutral territories, of the acknowledged privileges of accredited ministers, and of the established principles of the law of nations.— We humbly acknowledge your majesty's goodness in having been pleased to inform us, that notwithstanding these transactions (so repugnant to every sentiment of moderation and justice) your majesty has recently received a communication from the French govt. containing professions of a pacific disposition; and while we feel deeply sensible of your majesty's paternal regard and unremitting solicitude for the welfare and happiness of your people, expressed in your majesty's earnest desire to embrace the first opportunity or restoring the blessings of peace, on such grounds as

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may be consistent with the permanent safety and interests of your majesty's dominions; we, at the same time, cordially agree with your majesty, that those objects are closely connected with the general security of Europe; and we acknowledge the propriety and wisdom of your majesty's determination to decline entering into more particular explanation, till you have had time to communicate with those powers on the continent with whom your majesty is engaged in confidential intercourse and connection with a view to this important object.—We learn, with peculiar satisfaction, that your majesty has received the strongest proof of the wise and dignified sentiments by which the Emperor of Russia is animated, and of the warm interest he takes in the safety and independence of Europe.—Much as we lament the necessity of imposing additional burthens on your majesty's subjects, we are, at the same time, so sensible how much their future safety and happiness depend upon the vigour of our exertions, that your majesty may rely upon our granting such supplies as the exigency of the public service may require, preserving, at the same time, an anxious desire effectually to support public credit, and to restrain as much as possible the accumulation of the national debt.—It affords us great consolation and satisfaction to observe, that the proofs of the internal wealth and resources of the country appear to keep pace with the efforts and sacrifices which the nature of the contest requires; and your majesty may firmly rely on our zeal to maintain and improve these advantages, and to adopt such measures as, by enabling your majesty to prosecute the war with vigour, may afford the best prospect of bringing it to a safe and honourable termination."
Mr. Charles Adams.—Sir; I rise for the purpose of seconding the motion which has just been made by the hon. gent., and I do it the more readily, as the able statement which he has made renders it unnecessary for me to enter upon the subject of his majesty's speech at any length. Sufficient has been said to justify the concurrence of this house in the motion that has just now been submitted to them. At a time when we are engaged in a war about matters of the highest moment, at a time when our enemies have menaced us with invasion, and when their schemes have been rendered abortive only by the persevering zeal of our countrymen, and our
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fleet, which has blockaded every port of the enemy, from the Adriatic to the Texel, at such a time, and in such circumstances, I trust that every one will feel it his first duly to grant his majesty that support which he now requires, and which every thing tells us ought to be given. At the time, sir, when we are told that we have a new enemy to contend with; an enemy, I fear, misled by weak counsels, and goaded on by the tyrannical and despotic power of France; an enemy whose hostile disposition every circumstance has concurred to prove; we ought not to be backward in meeting our difficulties with that resolution and firmness which the danger calls for. There are moments, sir, when to much forbearance becomes pusillanimity. One of these moments has now arrived. I shall not enter minutely into this question till the documents promised by his Majesty are laid before us. Then will be the proper time to consider it particularly. To discuss it at present at any length, would be altogether premature. I am most happy, at the pacific overtures that have been made to his majesty by the French govt.: God grant they may be sincere, and that they may pave the way for a safe and permanent peace! In the mean time, I have no doubt that the govt. of this country will act with that dignity and moderation which become the character of a great nation, which is anxious to preserve the peace of the world, though it cannot suffer its own honour and security to be trifled with. We have heard, sir, of the internal prosperity, the increasing, commerce and; wealth of our country, and who could, hear it without the greatest satisfaction I While they secure us the means of prosecuting the war with vigour, in case that should be necessary, they at the same time furnish us with the ability to secure a peace on safe and honourable terms, in case our enemies should begin to be, swayed by principles of justice and moderation. I hope, sir, we shall carry to the, foot of the throne the strongest assurances of our firm determination to support his majesty, in whatever measures he may judge advisable for attaining the great objects which we have in view—security and national prosperity. With these sentiments, sir, I most heartily second the motion of the hon. gent., and hope that we shall all willingly and zealously rally round our. King and constitution to preserve them in safety and honour, at a crisis the most

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momentous that G. Britain or Europe ever experienced.—After the motion had been thus seconded, the speaker read the address to the house, and was proceeding to put the question, when
Mr. Foxrose and spoke to the following purport: It is not my intention, sir, to trouble the house for any long time upon this occasion, for I certainly do not mean to move an amendment to the address now proposed, nor to advert to any but a few parts of it; but I wish to make a few observations on what appear to me to be two considerable omissions in his majesty's speech; for there is one part of the address on which I do not know how, uninformed is we are at present, we can give an opinion; although, perhaps, there would be no material difference of sentiment, if we understood it, but of which, without information, we cannot judge. I allude to that part of the address in which we say we approve of his majesty's determination not to explain himself further to us on an interesting subject, until he has had intercourse with certain powers. Now, it does not appear to me, I confess, upon the first view of it, that there was any necessity of entering into, that sort of explanation. It may be necessary, or wise, for his majesty to express his wishes for peace, and to communicate to the world that he is willing to enter into the discussion of, and to accede to such terms as were likely, or which ought to produce it; but, when he says he cannot enter into such considerations, until he has consulted certain courts, I do not see how we can approve of this conduct, until we know what is the nature of the intercourse between this Country and the continental powers. Now, though if this were understood generally, or if I understood it, there would probably be no difference of opinion, yet as I do not know, and am not permitted to know, those circumstances, which call for intercourse with other powers, I must think feat the address pledges the house to too much; that it pledges it to approbation of the determination not to explain at present the nature of the communications in question. But as to this explanation in itself, I, for one, must confess that I see no necessity for any explanation, but what appears already on the face of the speech: for his majesty there expresses himself clearly, making professions of a wish for peace. His majesty says directly, that he entertains this wish, but can give no fur-
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ther explanation until he has consulted certain powers, not allies indeed, but powers with which he has certain discustions, certain confidential intercourse. As I said before, it is impossible to judge of the propriety of all this, until we know the nature of that confidential intercourse j though if I did know it, I might, perhaps, be one to approve of it; but how can the house approve of a statement, the occasion and circumstances of which it does not know?—There is one omission in the address which I own has a great deal disappointed me. After what passed three or tour years ago on the subject of the Catholics of Ireland, I did expect, when I heard the name of the lion, mover, that the very first communication from the throne would have had a reference to that subject. I did hope, that his majesty would have been advised, by some one of his present ministers at least, to recommend to parliament the taking of that subject into consideration, in order to afford to us the full effect of the union, and to give to that part of the united kingdom that advantage which I think so essential to its peace. I say, my surprise was increased at this omission when I first heard the name of the hon. gent, who moved this address. I cannot help lamenting, that in the speech from the throne, there is not one word expressive of an intention to recommend that subject to our consideration: a subject so important, that if it be not speedily taken into consideration, no honest man can say there is any thing like stability and security to that part of the British empire. Nor could I collect any allusion to that subject even from the speech of the hon. gent, himself. He spoke indeed of the defensive state of Ireland; but that is a subject I shall not now discuss. I hope Ireland is well defended; but I know the best defence of Ireland is that which is the best defence of England, and of every country in the world-—the pure affection and united attachment of the people to the govt. under which they live, and by which they are protected.— There is another omission, which, although not less important, is still more surprising. I have observed on former occasions, that when measures have been taken by parliament for the purpose of increasing the power of the country, it was usual for his majesty to compliment us (when I have thought, very often, we had ill-deserved it) on the wisdom of our measures, but

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how many such compliments may have been just, (for I hope they were not all unjust), I will not discuss, nor to whom they were to be imputed. Some have declared, what others have denied, this to be a new administration; and that the measures we have now are more vigorous. Be that as it may, I expected we should have been told something of the efficacy of our measures, not merely alluding to the discipline of our volunteers, the skill of our navy, and the public spirit of the people; but that we should have heard something by way of commendation of some of our measures; but no notice is taken of any thing of that kind. Nothing is said of that measure which was supposed to make the whole difference between an administration of imbecility and that of vigour; I mean the measure of the right hon. gent. (Mr. Pitt) for the improvement of our military system. I expected we should have heard something of the difference between the two, but not a word. I believe that measure is now allowed to have totally failed. Speaking in the language of common sense, I take the purpose for which that measure was designed, and with a view to which it was adopted, to have completely failed; the consequence of which must be one of two things: either we must give up the object which we had in view by that measure, or adopt some other mode of carrying it into effect. Yet it did give me some surprise, that nothing was said upon that measure itself: neither was our attention called to any thing of that nature. I hope and trust we shall have these matters soon discussed; and in this I am the more confident, when I recollect that those who had not been generally the first to advise the house to take into its own Lands, as some persons called it, the functions of executive govt. by originating measures for the safety of the country in this house, had been resolute on points similar to this, feeling, as they said they did, they could not safely leave them to ministers. The right hon. gent, not only supported measures of that kind, but brought some of them forward himself; and, although he did not then persuade the house to adopt them, yet he had nearly all the effect of persuasion, by convincing the house that something of the kind ought to be adopted. I hope that system will be followed up now; for as to the efficiency of the new bill I have just alluded to, which kept the house in a suc-
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cession of debates, I believe that is entirely out of the question. I believe the advantage of it, as a system to increase the military strength of the country, to be none.—As to the Spanish war, his majesty informs the house, that he intends to lay the papers before us relative to that subject, and therefore to prejudge it would be unwise. I have, however, no difficulty in saying, that the seizing of the Spanish frigates, loaded and destined as they were, does certainly bear an unseemly appearance, and one not much to the honour of this country. Never was there a time when this nation ought to stand so clear of all reproaches similar to those which I allude to in, the present instance.—There is mention made in the speech of the violation of the law of nations by the French govt. We should never look at such conduct without the most pointed disapprobation; bur, if we are to make that a part of the war in which we are engaged, it is exceedingly material that we, who thus contend for good faith, moderation, and justice, should be ourselves faithful, moderate, and jus;. 1 should have thought so at any time, and under any circumstances; but more especially at this time, and under the present circumstances, as we make the want of justice and moderation the principal cause of the war. I therefore hope, that neither Spain, nor any of the surrounding nations, whether neutral or at war, whether they vie with each other for outrage, violation, and contempt of the law of nations, or for their reverence for them, will not have it in their power to accuse us justly of any outrage, violation, or contempt of the law of nations, or even, of any indifference to the principles of equity and moderation; and I hope that no partiality for our own country will induce us to overlook any of those principles, whether we look towards Spain or any other power; but that we shall view our own conduct as we would that of a nation that was indifferent to us, with a, due regard to the principles of strict justice and absolute impartiality. I would go further, and say, that, under all the circumstances that belong to this contest, I would not insist on strict justice in every particular, against the power in dispute with us; and I hope the question, whenever it comes to be discussed, will be discussed with good temper and propriety.
The Chancellor of the Exchequer.—I do not, sir, conceive it necessary, at this time,

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to trouble the house with any observations, but I think it necessary to allude to a few things which have fallen from the hon. gent, who spoke last. The hon. gent, has expressed some degree of surprize that the nature of those communications with some of the continental powers, alluded to in his majesty's speech, has not been more distinctly explained to the house. He has declared it to be impossible to judge of the necessity of making a communication of the recent overture of the French govt. without knowing on what terms our relations with those powers now stand. I confess it appears to me that the speech does state what is fully sufficient to warrant such a communication. It states distinctly, that confidential communications do subsist betwixt his majesty and some of the continental powers; and it gives the house assurances of the magnanimous sentiments entertained by the Emperor of Russia, relative to the highest interests of Europe, as well as the security and independence of this country. All those then, who agree that in making, any peace we should look to the situation of the Continent, and think of the most effectual means of establishing those ancient relations which French ambition has overthrown, must be of opinion, that the speech does disclose all that it is now necessary to discover, and will acquiesce in the expediency of being satisfied with what his majesty has laid before the house. I admit, that a period will come, when the house will have a fair right to demand much more ample information, but I flatter myself it is fully aware, that circumstances may exist which would render it equally imprudent and impolitic to enter into a minute or particular description of our relations with the continental powers. I hope, therefore) that the information furnished by the speech will, in the mean time, be received as satisfactory under all circumstances.—As to the other points to which the hon. gent, has alluded, being connected with subjects which will, in all probability, at no remote period, engage the attention of the house, I think it unnecessary for me to go now into any length of discussion. I cannot, however, help saying a few words on what the hon. gent, has termed omissions in the speech. The hon. gent. began with expressing his astonishment that the state of Ireland was not even alluded to; and argued, that till the situation, of the Irish Catholics was
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taken into consideration, that country-never can enjoy any thing like permanent tranquillity or repose. In the broad view which the hon. gent, took of the question, it is impossible for Ireland ever to enjoy the smallest advantage from the union, fill the measures which he appears desirous of recommending are actually pursued. For my part, I entertain a very different view of the subject, for though Ireland certainly, has not derived all the advantages from the union, which that measure is capable of affording, I will maintain, that great advantages have already attended it, and many others may speedily be expected. But I beg leave to ask, how it comes to pass, that, though tour years have elapsed since the union, those measures which the hon. gent. now so loudly calls for, have never been even once recommended? What is there at the present moment which renders these measures so necessary now, that did not formerly suggest the propriety of their adoption? If he himself has entertained the same views which he professes to entertain, he could not consistently have suffered the subject to have remained so long dormant. What the reasons are which have induced me, who entertain very different views of the subject, to suffer it to remain dormant, I shall, on a future occasion, have an opportunity of stating, and I flatter myself, that the house and the country, will give me credit for consistency, when I have stated the reasons which induce me still to think that the matter should remain dormant at the present moment.—The hon. gent. has adverted to the bill which I last session introduced for the defence of the country, and has expressed a hope that some more efficient bill will be substituted in its room. This is not the time for a discussion of the subject, but I feel myself called upon to state, that I have seen no reason to alter my opinion of the grounds on which that bill was founded, and though I admit that, its effects, in adding to the numbers of our military force, have indeed been exceedingly small, nothing that has happened, considering all the circumstances under which the bill was proposed, and the principles on which it proceeded, induces me to think that it was not a measure which ought to have been adopted. I am ready at any time to meet the hon. gent, and his friends in reviewing the state of the country in all its various relations, I

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am ready, in particular, to meet the hon. gent. respecting the state of our military force, and the improved condition in which it now stands, compared to what it was last session. I am ready to shew that, at the present moment, we have a regular disposable force far more considerable than many gentlemen seem to be aware of. But, while I say (his, I am also perfectly willing to agree with these gentlemen, that this regular disposable force should be still further augmented. I will not at all attempt to dispute that means, quite independent of the bill which has been alluded to, might with great propriety be employed for augmenting our regular disposable force to an extent which could render it highly serviceable, whether employed for objects connected, with our separate interests, or the interests and independence of the Continent.—On the subject of the rupture with Spain, the hon. gent, has very prudently declined offering any opinion till the documents referred to in the speech from the throne are laid before the house. He has, however, in alluding to the detention of the Spanish frigates, thrown out a sort of suspicion that this was a violent and unjustifiable proceeding. In a very short time, I am persuaded that the hon. gent. and his friends will see reason to alter that opinion, and confess that their suspicions were erroneous. I fully agree with the hon. gent, that at all times, but especially at the present moment, it is highly necessary to keep up the high character of the country for moderation, justice, and honour, and I am firmly convinced, that when the whole of the late transactions with Spain come to be explained, the detention of the frigates will not at all appear, even in the smallest degree, a departure from the strictest rules of moderation or justice. At the time these frigates were detained, I am persuaded it will be seen that his Majesty might have seized them by an act of open hostility; for Spain at that time was substantially guilty of acts of open hostility against this country. As to the capture of the Spanish frigates, I trust the house will clearly see, in that circumstance, only an additional instance of the moderation and justice of his majesty, who, in circumstances that would have warranted the most decided hostilities, wished as long as possible to leave the door open to conciliation, at the same time that he was absolutely bound to take such measures of precaution as not to
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allow an enemy, already too formidable, to acquire any additional means and resources to carry on the war against this country. When all the circumstances of the case, shall be laid before the consideration of die house, I make no doubt but that they will be of opinion, that so far from acting with any violence or injustice towards Spain, his majesty has acted with as much moderation, forbearance, and tenderness, as it was possible for him to do. All these topics may, in their turn, be the subject of discussion in tills house; but I am glad that it appears to be the general opinion at present, that until these subjects come regularly forward for discussion, we should reserve the consideration of them for the present, and postpone debating them.
Mr. Fox,in explanation why he had not brought forward the subject of catholic emancipation, stated, that it was perfectly well understood that any man bringing forward this question unconnected with govt. would have had very little chance of gaining the object. It was, besides, very doubtful how far the measure, would be acceptable to the catholic body, if not taken up, as a matter of justice and policy, by the executive govt.
Mr. Windhamvindicated the conduct of his hon. friend (Mr. Fox) as perfectly consistent. He had not brought forward the subject of catholic emancipation during the existence of a cabinet avowedly hostile to that measure; nay, whose very elevation to power was founded on their opposition to it; but it was very different when the cabinet professed a desire to have this measure brought about, and when the person at the head of the cabinet had given an open avowed opinion in favour both of its policy and its justice. This was sufficient to justify the consistency of his hon. friend in recommending the subject to the right hon. gent, at the present moment.—But, leaving this topic, the right hon. gent, proceeded to make some observations on the information conveyed by the speech, respecting the state of our continental connections. He was free to acknowledge, that he thought the information on this subject extremely scanty and unsatisfactory. He had expected and hoped something distinct and specific, but he had been disappointed. The house were indeed told of the wise and dignified manifestation of the interest entertained by the Emperor of Russia for the independence of the continent; but the

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house had no means of knowing to what extent that Sovereign was disposed to cooperate with us against France, or what exertions he was willing to make for the restoration of the ancient balance of power in Europe. As, however, a prospect of further information was held out; as the house were led to believe that satisfactory documents would be afforded, he had the less hesitation in agreeing to the address. —Having stated this generally, the right hon. gent, went on to make a few remarks on the language of the address, relative to the rupture with Spain, lie was rather afraid that the language conveyed something too much like an approbation of the rupture, even before the house were in possession of the documents necessary to found an opinion. Perhaps he was mistaken in this, but the words sounded in his ears very much as if this were their import, and he was therefore anxious to guard against any idea that the house gave the slightest sanction either to the rupture with Spain or the detention of the Spanish frigates. Though in the absence of all documents the house could not pronounce either final approbation or final disapprobation, yet he must contend, that it was not therefore necessary or proper that nothing should be said. On the contrary, it was is many cases desirable, that an opinion should be given on the successive stages of a business of this sort as they severally appealed at the time. In private causes, where few were interested besides the parties, where the whole was dispatched in a short time, judgment might, and ought, in general, to be deferred to the last. There was nothing to make it necessary that any opinion should be declared, till the whole was gone through. Bui not so in these causes of nations, tried before the tribunal of the world, and where the parts did not succeed each other but at long intervals. It might then be often of great consequence, that the feelings of people should manifest themselves, on the several states of the question as they successively arose. He should be sorry, for instance, in the present case, if, informed of this cause no further than they then were, any sentiment could be felt about it, but that of strong reprobation, and if, moreover, that sentiment were not expressed. It was useful to have it known, how individuals, bow the country felt upon the question such as it then appeared; reserving, of course, their
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final judgment till the whole of the case should be finally before them. He was anxious, therefore, to be understood as stating his opinion, subject to such explanations as might here after be given, (which he could not deny to lie possible, but was wholly unable to anticipate, and should be most happy to hear) that the principle and policy of the war wre, to say the least of them, highly questionable, and the mode of commencing it the most disgraceful and criminal of any that he could call to mind. This was the feeling which-he had at present, and which, be feared, he must continue to keep, should it not happily be done away by the disclosure of circumstances not now known, nor easily conjectured. He had an observation to make on the description given in the address of the stale of our regular army, which is said to be in a respectable condition. If the respectability spoken of was meant to be applied to the quality of cur regular force, no one could assent to the statement mere cheerfully. No man had a higher opinion than he had of the valour and discipline of our regular army. If, on the other hand, it was applied to their number, he could by no means admit the truth of this assertion. The address spoke of the improved discipline of our numerous volunteers. On that subject he would only remark, that admitting the improvement really to have taken place, the statement should have been, the improved discipline of our less numerous volunteers.— He really could not help thinking, that the language of the address respecting the invasion was quite superfluous, and might very easily have been omitted. We had no evidence that the enemy had given up the threat of invasion. We only knew that his preparations were now more complete than at any former period. The enemy had not thought proper to disclose to us when his long threatened attack was actually to take place; and there was no sort of evidence, that if once seriously entertained, it was now seriously abandoned. The wording of the speech was, indeed, cautious in that respect. It did not say that our preparations had deterred him, but that they were sufficient to deter him. But even this had better have been omitted. As we knew nothing about the matter, we had better have said nothing about it, The right hon. gent, next touched on the violent and unjust proceedings of the French govt. mentioned in the address,

41
Among these, there were few more marked and direct, than that which was now operating in the person of Capt. Wright, of the Vincejo ship of war. This of-officer, as the house would probably know, was taken valiantly fighting on board his ship, in circumstances of the most clear and legitimate warfare; but, because the enemy chose to entertain suspicions respecting former services performed by him, and which, if true, would be nothing to their purpose, was detained a close prisoner in the Temple, and threatened even with farther proceedings, contrary to every rule and practice of war, as observed among civilized nations. He had now remained in that situation longer than he (Mr. W.) could immediately state (persons who view misfortunes at a distance do not count the period of their duration, as, it was to be feared, he must do who reckoned his days and hours through the bars of a prison), and far longer than it was for the honour of this country that be should have so remained. The right hon. gent, said, he had brought forward the subject at the close of the last session, and he now renewed it at the commencement of the present. If ministers were doing their duty, as he had reason to hope they were, the mention of the subject, and the manner in which, he was sure, it would be received by the house, would give support to their endeavours. If they were not, the same circumstances would serve as an admonition, and co-operate with the opinion which be wished to impress, that if other means failed, it was high time to have recourse to measures, which, whether effectual or not, must at last be resorted to, namely, the use of a similar treatment to all those officers whom the fortune of war had thrown into our power. These were the only means which nations had of enforcing a due observance of the laws of war, in favour of those who risked themselves honourably in their service. —The right hon. gent, before he sat down, expressed his regret that his hon. friend (Mr. Fox) had not given notice of the renewal of his motion, for a committee to examine the state of the national defence. He thought such a committee fully as necessary now as at the period when it was proposed last session. If his hon. friend, or some other gent, did not take up the business, he should certainly think it his duty to bring it under consideration on an early day. The right hon. gent, afterwards
42
named Monday se'nnight for that purpose. The question was then put upon the address, and agreed to ncm. con.—Adjourned.

Preamble
This day, at three o'clock, his Majesty came down in state to the House of Peers and opened the session of parliament. His Majesty being seated upon the throne in his royal robes, Mr. Quarme, the deputy usher of the black rod, was sent to the commons to demand the immediate attendance of that house. The speaker, accompanied by several members, forthwith appeared at the bar, when his Majesty was pleased to deliver the following most gracious speech:
"My Lords and Gentlemen,
"Since the end of the last session, the preparations of the enemy for the invasion of this kingdom have been continued with incessant activity; but no attempt has been made to carry their repeated menaces into effect.—The skill and intrepidity of my Navy, the respectable and formidable state of my Army and Militia, the unabated zeal and improved discipline of a numerous Volunteer Force, and the general ardour manifested by all classes of my subjects, have indeed been sufficient to deter them from so presumptuous and desperate an enterprise. While this spirit continues to animate the country, and its voluntary exertions for its own defence subsist in their full vigour, we need not fear the consequences of the most powerful efforts on the part of the enemy. But let us never forget, that our security has arisen from the resolution with which we have met and provided against the danger, and that it can be preserved only by steady
2
perseverance and unremitting activity.— The conduct of the court of Spain, evidently under the predominant influence and control of France, compelled me to take prompt and decisive measures to guard against the effects of hostility. I have, at the same time, endeavoured, as long as it was possible, to prevent the necessity of a rupture; but, in consequence of the refusal of a satisfactory explanation, my minister quitted Madrid, and war has since been declared by Spain against this country.—I have directed a copy of the manifesto which I have caused to be prepared on this occasion, to be laid before you, together with such papers as are necessary to explain the discussions which have taken place between me and the court of Madrid. You will, I trust, be convinced by them that my forbearance has been carried to the utmost extent which the interests of my dominions would admit; and while I lament the situation of Spain, involved in hostilities contrary to its true interests, I rely with confidence on your vigorous support in a contest which can be attributed only to the unfortunate prevalence of French councils.—The general conduct of the French government on the continent of Europe has been marked by the utmost violence and outrage, and has shewn a wanton defiance of the rights of neutral territories, of the acknowledged privileges of accredited ministers, and of the established principles of the law of nations.—Notwithstanding these transactions, so repugnant to every sentiment of moderation and justice, I have recently received a communication from the French

3
government, containing professions of a pacific disposition. — I have, in consequence, expressed my earnest desire,, to embrace the first opportunity of restoring *he blessings of peace on such grounds as may be consistent with the permanent safety and interests of my dominions; but I am confident you will agree with me, that those objects are closely connected with the general security of Europe. I have therefore not thought it right to enter into any more particular explanation, without previous communication with those powers on the continent with whom I am engaged in confidential intercourse and connection, with a view to that important object, and especially with the emperor of Russia, who has given the strongest proofs of the wise and dignified sentiment, by which he is animated, and of the warm interest he takes in the safety and independence of Europe.
"Gentlemen of the House of Commons,
"I have directed the estimates for the public service to be laid before you. I regret the necessity of any additional burdens being imposed on my people; but I am sure you will be sensible how much their future safety and happiness depend on the vigour of our exertions, and that in the mode of raising the supplies, you will continue to shew your anxiety for the support of public credit, and for restraining, as much as possible, the accumulation of the national debt.
"My Lords and Gentlemen,
"In considering the great efforts and sacrifices which the nature of the contest requires, it is a peculiar satisfaction to me to observe the many proofs of the internal wealth and prosperity of the country. It will, I am sure, be your great object to maintain and improve these advantages, and at the same time to take all such measures as, by enabling me to prosecute the war with vigour, may afford the best prospect of bringing it to a safe and honourable termination."
After his Majesty had left the house, lord viscount Sidmouth, late the right hon. Henry Addington, was introduced with; the accustomed formalities, sworn, and took his seat. His lordship's supporters were viscounts Wentworth and Sydney.— Lord St. Asaph, son of the earl of Ashburnhum, lately called up to the house by that title, was also introduced with the usual forms, and supported by lords Rivers and Walsmgliam.—Lord Caledon, one of
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the newly elected, Irish representative peers, took the oaths and his seat. After a short interval, the Lord Chancellor read a copy of his Majesty's, speech to both houses, and which was, as usual, afterwards read by the clerk at the table.
Lord Eliotthen rose for the purpose of moving an address to his Majesty, on his most gracious speech from the throne, and spoke as follows:—My Lords, it is not my wish to trouble your lordships at any great length in moving, as I shall have the honour to do, an humble address to his Majesty, in answer to the gracious communications his Majesty has just condescended to make to this house; but I think it necessary shortly to state the grounds on which I intend to found my motion for that address. The contest in which we are and which forms a Majesty's speech, is, the fate war, so closely connected with the cause of royalty, and so intimately interwoven with the essential interests of the country, that in adverting to the measures for supporting it, it seems to me, my lords, that the only question is, whether the address which I shall have the honour to move, be conformable to the usual practice of this house. I hope, in this point of view, it will not be considered as informal, and that it will receive the approbation of your lordships. The first point in his Majesty's speech is one on which, I am convinced, there can be but one opinion. That no invasion of this country has yet been attempted, notwithstanding the boast and menaces of the enemy, made even at the commencement of hostilities, is a subject which cannot fail to be gratifying to every person throughout the kingdom. Although it is true, that no apprehension need be entertained as to the event of an invasion, and convinced as I am, that no fear has been felt by the people as to the result of such an attempt, yet it ought not to be forgotten, that a desperate attempt at invasion made by a desperate enemy, would be productive of the most disastrous consequences. Notwithstanding the high state of preparation, however, in which our enemy has long been; notwithstanding it is a fact that, according to his own accounts, his armament for the purpose of invasion has long since been completed; notwithstanding the great display of ships and of forces on the opposite shore, our gasconading foe has never yet attempted to put his threat into execution. It must,

5
therefore, be a subject for just pride to your lordship?, and the country at large, that the enemy has been deterred from making the threatened attempt, by the vigour and decision displayed on our part, by the excellent arrangement and disposition of our forces, and by the admirable skill and judgment displayed in all our operations, both for home defence, and for the annoyance of the enemy; by which means he has not only been prevented from making the attempt, of the success of which he has so much boasted, but has been made to tremble in his turn for the safety of his own shores. It is not to any change in his purpose, but to our own energy und vigour that we are indebted for our safety. These advantages we owe to the excellent measures adopted for our defence, to the skill and gallantry of our officers and seamen, to the courage and admirable discipline of our army and militia, and to the patriotism and valour of another description of force unknown to former times, but which has been reserved to grace and adorn the present age. Formerly we relied upon the bravery and discipline of a regular army, and often had occasion to admire and congratulate their splendid achievements. Now, in addition to that great and essential support, another description of force has arisen in the persons of our brave and patriotic volunteers; who, actuated by the most fervid patriotism, have arranged themselves under the military banners of the country, for its defence against the attempts of a desperate enemy. A description of force this, which, whilst it is actuated by the most determined valour, far exceeds, in point of numbers, any former force of which this country could boast, and every previous calculation which could be formed as to its expected amount.— With regard to the war with Spain, my lords, I shall not now enlarge upon that subject, because we have not yet before us those documents and facts which can alone enable us to form a correct judgment as to the different bearings of the question. When, by the possession of those documents and facts, we are enabled to judge of the measures and conduct of his Majesty's ministers, then, of course, will be the time to go into the question m detail. It will not, however, he venturing to say too much in expressing my opinion, that the facts respecting the conduct of Spain which are already known, completely bear out 1iie conduct of ministers. Hostilities with
6
Spain were not, in my mind, so much a, question of justice as of policy; and when we consider the supplies sent by Spain to France, which contributed to enable the latter, to carry on war against this country, I cannot but think that no other course remained for his Majesty's ministers to pursue, than that which they have adopted; and their conduct appears to me so clearly entitled to confidence, that I think there can be no hesitation in agreeing to this part of the address.—With respect, my lords, to the other point in his Majesty' speech, namely, the communication from the French government, containing professions of a pacific disposition, I presume to think there can be but one opinion on the subject, and that that opinion must be to the effect contained in his Majesty's speech. The general conduct of the French govt. affords little hope of any sincere desire on its part for peace. The language of that govt. is now, however, very different from (that which it used at the commencement of the war, when it was boasted that England single-handed could not contend with France. That boast has now been given up, and an anxious desire for peace, has been substituted in its stead. I cannot pretend to explain the views with which these overtures have been made. The enemy may have various motives. He may hope to embarrass the govt. to create divisions in parliament, or discontent in the country, by exciting too eager a desire for peace. But, whatever his motives may be, your lordships must be convinced, that it is only by firmness and unanimity that a solid arid lasting peace can be. attained.— There only remains, my lords, one other topic for me to notice; namely, the flourishing state of our commerce. Upon this subject it is needless for me to enlarge, as it must be obvious to every one who bestows upon it the slightest portion of observation. These, my lords, are the grounds upon which I venture to offer an address to your lordship's notice, and which, I trust, will meet with your cordial approbation. His lordship concluded with moving an address to his Majesty, of which the following is a correct copy:—"Most gracious sovereign, we, your Majesty's most dutiful and loyal subjects, the lords spiritual and temporal, in parliament assembled, humbly beg leave to return your majesty our unfeigned thanks for your most gracious speech from the throne.—We beg leave to assure your Majesty, that this

7
house reflects with the greatest pride and satisfaction, that the skill and intrepidity of your Majesty's Navy, the respectable and formidable state of your Army and Militia, the unabated zeal and improved discipline of a numerous Volunteer Force, and the general ardour manifested by all classes of your Majesty's subjects, have, notwithstanding the incessant preparations for the invasion of this kingdom, been sufficient to deter the enemy from so presumptuous and desperate an enterprize. We fully concur and participate in your Majesty's sentiments, that while this spirit continues to animate the country, and its voluntary exertions for its own defence subsist in their full vigour, we need not fear the consequences of the most powerful efforts on the part of the enemy: and we in treat your Majesty to be assured that we shall never forget that our security has arisen from the resolution with which we have met and provided against the danger, and that it can be preserved only by steady perseverance and unremitting activity.—We request your Majesty to accept our warmest acknowledgments for the communication which your Majesty has been pleased to make to us, relative to the War which Spain has declared against this country; and we entreat your Majesty to allow us to express the just sense we entertain of your Majesty's gracious condescension in having directed a copy of the Manifesto which your Majesty has caused to be prepared on this occasion to be laid before us, together with such papers as are necessary to explain the discussions which have taken place between your Majesty and the court of Madrid, and to assure your Majesty that we shall take them into our immediate and serious consideration, with the full resolution of adopting all such measures as are necessary to maintain the honour and dignity of your Majesty's crown. and the security and interests of your dominions.—We entreat your Majesty to be persuaded, that it is impossible for us not to observe in common with all Europe, that the general conduct of the. French govt. on the continent has been marked by the utmost violence and outrage, and has shewn a wanton defiance of the rights of neutral territories, of the acknowledged privileges of accredited ministers, and of the established principles of the law of nations.—We return your Majesty our most grateful thanks for informing us, that notwithstanding these transactions, so repugnant to
8
every sentiment of moderation and justice, your Majesty has recently received a communication from the French govt. containing professions of a pacific disposition; and we humbly request your Majesty to be assured, that we are thoroughly persuaded of your Majesty's earnest wish to embrace the first opportunity of restoring the blessings of peace on such grounds as may be consistent with the permanent safety and interest of your dominions: we at the same time on our part, beg leave to be allowed to declare our entire concurrence in opinion with your Majesty, that those objects are closely connected with the general security of Europe.—We therefore rejoice to learn that your Majesty is engaged in confidential intercourse and connection with foreign powers with a view to that important object, and especially with the Emperor of Russia, who has given the strongest proof of the wise and dignified sentiments by which he is animated, and of the warm interest which he takes in the safety and independence of Europe, and we are fully satisfied of the propriety and wisdom of your Majesty's determination in declining to enter into any more particular explanations without a previous communication with those powers.—We beg leave, with every sentiment of respect and dutiful attachment to your Majesty, to testify our most grateful sense of your Majesty's uniform regard for the welfare of your people, and to assure your Majesty, that, in considering the great efforts and sacrifices which the nature of the contest requires, we most cordially participate with your Majesty in the satisfaction which your Majesty derives from the many proofs of the internal wealth and prosperity of the country; and your Majesty may depend upon our constant and animated endeavours to maintain and improve these advantages, and at the same time to take all such measures, as, by enabling your Majesty to prosecute the war with vigour, may afford the best prospect e of bringing it to a sale and honourable termination."
Lord Gwydirrose to second the address, and spoke as follows:—My lords; after the most gracious speech we have this day heard delivered from the throne, and the extensive view which the noble lord has just taken of the address he has proposed, it will be unnecessary for me to trouble you with a long discussion of the subject under debate. But, as an Englishman, it

9
is impossible not to view with exultation and confidence the exalted situation which this country at present enjoys.—Secure at home, and respected abroad, we may hear with tranquillity those vain-glorious boastings of our enemy, which in no single instance have been carried into effect: contented with a display of vessels and troops, he has not dared even to attempt the expedition he has so loudly proclaimed. His fleets and his flotilla have constantly remained under the protecting cannon of his own shores.—The long continuation of peace with Spain has been matter of much greater surprise to the public, than the declaration of war we have so lately heard. The declaration was reduced to a mere question of prudence: and our having so long abstained from that declaration, affords a strong presumption of our pacific disposition. Supplies in money, unauthorized by treaty, had been requested by Trance, and granted by Spain. Nor were they likely to be refused; her counsels and her riches, her Sleets and her armies had long, been subject to French despotism. Nor could peace with Spain continue for a moment after the interest's of France demanded war. Fresh engagements were entered into by France and Spain, and all explanation to us of the nature of, those engagements utterly refused.—In this state of things, were we quietly to wait the convenience of France and Spain? Were we to conduct the contest in the mode best suited to their wishes? Were we to become the willing dupes of fallacious promises, and by forbearance, almost assist in supplying-Spanish wealth for the payment of those armies, which within sight of our coasts were threatening our ruin? Or were we, by a manly and decisive conduct, to strike at the root of the evil, and anticipate the open hostility of Spain, by seizing those treasures which the French had put in requisition with the view of employing them for our destruction? Self-preservation seemed to demand the conduct which has been followed: and I have little doubt, that when the papers and documents are laid on your table, your lordships and the public will applaud the measure from a conviction of its justice.—With respect to the communications lately sent from France, it would be a waste of your lordships' time, were I to enter at large on a proposal the precise terms and extent of which are not made known to the house. But thus much at least we may decide:
10
that whatever may be the change of disposition which it may profess, our preparations and exertions should experience no relaxation. I would at this moment neither raise nor depress the hope of such a peace as the interest and humanity of this country equally demand; but peace to be a blessing must bring with it a moral and well-founded assurance of lasting and mutual benefit; not that false and hollow security which at best can tend only to feverish repose; peace in words, malignant hostility in actions.—In the conduct we adopt, we must not forget the lessons so recently taught by painful experience. It may neither be improper nor irrelevant to look back a little to the period of the last peace. From the concessions their made, and the eagerness shewn by this country, the first consul concluded, we were a vanquished nation; his conduct was in conformity to his opinion; insult was added to injury: and at the moment to which I allude, we had only to choose between instant hostilities, and lasting degradation. The nation felt, as I trust it always will feel, whenever its honour and dearest interests are attacked: so outraged and insulted, it preferred danger to disgrace, and unanimously approved of the renewal of the war.—The first consul, who had proposed peace only as a more efficacious and secure mode of carrying on the contest, who. knew he should obtain by concession what he had no hope of gaining by force, was not prepared for so early or so vigorous an exertion: his rage and disappointment should not be forgotten.—If we are now to presume that honourable and permanent peace is the real object of the recent communication from France, great and sudden must have been the change of disposition in the government of that country. It is unnecessary to state the events of the last few months which call for this observation. They are too deeply engraved on the recollections of your lordships to need any fresh detail. We may hope for peace, but we must prepare for war: if the necessary exertions and privations are beyond all former precedent, the object for which we have to contend is above all value. In this sentiment I trust we shall all' agree, that no sacrifices are too severe, no efforts too great or too powerful, to support and secure the honour, dignity, and true interests of the nation. Strongly and deeply impressed with these sentiments, I have presumed to support the address

11
which has been proposed. I have now only to return your lordships my most humble and sincere thanks for the indulgence and attention I have had the honour to receive.
The Earl of Carlisle.—I do not rise, my lords, to disturb that unanimity by which I am aware it is so much to be wished the house should be actuated on a subject of so much importance as the present. When I heard his Majesty's most gracious speech read, so cordially did I agree in every sentiment expressed in it, that I did not think it would have been necessary for me to say a single word on the subject. Some observations, however, which have fallen from the two noble lords who moved and seconded the address, seem to require some explanation. I, for one, am anxious to enter my protest against the supposition, that in agreeing to the address as proposed, I thereby pledge myself on a subject as to which the house is not in possession of the facts necessary to enable them to form a judgment. I allude, my lords, to the war with Spain. On that subject, whatever may be my own private opinion, whatever I may know as an individual which may induce me to think that the conduct of the govt. of this country has been correct or otherwise, this house is not in possession of such parliamentary information as can warrant it at present in expressing any opinion on the subject. As, however, the subject has been started, though I think the noble lords would have acted more discreetly in waving it, I must be excused in saying a few words on that point. The noble lord who spoke last has said, that we were not bound to sit tamely by while the Spanish court were supplying our enemies with money and other requisites for waning against us. This I am by no means inclined to dispute. But then, my lords, it would have been but fair and reasonable, in order that a war might not unnecessarily be plunged into, that some precise requisition on the subject should have been made to the Spanish court, and a day fixed for them to give their decisive answer, before hostile measures had been resorted to. I am anxious to know if this has been the case. It is necessary not only that a thing should be fair, equitable, and justifiable in itself, but that the manner in which it is commenced should likewise be fair, just, and agreeable to the known and established law of nations. There is in one part of this business too, an occur-
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rence of a very melancholy and deplorable kind, which, without imputing blame to any particular person, or at all inquiring into the immediate cause of the accident, I cannot help thinking might have been guarded against. If it was deemed fair and justifiable to detain the Spanish ships, might it hot have been so managed that they should have been met by a force of such superior magnitude, as to have made it not dishonourable in them to submit to the detention, rather than by one of such equal force, as would have entailed disgrace on them, had they surrendered without resistance? Again, if it was fair that ships of war having treasure on board should be detained, I am anxious to know where the policy or propriety could exist of allowing merchants' ships to pass unmolested? These, my lords, are some of the circumstances connected with the rupture with Spain, which appear to me to require explanation, and on account of which, I could not allow the address to pass, without stating that I by no means pledge" myself to say, when the necessary papers are before the house, that I shall think that that business has been properly conducted.— There is another part of the address which I cannot allow to pass without observation. It is said, that our army is on a respectable and formidable footing. This term our army was thought six months ago not to deserve, and under the administration of a noble lord (Sidmouth), it was strongly insisted that our army was greatly defective; nay, that was generally understood to have been the ground for that noble lord's retiring from office. It was not in one particular branch too, that this deficiency was said to exist, but in every department. The right hon. gent, who came in, promised us great things; and an act was passed, under his auspices, to effect this purpose. So far, however, from answering the end proposed, it is now allowed that this act has been found completely useless; indeed, a more ridiculous, absurd, and oppressive act, was never conceived. Scarcely a single soldier has been raised by it; nor is it calculated at all for that purpose. By what means, then, I should be glad to ask, has our state of defence, so defective under the noble lord's administration, become so respectable and effective under his right hon. successor's, without any aid but the ridiculous, absurd, and unproductive act to which I have just alluded?. But I suppose it will be insisted

13
by the right hon. gent. (Mr. Pitt), that every thing is now very well, and that there is nothing inefficient or defective in the govt. of the country. I beg it, however, to be understood, that in agreeing to the address, I do not mean to admit the respectability of the state of our army, whenever that shall become the subject of discussion.
Lord Hawkesbury.—My Lords; I feel proper to trouble your lordships with a few observations, in consequence of a part of what has fallen from the noble earl. There never existed an occasion on which general unanimity could be more justifiably called for on the part of his Majesty's govt. than in the present moment. Upon the general sentiment, with respect to the leading topic in the communication from the throne, I trust no Englishman can entertain but one opinion. No doubt can exist as to the incumbent duty of using every exertion, under the present circumstances, to support the honour of his Majesty's crown, and the dignity of the country at large, in carrying on with vigour the important contest in which we are engaged, in order to bring it to an honourable and prosperous issue; such an issue as shall be consistent with the honour and dignity of this country, and the interests of these powers of Europe with whom we are connected by amity and good faith. Under such considerations alone can peace be deemed desirable, and whenever it can be secured upon such grounds, sensible I am, that it will be cheerfully embraced by his Majesty's govt. By too great an extent of concession, and by discovering too great an eagerness for negotiation, I fear it was, that we fell into the snare which led to the present war.— The noble earl has particularly touched upon two points, though not, as I understood him, with a view of opposing the address. The first related to the question of the war with Spain, which the noble earl seems to think would have been unnecessary, were it not for some apprehensions which had fell from the noble mover of the address. In these, however, I imagine, that the noble lord must have been misunderstood, because he did not say any thing that implied a wish that the house should be committed beyond the simple specification in the address. We must, as the royal communication informs us, have the manifesto and the other official documents before us, ere we can properly give
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any opinion upon the subject. His Majesty trusts that these papers will be duly-considered; and all that is proposed by the address is to say, that your lordship will consider the subject, coupled with an assurance that we are willing to support the dignity of the crown, and the interests of his Majesty's subjects. I heard nothing that fell from either of the noble lords which went to justify the inference of the noble earl. With the latter, however, I agree, that the subject should be considered in its various bearings of justice and policy; and though a particular line of conduct, if adopted by his Majesty's govt. may be fully warranted by the justice of the case, still, under the existing circumstances, it might not have been politic, and, in the former view, the question of war might have been brought to a short issue. When this important question comes to be discussed, I shall give my opinion as to the policy of entering into hostilities at the period to which I allude, and this I shall found upon the circumstances and facts of the case. There is, I admit, a third point of view, independent of both the former, in which the question may be considered, viz. how far, in the progress of the affair, the conduct of ministers may have been inconsistent with the honour of his Majesty's crown, or militate against that character for generous liberality, which is the distinguished characteristic of the British nation? On these considerations, however interesting or important, I shall forber to expatiate until the papers are regularly before the house; but it is proper your lordships should feel assured, that no disposition existed on the part of govt. to do that which may wear an appearance of rashness or precipitation; it is also important it should even now be understood, that the transaction alluded to, though justified by every principle of the law of nations, or of self-defence; is not necessarily connected with the situation in which the two countries are now relatively placed. I am happy in the opportunity of informing your lordships, that the point on which the noble earl's principal doubt seems to hang, was literally acted on in the very manner he himself has suggested. An explanation was demanded from the Spanish govt. and a particular day fixed for the final answer of that court. The explanation demanded by our govt. was refused; intimation of our resolution to detain their Ships was made;

15
our minister at Madrid had applied for passports; had obtained them, and had actually taken his departure, before the news of the capture of their, ships had reached Spain, I agree, however, with the noble earl, that both the justice and policy of the measure, and the mode in which it has been executed and carried through, are all subjects proper for investigation, but they will come to be judged of more properly when the necessary papers, are on your lordship's table.—In regard to the state of the internal defence of the country, which forms the second part of the noble earl's animadversions, I will, without any reference to what has transpired on former occasions, venture to contend, that, considering the circumstances of the country at the period alluded to, a more formidable and effective military force has been constituted than was firmed at any corresponding period of any preceding war; and that the present state of our military preparations is positively unparalleled in the history of the country. It would be premature to go into minute details as to the state of the public force in the united kingdom, at this moment. I can, however, assure the noble earl, that in troops of the line, militia and volunteers, ready to take the field, it considerably exceeds 600,000 men; and that under the operation of an act of parliament passed the session before last, commonly called the army of reserve act, the disposable part of that force has been increased to an extent, and with a rapidity beyond all expectation, and has proved superior to every other expedient. Before I sit down, I cannot help expressing a sentiment of proud exultation, that after two years of war, in which the enemy has exhausted all his powers and resources to effect his determined purpose of invading our shores, he has been repelled by the menacing front which the vigour of this country has opposed to him. The spirit and zeal of the country never rose so high as it is at present, and that it has so risen, is owing to those blessings which every Englishman enjoys under the protection of our happy and glorious constitution.
The Duke of Clarencedid not expect, after what had fallen from his noble friend behind him (Earl Carlisle), that another word would have passed on the subject of the present address. As, however the noble secretary of state had thought proper to make some explanations
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on the subject of the rupture with Spain, he must be excused for declaring that he Cordially agreed with the noble earl in thinking that it would have been more becoming the magnanimity and humanity of this great nation to have employed a fleet of double the strength, in the detention of the Spanish ships, when that detention was resolved on, by which means the unhappy accident which had occurred would have been avoided. The act by which it had been alledged that our army was to be rendered so completely effective, and by which such wonderful things were to have been produced, he also agreed with the noble earl in thinking absurd and ridiculous in the extreme, and completely inadequate to any good purpose, He hoped one of the first acts of the present session would be to repeal it.
Lord Granville.—My Lords; I rise to give my entire and complete concurrence to every part of the address. It so perfectly coincides with every expression which I have used, and every sentiment which I have uniformly professed, upon the great question which it embraces, I mean the question of war, that it must of necessity command my full and entire consent. I hold it my duty, and the duty of every man, not only in this house, but in the country at large, to concur in the determination to support the war in which we are engaged, with that vigour and firmness from which alone we can expect a successful and prosperous issue; to support it not merely by words, but by the most strenuous and efficient exertions in his power. By these, general words, I do not mean, however, to pledge myself to all the detail of the several subjects which the address may embrace. With all the particulars of the state of the military force of the country, and other subjects, which it comprehends, I cannot be presumed so well acquainted as to be able, at this moment, to give a decided opinion. Upon these, then, I must reserve myself, until the necessary papers are laid before the house, and I shall have had time to consider them; but, with this reservation, I repeat, that the address has my full and complete concurrence, and that it becomes the duty of every man in this country to support the war by his most vigorous exertions. I am sure it will have the concurrence of every British heart; for it must be the feeling of every man, that we ought steadily, constantly, and vigo-

17
rously to persevere in the contest in which we are engaged; until we ban bring it to a safe and honourable termination; and towards that effect, that we ought all to surround the throne with an unanimous declaration of supporting his Majesty in the resolution which he has this day so graciously expressed, of maintaining the honour and interests of the empire inviolate. I do assure the noble sec. of state, that there is no individual who enters more earnestly into the wish which lie so warmly expressed oft this subject than myself. We can have but one sentiment on the principle of national honour and security. Whatever differences there may be as to the manner of attaining the great end, there can be none as to the end itself. I rejoice, therefore, that the address is drawn up in terms in which this house can unanimously agree. I shall only, therefore, detain you, my lords, by a remark on two points, which form the principal features of the speech. The first is the overture which his Majesty has been graciously pleased to signify has been made to him by the French government. It is impossible to say at this moment more than this; that, uninformed as to the tenor and extent of that overture, and uninformed of the basis, if any, winch it proposes for a negotiation; or of the disposition and temper with which it was made; or of any one circumstance connected with it; we can only join his Majesty in a general declaration that peace is undoubtedly desirable, provided that it can be obtained upon terms which shall give permanent security to the British empire; that it shall be honourable as well as secure; and that it shall be consistent with the general interests and tranquillity of Europe. This is the declaration which his Majesty has been graciously pleased to make in his speech, and in this declaration I most perfectly concur. It is candid, honourable, and magnanimous. It is the dignified, as well as the political language which this country ought to maintain; and I therefore congratulate the house on the reception which has been given to this overture. I understand by the speech, that his majesty thinks it essential to the honour and security of this empire, that he should enter into no negotiation, until he has advised with those powers on the continent, with whom he is in the habits of confidential intercourse and connection. I rejoice in this declaration, and wish even that in practice the principle
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may be carried further. In my opinion, it is the wise policy of G. Britain, in the present state of Europe, to solicit communication with every power on this great and important subject; and to endeavour^ by every mean to obtain the co-operation of every power which has a community of interest, or a community of sentiment. There is no safe and no honourable peace to be obtained by other means. You must cultivate this understanding by every means; you must take no step without a constant, steady, and confidential communication, with every one who feels with you, that the very bonds of society, and of all just government, require this co-operation. Above all others, it is material to consult that great power who is represented as sympathising in your opinion; and who is, undoubtedly, by his position, interests, and capacity, your natural ally in this great work. These opinions I have never failed to express at every period of this war when I have had occasion to trouble your lordships, since I had the honour of a seat among you; and I rejoice to see that they now appear to be duly appreciated by the house in general. I have heard the noble lord's declaration to-night with the most heart-felt pride and satisfaction. They are such as he was heretofore accustomed to maintain, and they do him infinite honour. I wish I could repeat his words verbatim, that I might still further endeavour to enforce them on every heart; but I think his expression was, that it was by too great an extent of concession, and by shewing too great an eagerness for negotiation, that we had fallen into the snare which led to the present war, since it had taught our enemy to regard us as a conquered country. No reflection could be more true; no recollection could be more useful. It ought to be a warning to us in every step we take, and the experience of this fatal truth ought now to animate and guide our couucils,—As to the other subject, the new war in which we are involved with Spain, I perfectly agree with the noble? lord who moved the address; that we ought to lose no time in assuring his Majesty, that we will make every exertion to support his just rights, and the honour and dignity of his crown; but we cannot go one step further, until we have the papers laid before us, and have ascertained the grounds upon which we are called upon to enter into this war. I cannot agree that the mere naked fact, which is stated: by a

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noble lord as being notorious, that money supplies have been given by Spain to France, affords in itself a satisfactory proof of the justice of the war. Admitting that fact simply, I must go farther for an explanation of the grounds of war. I by no means wish to weaken or to diminish in any degree the just rights of the realm, in maintaining the laws of nations. But, on the other hand, with every leaning towards our own claims and rights, we ought not to be betrayed into a temper that shall make us forget what is due to our enemies. It ought to be recollected, that by the law of nations, a supply of succours by a neutral power to an enemy, to a limited extent, previously ascertained, and that by treaty concluded before the war, is not to be considered as an act of hostility, nor made the ground of a rupture. This is not my individual opinion alone, but it is the recognized sentiment of civilized Europe; and therefore I say, the mere noted fact of Spain having fulfilled her mere treaty with France, is not upon the face of it a justification of the war. But it is impossible to speak until we shall see the papers. I must, however, concur with my noble friend (the earl of Carlisle), that there are two points of view in which the war with Spain is to be examined; namely, as to the question of right, and the question of expediency. It is not merely requisite that the house and the nation should be convinced that the war was actually provoked, but also that in the mode of conducting the explanations that were demanded, and in all the steps that led to it, there was no harshness that could have been avoided. It is necessary to shew us that we have not merely right on our side, but that we did not by any improper, violent, and unjustifiable precipitation on our part, hurry them to a rupture, that by prudence, respect, and dignified forbearance, might have been prevented. It is only by facts, as they shall come out in the papers to be laid on the table, that these two points can be ascertained. And I only say, therefore, for the present, that a very unfavourable impression has been made on the public mind by the manner in which this rupture first manifested itself. This unfavourable impression is universally felt, and it is essential to the British character that it should be removed. Facts only can remove it; and I therefore trust, that no time will be lost by ministers, in giving
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us the means of forming a true, candid, and fair judgment. I have expressed no opinion that the capture of the Spanish frigates off Cape St. Mary is unwarranted by the law of nations; but the impression made by that proceeding is bad, nor is it in the least removed by what has been declared this day from authority; I mean that, before the capture was known at Madrid, our minister had demanded his passports, and quitted that city. God forbid that the departure of an ambassador from a country to which he was accredited, should be considered tantamount to a declaration of war, or a just ground for it! I shall, however, refrain from saying any thing farther upon the subject until a proper opportunity, and I hope that other noble lords will reserve themselves until the necessary documents shall be laid before the house. I shall only repeat, that I lament the unfavourable opinion which the capture of the Spanish squadron has produced. In a war like the present, when we avow the necessity of consulting the opinion of enlightened Europe, it becomes indispensable for us to show, that in our conduct we have not merely respected the rights of an independent state, but that we have observed all the respect that is due to the sovereign of a brave, a high-minded, and an honourable people.—With respect to other topics that have fallen from noble lords this day, I shall not detain you with any observations now. The state of our force, the magnitude of our preparations, and the security which we enjoy, will all be the subject of future discussion. In the mean time, I cannot hear it made the source of self-congratulation and of panegyric, that we have been near two years at war, and have not yet been invaded. I confess, that that is no great cause of triumph; and. I hope that we shall reap other laurels from the strength, spirit, and zeal of our armies and navies, than the mere boast that the enemy has not landed on our shores. My lords, I concur in the motion for the address, and I again express my sincere satisfaction at the sentiment which has been so unequivocally declared to-day, that it is only in communion with the great powers of Europe that we can listen to any terms of pacification with the govt. of France.
The Duke of Norfolkcould not give his cordial and implicit concurrence to an address, in answer to a speech on the first

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day of this session, which contained not the slightest mention of a measure, which was very generally expected to have formed one of its most prominent features, namely, the measure of final emancipation of the Catholics of Ireland. When a right hon. gent. now at the head of his Majesty's councils, formerly retired from power, it was avowed by him and his friends, and universally understood, that he retired only because he was not allowed to carry that measure for which his administration stood pledged with the Catholics of Ireland. When that right hon. gent, returned to power, every one naturally conceived, that one of the first acts of his administration would have been to bring that measure forward. The advanced period of the last session, at which he was called to his Majesty's councils, might afford a reason for not then bringing the question forward; but no one doubted that he would propose it early in this; and that it would have been noticed in the speech from the throne. Having himself had no communication with any individual or body of men of that community, and understanding only from the public prints, that the principal Catholics in Ireland had held some meetings, and resolved to prefer their petition to parliament, he wished now only to know what was the intention of his Majesty's ministers upon the subject. If he should receive for answer, that his Majesty's ministers declined to bring it forward, because the Catholics themselves had resolved to press on their own petition; or if (which he did not expect) he should be told by ministers, that the Catholics, in the present circumstances of the country, were content with the concessions already-made to them for the security of property and freedom of religion, he should urge the subject no further: but if not, it must form the subject of a future discussion; for he was convinced, that the best mode of securing peace, and maintaining our respect abroad, was by conciliation and unanimity at home,
Lord Grenvillewished to know on what day it was likely that the papers connected with the several points in his Majesty's speech would be laid upon the table, and when they would probably be taken into consideration?
Lord Mulgrave.—I cannot state any particular day for laying the papers, to which the noble lord alludes, upon the table;
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but I am anxious for as early a day as is possible, because I am convinced they will be found perfectly satisfactory, that they will support every statement founded upon them, and make out a complete case for the govt. and the country. I am also anxious that there should be full time between the period of their being laid upon the table, and that for taking them into consideration. At the same time I must regret, that there should be any delay in removing the unfavourable impression, made upon the mind of the noble lord; being convinced, that a perusal of them will effectually do away any unfavourable idea which he now entertains.—The question was then put by the lord chancellor, and carried nem. dis.

CONDUCT OF JUDGE FOX.—
The Marquis of Abercornrose and spoke to the following effect.—My lords; I take this opportunity to remind your lordships of a business which I took the liberty of mentioning to your lordships in the course of the last session. I allude to the charge of misconduct which I have brought forward against Mr. Justice Fox, one of his. majesty's judges in Ireland. It may be thought, perhaps, that there has been too great delay on my part for an affair of this nature. I can, however, safely say, that I am a man who never threw away an hour in my life which ought to have been devoted to any important business in which I was concerned, and of that description I consider the present to be. I can also pledge myself to your lordships; that upon this occasion almost the whole of my time has been occupied in preparing the charges, and the evidence in support of them, for the purpose of laying them before the house. It is, therefore, with a degree of satisfaction, although I confess the subject is not one calculated to afford pleasure, I can now inform your lordships, that every inquiry which I have made, and every information which I have been able to collect, have served to confirm me in my original opinion upon this subject; and that I have all the charges, and the evidence to support them, perfectly arranged and complete, except only one, and that is the least important of the whole. The form of the proceedings your lordships are to direct and determine, as you shall think proper. All that was necessary for me to do I have done, and am ready to lay the documents before the> house at a moment's notice
Lord Carleton.—I rise to inform the noble marquis who spoke last, and to inform this house, that I have received a fetter from Mr. Justice Fox, in which he declares himself perfectly ready and willing to hear and answer every charge that may or can be brought against him; but however prepared he may be, it is his wish that the business should not be brought forward until after the ensuing term. His object in wishing for this delay, is obvious, as he will of course have to examine some of the judges and lawyers in his defence. To call upon them at a time that would interfere with their business, is an inconvenience which ought to be avoided, if possible. It would therefore be desirable if the. time were so arranged, that the witnesses might be examined here, in the interval between the close of the term and the ensuing assizes, so as to enable them to return home in time to attend their circuits.
Lord Hawkesbury.—My lords; this is the first case of the kind, I believe, which has happened since the passing of the law, that renders the judges independent of the crown. J am extremely sorry that it should have ever been found necessary to take a business of this very important and peculiar nature into your consideration, and that such a case should have ever occurred. Of the circumstances you neither have, or can have, as yet, any information that can now be examined into. However, as articles of impeachment are to be laid before the house against a judge of the land; for the sake of pure justice, for the sake of the constitution, and for the fake of the judge himself, who is placed in this peculiar situation, and whose character rests upon the result, it is necessary that the charge should be investigated speedily. I would therefore propose, that the necessary documents be laid upon the table on Monday, and that the house shall, at the same time, determine upon the form and mode of the proceeding upon them.
Lord Grenvillesaid, that this being a new and important case, he must object to any proceeding upon the documents, on the same day in which they were laid before the house. As, however, the noble lord who spoke last, thought that the greatest dispatch was necessary, and as the noble marquis had stated himself perfectly prepared, he saw no reason why the papers should not be laid upon the table to-morrow, if no other business was pressing.
The Marquis of Abercornsaid; if it were the wish of the house that he should, bring forward the articles to-morrow, he would do sp; at the same time, he did not expect so early a day would be apt pointed. So late as this morning, some, alteration had been made in the wording of one of the articles, and he was not sure that it might not be made still more, complete. However, as he had declared, himself ready, he should not recede from, his word, but produce the articles- tomorrow, if the house thought fit, At the same time, he wished the business might stand over until Monday.
Lord Hawkesburyhoped, that the house would concur with him in opinion, that the papers should be laid upon the table on, Monday, and that Wednesday be fixed for taking them into their consideration—The house accordingly acquiesced in this arrangement.

COMMITTEE OF PRIVILEGES.—
Lord Hawkesburysaid, that from the manner in, which the noble lord, respecting whom he meant to make a motion, had acquitted himself, and the satisfaction which he had given their lordships, he anticipated their, unanimous vote. He accordingly moved, that Lord Walsingham be re-appointed chairman of the several committees, & c. of the house. Agreed to ncm. dis.—Adjourned