British Transport Police (Hansard, 17 March 2004)

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, the resources available to the British Transport Police are a matter for the BTP committee, which oversees the force and sets its budget. For 2004–05, the committee has agreed an increase of £25 million, taking the budget to £162 million. The rail industry is responsible for providing the necessary funding for the force. In addition to this funding, the Government have agreed to provide the BTP in 2003–04 with an additional £2.3 million for anti-terrorist response vehicles and equipment in London.

§ Lord Faulkner of Worcester
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. I am sure that he will want to join me in expressing a tribute to the officers of the British Transport Police for the courageous and effective work that they do in protecting the travelling public on the London Underground and on the national rail system. Notwithstanding the figures that he has just given in his reply on the funding settlement, is he aware that because of the need to provide for pensions and VAT, that settlement is still far short of what the force needs if it is to avoid a cut in the number of serving officers next year, rather than the increase which in order to counter terrorism most people would agree is reasonable? Does he further agree that it is wholly unreasonable for the railway companies and their passengers to pay the entire cost of the BTP anti-terrorism measures, which should more properly come out of national security budgets?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I am grateful to my noble friend for giving me the opportunity to pay tribute to the work of the British Transport Police. We all know the strains and stresses that all our police forces are under at present. My noble friend will recognise that there has been a substantial increase in the budget for this year. The number of officers serving in the British Transport Police is the highest that it has been for the past 10 years, and 100 extra officers are being deployed on the London Underground. I hear what my noble friend says about extra resources. There are two glimmers of light on the horizon in that respect. First, VAT judgment is such as to ensure that the budget is increased by another £3.7 million for this current year. Secondly, the Government will certainly take account of BTP's needs in the comprehensive spending review.

§ Viscount Astor
My Lords, the British Transport Police faces a Herculean task and we all wish it well. However, yesterday a spokesman for the British Transport Police said that its budget left the service facing a real challenge. Indeed, the British Transport Police Federation chairman, Alex Robertson, said that funding cuts would mean 50 fewer officers. Can the noble Lord give the House a categorical assurance that, when we are facing what the Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir John Stevens called "an inevitable attack", there will be no cuts in officers during this difficult time?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I am obliged to repeat the statistic that I quoted in my original Answer. The budget has gone up by £25 million to £162 million. That is difficult to describe as a cut. The number of officers employed will increase over this coming year, and I have also given the indication that 271 for obvious reasons the Government are keeping this budget under very close scrutiny, given the circumstances that we are all in at present.

§ Viscount Astor
My Lords, would the noble Lord be very kind and answer my question? Can he give an assurance that there will be no cuts in serving officers during this present time?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I have just quoted the budget, and I have indicated that the number of serving officers will increase. The concentration on the London Underground and an increase there is fully justified and supported by the Mayor of London, for the obvious reason that we recognise that the London Underground presents an obvious and conspicuous possible target.

§ Lord Imbert
My Lords, notwithstanding that there is an increase of £25 million in the British Transport Police budget, and that the Government have made a grant to the BTP, and in the light of the press revelation in the past 24 hours that only 95 per cent of London Underground stations are covered by closed circuit television, does the Minister agree that, however much it costs, every effort should be made to provide full coverage of closed circuit television on every London Underground station and every over ground station in the country, not only in the interest of the travelling public, but in the interests of the nation as a whole?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, the noble Lord will recognise the resource implications of applying CCTV to every overland station in the country. He will appreciate, as I do, that the fact that 95 per cent of our Tube stations are covered by CCTV is an important defence. We will be looking at the question of the other 5 per cent. Closed circuit television clearly plays an important role in defence against any possible terrorist activity.

§ Lord McNally
My Lords, would the Minister concede that the worrying word in the Question asked by the noble Lord, Lord Faulkner, is "jurisdiction"? Is he absolutely sure that the various security and police forces now operating counter-terrorism are operating with the fullest co-operation: that there are no turf wars, no squirreling of information and that there is real joined-up government in this war against terrorism?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I should have thought that co-ordination could be improved in every organisation, but I assure the noble Lord that effective co-ordination between all authorities concerned with counter-terrorist activity has been the source of very substantial activity in recent months. I would certainly want to reassure the House on this factor. Noble Lords may well have seen advertisements going up only this week about care with regard to the Underground and packages left unattended on it. That process was not 272 the result of the horrors of Madrid. That process was already in hand as a reflection of co-ordinated activity before the Madrid disasters occurred.