US Ships Decommissioning: Environment Agency Role (Hansard, 6 November 2003)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Lord Whitty)
My Lords, the Environment Agency, as the competent authority, has now made clear to the contracting parties and to relevant United States authorities that shipment of the vessels to Hartlepool cannot be completed consistent with international rules and community law.

§ Baroness Byford
My Lords, I thank the Minister for his response, but is he not as concerned as many of us that the Environment Agency originally gave approval for the work to be done by Able UK and saw no need for it not to be given? It was not until Friends of the Earth raised the matter in the High Court that the action was changed and withdrawal was enforced. Does the Minister accept that that reflects badly on the Environment Agency? Why did it happen in the first place?

§ Lord Whitty
My Lords, as I explained the last time we discussed the matter, the Environment Agency is one of many agencies with a role in the matter. It stated right at the beginning to the American authorities that some permissions that would be required for Able UK to carry out the work were either not in place or were disputed. It wrote to the American authorities in that regard. It is now clear that without those authorisations the work could not be completed at Hartlepool consistent with national and international law.

§ Lord Dixon-Smith
My Lords, does the Minister agree that it is remarkable—if reports are to be believed—that the Environment Agency could issue a licence to Able UK to undertake work that required either a dry dock or dry-dock equivalent facilities? Having issued that licence, a few weeks later it was required to rescind the licence— in part because those facilities apparently did not exist. Has the Environment Agency forgotten to use its eyes?

§ Lord Whitty
The trouble is that different permissions are involved here. We all accept that this is a complex and difficult case. The Environment Agency recognised that the facilities and skills available at Able UK were of the highest quality for carrying out the work. The issue of a waste management licence was, however, reviewed, and the licence now appears to be invalid. That is why the Environment Agency states that the task cannot be completed in line with legal obligations. There is also the issue, which has been the matter of court proceedings, of planning permission from Hartlepool Borough Council.

§ Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer
My Lords, were the discussions simply between the Environment 961 Agency and the US agency, or did the Government as a whole take a line on the matter? If so, was that because they believed that the technical capacity did not exist in the United States to undertake that work, despite its having an Act that forbids the export of such hazardous material? Further, where did the Government imagine that the hazardous waste would go, given that the UK is currently reducing its number of hazardous waste sites from 80 to only 15 to serve the whole of the country?

§ Lord Whitty
My Lords, several different points were somewhat mixed up in the noble Baroness's questions. The Environment Agency is the competent authority. It took the view—and warned the American authorities—that some permissions were not in place. The Environment Agency was convinced that Able UK had the basic facilities to carry out the work, but there was waste management action that had yet to be completed.
As for whether the Government were engaged, no, we were not then, at Ministerial or official level, because the Environment Agency is the competent authority. Because of the difficulties that we are now in, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State has in the past few days been in contact with the Americans and the various authorities dealing with the issue. We have told the Americans that it will not be possible to complete that voyage and task, and are now considering the consequences.

§ The Lord Bishop of Hereford
My Lords, does the Minister agree that the work should have been undertaken in the United States? Nevertheless, does he agree that we in the United Kingdom have the capability to undertake that difficult and dangerous disposal and decontamination work, and that it is therefore feasible for such work to be undertaken here? Does he further agree that as the alternative is probably the diversion of work to India or China, for example, where environmental and health and safety precautions are probably inadequate, it may sometimes be morally right for this country to take on such work?

§ Lord Whitty
Yes, my Lords. We have a very good facility at which there will be demand for scrapping and recycling ships, particularly tankers, over the next few years, and where the United Kingdom could provide the expertise and, therefore, work and income to the UK. The American Government recognised that there was a capacity constraint in the US. On this occasion—further to the question put by the noble Baroness, Lady Miller—they sought tenders from overseas as well as the United States. They gave the first contract to Able UK, but they have since given contracts to American contractors to carry out work on other ships.

§ Lord Clinton-Davis
My Lords, what communication are my noble friend's department and the Environment Agency having with the environment 962 unit in the Commission? I declare an interest, as I once worked for the environment commission. What particular communication was there in this case?

§ Lord Whitty
My Lords, the Commission authorities have been kept informed on the issue. Some of the legal issues relate to EU law applicable in this country, so the European authorities have been kept informed. But the contract is between an American authority and a UK company; therefore, the main questions have been dealt with by the UK authorities, mainly the Environment Agency.