Children at Protest Meetings (Hansard, 27 March 2003)

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, questions about the professional conduct of any member of a school's workforce are for head teachers, governors and local authorities to resolve. Serious cases of teacher professional misconduct can be referred to the General Teaching Council.

§ Lord Hardy of Wath
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that Answer. As a former schoolmaster, I 954 agree with the professional associations, which feel that children should not take part in demonstrations and protests in school time. There is parental concern because of the question of legal responsibilities. Where children are away from school, with the encouragement or assistance of adults—whether they be on the school staff or not—the relevant school governors should take the matter seriously. Will my noble friend invite school governing bodies to consider the matter carefully?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I recognise that, as a former member of the profession, my noble friend intends to do his utmost to uphold its prestige and reputation. There is no need for us to remind governing bodies of their responsibilities; they are able to discharge them. In the one or two cases in which the issue has arisen, the governing bodies have acted in exemplary fashion.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, for the benefit of parents who meet their legal obligation by seeing that their children attend school, can the Minister say who is in loco parentis for children who, having taken time out of the school day to protest, are injured?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, when the pupil is registered at the school, the responsibility lies with the school for the duration of the school day. That is why schools recognise that children who leave the premises must do so under supervision and can be at risk. We are all conscious of the fact that, at times, things go wrong on school trips and visits. However, it is highly unlikely that pupils would be supervised on a demonstration, and, as far as the school is concerned, any student who has left the school during school time has broken the agreement with the school to attend.

§ Baroness Sharp of Guildford
My Lords, on these Benches, we agree very much with the Answer that the Minister gave. However, although we should discourage children from leaving school during school time to demonstrate, we should encourage them to demonstrate. Is that not a good way of encouraging them to take an interest in politics?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, that would depend on the subject about which the students were demonstrating. I can think of subjects that might cause consternation to all of us.
We all recognise that we live in a democratic society and that young people are part of that democratic society, although, if they are under voting age, they have limited rights. Like the noble Baroness, we want young people to have an understanding of the issues facing society, and we are keen to promote citizenship. From time to time, that is bound to give rise to interesting and involved debates about current issues.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, the noble Lord did not answer my question. I asked who was in loco parentis in such a situation.

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I thought that I had made the situation clear. If the pupil has registered 955 for attendance at the school, the school takes responsibility. If the students then take themselves off away from the school without permission, the school has an obligation to do something about it. In the first instance, it would notify parents, who would need to know about that unauthorised absence.
There is no doubt that, when a child under school leaving age registers at a school, that child is under the auspices of the school authorities.

§ Lord Hardy of Wath
My Lords, will my noble friend consider the fact that, in some cases, children from primary schools were involved in the demonstrations? Will he express the hope that the Liberal Party would not wish to see those children involved in demonstrations?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I imagine that anybody who wants to be a Liberal has to start fairly young and, I hope, give up fairly young as well. My noble friend will recognise that my reference to the citizenship education that is part of the school curriculum did not apply to junior schoolchildren, only to those in secondary education.

§ Baroness Walmsley
My Lords, does the Minister agree that, if young people had the power to vote at the age of 16, they might not feel it necessary to protest on the streets?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, that is an interesting point, although the noble Baroness may have noticed that a fair number of adults have been protesting on the streets as well. They are of voting age, so the one does not exclude the other.

§ Lord Clarke of Hampstead
My Lords, has my noble friend heard of cases of school registers being marked with "W" for war or "D" for demonstration, instead of "A" for absence? Does he condone such things being done in the name of school governors and schoolmasters? Whatever the age of the pupils, they are absent, and their absence should not be condoned in such a way.

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, as I indicated, it is for the headmaster, in the first instance, and the school governing body to make a judgment about such things. The department is concerned with overall attendance figures and the performance of local education authorities in improving attendance and reducing truancy.

§ Lord Avebury
My Lords, what use will be made of the photographs, including photographs of children, that were taken at recent demonstrations?

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, as far as the schools are concerned, it is a matter of truancy. The schools will have the information that they need about whether a student has been in attendance. Schools 956 keep a register, and the teachers are responsible for the attendance of children at the school during school hours. The issue of photographs does not come into it.

§ Baroness Park of Monmouth
My Lords, does the Minister agree that lessons in citizenship might cover the point that it is not good citizenship for young creatures way below voting age to kick the police and spit at them? That is not a good beginning to their life as a citizen. I hope that that will be expressly mentioned, when schools tackle the question.

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, we would deplore such behaviour by young people in any circumstances. Although the Question has arisen because of anxieties about the unauthorised absence of children from school, most reports about the demonstrations have indicated a relatively low number of incidents of the kind to which the noble Baroness referred. In our debate yesterday, the noble Baroness, Lady Williams of Crosby, gave due testimony of the good relationships that obtained on the demonstration that occurred outside the House.

§ Lord Elton
My Lords, does the Minister accept that the concern is not so much about the truancy of children but about the possible condoning or assisting of that absence by staff? As an ex-teacher, I join the noble Lord, Lord Hardy of Wath, in saying that allowing it to happen is unprofessional conduct.

§ Lord Davies of Oldham
My Lords, I agree with that. Strong views are held about such issues, and teachers will play their part as citizens of a democratic society. However, the noble Lord is right: when they are in their position in school, they are professionals, and bias of any sort would be a negation of educational values.