Transport: Social Exclusion Unit Report (Hansard, 19 March 2003)

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Berkeley for the Question, although I hope that he agrees that it is a wildly unsuitable subject for simply a Starred Question. I want to tell the House about all the 37 policies in the Social Exclusion Unit report. All that I have time to say is that the Department for Transport will co-ordinate work on local transport plans to improve accessibility to work and local services. Other departments will contribute work on, among other matters, land use planning issues, school transport, access to healthcare, local food shops and safer streets, especially for the one in three households without a car.

Lord Berkeley
My Lords, I am not sure whether I thank my noble friend for that backhanded compliment, but I am grateful for what he said because I too think it a good report. Children from the lowest socio-economic groups are five times more likely than those from the highest groups to be killed on the roads. The report says that that is dealt with through local transport plans. As my right honourable friend the Deputy Prime Minister recently told the best performing local authorities that they did not need to produce local transport plans in future, how will this serious issue be dealt with by those lucky councils?

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
My Lords, local authorities will still have to tackle the problems that 238 the noble Lord rightly recognises. There are more deaths, particularly pedestrian deaths, including those among children, in deprived areas. It is difficult to tease out why that is the case. Part of the reason relates to local illegal activities, such as joyriding. In part it is because of had lighting. Part of it can be dealt with by closed circuit television cameras. Part of it is because transport services have not been planned adequately to go into deprived areas. That will have to be corrected. On top of the £1 billion a year we spend on local bus services, we shall have to ensure that extra money goes into those areas.

Lord Campbell of Croy
My Lords, will the Government take into account all the various categories of disabled people and their disabilities, which make ordinary transport very difficult for some disabled citizens? They should not be a reason for excluding those people.

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
Yes, my Lords, that is why the Social Exclusion Unit is so called. It is not simply about poor families—although it concerns them. It is about those who have disadvantages that make accessibility difficult for them. That includes the whole range of people with disabilities. A considerable part of the Social Exclusion Unit's report is devoted to that. I commend it to the noble Lord, Lord Campbell.

§ Baroness Whitaker
My Lords, can my nobly friend tell me what account is taken of the opinion of children themselves in making transport plans that are going to affect their safety?

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
My Lords, another significant amount of money—£900 million a year£is spent on specialist transport for schools, hospitals and social services. Again, it is necessary and possible to ensure that, in making plans, local authorities take particular account of people in need who are socially excluded. The noble Baroness, Lady Whitaker, is entirely right.

The Earl of Listowal
My Lords, is the Minister aware that Shelter, the national homelessness charity. estimates that there are 100,000 children homeless in this country? Is further aware that homeless families are often placed in accommodation away from their children's schools and away from their family, friends and community? How does the Government's strategy address their needs? Is consideration being given to reducing bus fares for that group, given the recent rises in those fares?

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
Yes indeed, my Lords. The homelessness directorate, which is concerned with people in bed-and-breakfast accommodation and with rough sleepers, is giving guidance to local authorities to seek to ensure that such families are placed as locally as possible, and certainly within the same borough. There are no legal powers to subsidise or provide concessionary travel for homeless people, but some experiments are being carried out. For example, Blackpool Borough 239 council is providing free school transport to ensure that those who have been housed away from their original school can go back to the same school. That is a good example for other parts of the country.

§ Baroness Scott of Needham Market
My Lords, the report makes clear that the link between land use planning and transport planning is essential if we are to combat social exclusion. In their forthcoming planning legislation, why do the Government propose to separate those powers for county councils? Is this an example of the joined-up thinking we hear so much about?

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
My Lords, the trend of land use for many years has been against people in positions of social exclusion. As car ownership has risen, there have been strong commercial pressures to move to, for example, larger and more remote shopping centres. We have to make strong efforts to ensure that local shops, particularly local food shops, are still available. Under no plans is there going to be any diminution of land use planning. There are differences in the responsibilities between different tiers of local government.

§ Viscount Simon
My Lords, will my noble friend expand slightly on the original question that my noble friend Lord Berkeley posed about the differences in the number of road deaths among different socioeconomic groups? Does not that highlight the problems of enforcement and of inappropriate speed limits, which could be reduced?

§ Lord McIntosh of Haringey
My Lords, I am sure that that is one of the issues that can be considered. It would certainly be a responsibility of the Department for Transport. Local authorities have considerable powers to reduce speed limits. Anyone who drives in London will have seen a great proliferation of 20 miles an-hour speed limits. I hope they are doing some good.