Iraq: Post-war Security and Reconstruction (Hansard, 8 July 2003)

§ Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean
My Lords, Her Majesty's Government had a wide range of discussions with United States interlocutors on contingency plans 134 for post-war security and reconstruction if the Iraqi regime failed to comply with United Nations Security Council Resolution 1441. At the Azores summit on 16th March, shortly before the conflict began, the Prime Minister and President Bush set out a vision for Iraq committing the coalition to work closely with inter alia the United Nations to ensure an appropriate post-conflict administration and to support the Iraqi people.

§ Baroness Williams of Crosby
My Lords, does the Minister recall that on 14th February Mr Donald Rumsfeld, the Defence Secretary, said: With Iraq … there has been time to prepare. We have set up a Post War Planning Office"? That was echoed by the Deputy National Security Adviser who said that there had been extensive discussion over months between the United States agencies about the post-war planning. Can the Minister tell the House whether the United Kingdom was fully consulted at all stages and whether it raised any objections for what in retrospect now looks like a very complacent set of assumptions about what would happen to Iraq once the conflict was over?

§ Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean
My Lords, the noble Baroness has mentioned what was said in America about United States planning. The Foreign Office, the MoD, DfID and indeed the DTI liaised extensively with each other and liaised also with United States counterparts in the State Department, the Pentagon, US Aid and other relevant United States authorities. From the outset it was very clear that coalition forces would be responsible for humanitarian assistance in the aftermath of any fighting and, of course, that UN authority would be needed for reconstruction.
The noble Baroness says that this has been characterised by complacency. I do not agree with that. There was a great deal of work to be done and there remains a great deal of work to be done. Two months after the end of decisive combat operations, I am bound to say that Iraq is already arguably better off than a number of post-conflict areas with which we have been associated in recent years.

§ Lord Hylton
My Lords, do the Government agree that the experience of Bosnia and Kosovo shows clearly that the first thing that needs to be restored is law and order and a system of justice? Can the noble Baroness tell the House what criminal and civil codes are now in force or in use in Iraq?

§ Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean
My Lords, to be honest I do not agree that it is solely law and order and civil justice that has to be restored. There are also the vital issues of food, of water, of electricity, of sustaining the basics of life itself. The noble Lord shakes his head, but I can assure him that, were those vital necessities not being delivered to the people of Iraq, I am absolutely certain that he would be one of the first to be on his feet making exactly that point to me. It is not a matter of just shaking his head, if I may 135 say so, because troops also have to be engaged in ensuring that those basic necessities of life are delivered.
As to what is happening on law and order and justice, policing is improving. There are now 33,000 Iraqi troops operating in Iraq; some 8,000 of those are in Baghdad; and there are also about 3,000 operating in Basra. The courthouses are starting to open: as I understand it, currently three in Baghdad and one in Basra. So the justice system is now starting to reassert itself.

§ Lord Judd
My Lords—

§ Lord Forsyth of Drumlean
My Lords—

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, there is time for both noble Lords to ask a question.

§ Lord Judd
My Lords, accepting the assurance of my noble friend that reconstruction is a matrix, as of course it is, nevertheless can she tell the House exactly what resources are being put into the redevelopment of the system of justice and of civil policing?

§ Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean
My Lords, I cannot quantify what is going in, in terms of money being spent. but I can tell your Lordships that the security situation is being controlled by coalition troops. The number of coalition patrols has increased and there are now around 2.500 patrols a day across Iraq, and I can tell my noble friend that 200 of those are jointly conducted with the Iraqi police. As of 24th June, Iraqi police were conducting their first patrols on their own, which is a major step in helping Iraqis to return to a self-policed environment. It is important that we are talking here not only about what the coalition is able to bring to security on the ground, but also increasingly about what Iraqi policemen are bringing to the security on the ground.

§ Lord Forsyth of Drumlean
My Lords, given that the Government fought the war because they believed that there were weapons of mass destruction that may fall into the hands of extremist groups through Saddam Hussein's regime, why are the Government so calm, and indeed almost complacent, about the failure to enforce law and order which has resulted in looting and in all kinds of materials possibly falling into the wrong hands? What are the Government doing to ensure that we are not at risk of that happening if they believe that there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq?

§ Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean
My Lords, if by the use of the word "calm" the noble Lord is trying to imply that the Government are complacent on this issue, I reject that entirely. I have just explained to your Lordships what is happening, with increased patrolling from coalition forces—some 2,500 patrols, as I have indicated, every day—and the increased provision for Iraqi policemen also to be involved.
136 Of course, the issue of finding weapons of mass destruction is very important, but I am bound to say to your Lordships that I think it has greater importance in the United Kingdom, perhaps in both Houses of Parliament and perhaps also in our press, than necessarily it does on the ground in Iraq. The majority of Iraqi people want to ensure that they are living in an environment where they can send their children to school, where they can be sure about their health, where they have secure policing and where they have access to food and water. I point your Lordships to the fact that yesterday, for example, there was the first meeting of the new Baghdad city council, a not unimportant issue. The noble Lord may shake his head and look exasperated. If the noble Lord does not believe that it is important that democracy is being established in the city of Baghdad then I beg to disagree with him.

§ Lord Hannay of Chiswick
My Lords—

§ Lord Alderdice
My Lords, the noble Baroness refers to the situation—

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I apologise to the noble Lords; we are well over time.