Sir William Stubbs (Hansard, 11 February 2003)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Education and Skills (Baroness Ashton of Upholland)
My Lords, the Department for Education and Skills has, without accepting liability, agreed to pay Sir William the sum of £95,000 representing a payment in respect of his lost earnings and his legal costs.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, if Sir William Stubbs was rightly dismissed, as is still claimed by the right honourable Estelle Morris, why should the taxpayer be asked to give him a £95,000 payoff? If he was wrongly dismissed, why did he not receive an apology, 564 and who was in fact to blame for the A-level fiasco that led to his publicly humiliating dismissal in the first place?

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, I have made it clear that the department does not accept liability. In his letter to Sir William, my right honourable friend wrote that he understood that the events of the autumn caused Sir William and his family considerable public humiliation and great distress. He also said in the letter that the circumstances that led to Sir William's departure were regrettable for all concerned, and caused hurt to all parties. In settling on the amount, Sir William has said that he is pleased that matters have been amicably resolved.

§ Baroness Sharp of Guildford
My Lords, as the Minister implies, there has been an attempt to put the lid on this particular episode from the summer. Before the Government put the lid on it, will she assure us that they have learned the lessons from the fiasco and that they are setting up a QCA that is genuinely independent from the meddling and micro-management that the Government like so much?

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, I do not accept what the noble Baroness said about meddling and micro-management, but I accept that there are lessons to be learned. We are acting on the recommendations made by Mike Tomlinson. For example, the QCA has produced simple and clear descriptions for AS and A-level standards. Exemplar materials are available, and key changes have been made to the code of practice. Of course, we have made £6 million available as well to help to deliver the 2003 exams securely, and to make sure that we have sufficient examiners.

§ Lord Waddington
My Lords, I am surely not the only one in the House who finds the noble Baroness's answers as clear as mud. If the Government accept no liability in the matter, how on earth can they justify paying £95,000 to this gentleman? Surely the very fact that the money has been paid is an admission by the Government that wrong was done to him.

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, I hope that I have made the matter clear. I apologise if the noble Lord thinks that I am being as clear as mud; perhaps it is a compliment, but I am not entirely sure. The settlement was jointly agreed between my right honourable friend the Secretary of State and Sir William Stubbs. Both are satisfied with its terms. I have made it clear where the £95,000 figure comes from, in that it is a combination of loss of earnings and legal costs. We believe that it is a satisfactory resolution to the matter.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, will the Minister clear up for all of us why Sir William was dismissed in the first place?

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, we have discussed the details of the matter in this House before. 565 My right honourable friend the former Secretary of State believed that the action was appropriate to take at the time. Subsequent to that, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State and Sir William have reached an agreement, and I am delighted that they have done so.

§ Lord Marsh
My Lords, will the Minister answer a simple question? What was the alternative to the agreement?

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, Sir William had lodged a legal action, as the noble Lord will know. The settlement has been agreed. As I have said, both parties are very satisfied with it, and I believe that it draws the line under the matter. I recommend that noble Lords look at the letter that my right honourable friend sent to Sir William.

§ Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville
My Lords, has the Minister shared with the House all the lessons that the department learned from the affair?

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, I have certainly tried to ensure that we share them when we have made statements on Mr Tomlinson's reports. As the process goes on this year, I will endeavour to do so whenever noble Lords ask me to.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords—

Noble Lords
Oh!

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, there is still time. Contrary to what the Minister said, she has never shared with the House the reasons why Sir William Stubbs was dismissed.

§ Baroness Ashton of Upholland
My Lords, I have tried to make them clear and to answer questions as clearly as possible on behalf of the department. We should be pleased that we have reached an amicable settlement. Again, I ask noble Lords to look at the letter sent by my right honourable friend to Sir William, to accept that Sir William is very satisfied with the results of the settlement, and that we can move on.