British Transport Police (Hansard, 16 May 2002)

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, the matter is being considered but the British Transport Police are already closely involved in activity to tackle street crime, working jointly with the various police forces. The Government intend further to enhance the role played by the British Transport Police, particularly in the London area which accounts for over 50 per cent of street crime across the 10 targeted areas and some 88 per cent of the incidents of robbery within the total British Transport Police jurisdiction.

§ Lord Bradshaw
My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. The British Transport Police apprehend many street robbers—I believe that they are about fifth or sixth in the relevant table—and the 10 forces have extra resources. Will the Minister say specifically whether the British Transport Police can also be given extra resources to fund either personnel or equipment to cover the many places around London stations where street robbers are active?

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, I cannot give details about any future money for the British Transport Police. The total strength of the force is just over 2,100. If one disregards the headquarters total, which is 100, that leaves just over 1,000 personnel in London. Half of the personnel of the British Transport Police work in London, 300 in both north and south London and 400 423 on the Underground. That is an enormous resource. They are involved in the work of the safer streets initiative in London in particular. I understand that exercises are taking place with regard to Connex special constables. Connex staff are being trained and accredited as special constables under the sponsorship of Connex although they are special constables for the British Transport Police. I understand that so far 130 employees have shown an interest in the scheme. It is planned to have 30 Specials sponsored by Connex. I understand that 16 commenced training on 15th April. Work is taking place to improve the "up front" appearance and presence of the British Transport Police, particularly in the London area.

Lord Berkeley
My Lords, does my noble friend accept that if half the British Transport Police are stationed in the London area, there are not many of them in other areas where an enormous amount of vandalism takes place? I refer to the North West, Yorkshire and Humberside and the North East. I assume that their remit covers Scotland. Is not the balance a little out of kilter?

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, not as regards where the crime takes place. My noble friend mentioned Scotland. Some 200 British Transport Police cover Scotland. That is some 10 per cent of the total. They operate also on the national rail networks, the Docklands Light Railway, the Croydon Tram Link and London Underground. They do not operate on the road network or in Northern Ireland. As I said in my initial Answer, the London area accounts for over 50 per cent of street crime across the 10 targeted areas of the street crime initiative and some 88 per cent of the incidents of robbery within the total British Transport Police jurisdiction. Therefore, the concentration of British Transport Police in London is justified.

§ Lord Dixon-Smith
My Lords, is the Minister aware that the Mayor of London is doing his best to enter into contractual arrangements with the Metropolitan Police to purchase in effect additional policemen specifically to cover bus services? Does the Minister consider that that represents a good vote of confidence in the existing arrangements given that it will obviously provide a welcome improvement in the situation?

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, the one way to make transport safer in London—and what the Metropolitan Police want to do—is to include in the Police Reform Bill the community safety officers accreditation scheme to enable the Metropolitan Police to appoint some 300 or 400 extra personnel on the streets of London this year, including a good proportion who will be supervised by London Transport. I hope that when the Bill returns to your Lordships' House in due course the scheme will receive the approval of noble Lords and that the Metropolitan Police will be able to introduce it.

§ Lord Wallace of Saltaire
My Lords, are the Government reconsidering the whole balance between 424 specialist forces and territorial forces within the police? Specialist forces represent some interesting historical anomalies—the origins of railway company police and so on. When considering legislation in this House, we have discussed the overlap between specialist forces and territorial forces. Is there a case for the Government looking at specialist forces— I forget exactly how many there are; I believe, eight or nine—and the territorial forces as a whole?

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, I shall have to take advice on that. I know of no moves in that regard. We debated specialist forces during the passage of the Anti-terrorism, Crime and Security Act, including the Ministry of Defence Police, the Atomic Energy Authority Constabulary—which is an armed police force with a specific remit—and the British Transport Police. I know of no discussions that would lead to the conclusions raised by the noble Lord.

§ Lord Faulkner of Worcester
My Lords, does the Minister agree that it does not make much difference to a victim of crime whether he is robbed on the Underground or in the street? Does he find it a little odd that the Home Office forces—10 of them—will be given substantial extra money to deal with robbery, which we all welcome, but that the British Transport Police, which saw a 29 per cent rise in robberies last year, are apparently having to struggle to get the modest £1.43 million for which they asked the Home Office?

§ Lord Rooker
My Lords, that would probably be a consequence of the spending review later on. Of the 2,700 robberies reported to the British Transport Police, 581 were cleared up. That involves a detection rate of 21 per cent. Their current budget is around £120 million. I stress that the British Transport Police are actively involved with the police around the country through the street crime initiative in Merseyside, Lancashire, Manchester, Thames Valley and the West Midlands where they are actively involved with what I call the Home Office police on a series of initiatives. They are currently doing that. There is not a question of their needing money to participate in such initiatives.