HL Deb 26 June 2002 vol 636 cc1349-52

2.39 p.m.

Lord Sheldon

asked Her Majesty's Government:

What steps they are taking to increase the proportion of students at university studying science and engineering.

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, the Government are working to promote science and engineering as study and career options through a variety of initiatives, including Science Year and Science and Engineering Ambassadors. We are also considering the recommendations of the recent report by Sir Gareth Roberts on the supply of science, engineering and technology skills.

Lord Sheldon

My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. As scientists and engineers do not enjoy the same position here as they do in so many other countries, is there not a particular problem in our universities? So long as great attention was paid to the quality of scientists and engineers in universities, there was always the hope that at least some of our preeminence might be retained for the future. That is now in serious doubt, and this matter must be examined at the highest level.

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, my noble friend raises important issues. I must say to him, however, that there are more young people in the UK with science and engineering degrees than in most OECD countries. It is important to recognise that, of the G8 nations, only France has more.

We know that there is a difference in the way in which young people are choosing to go forward into science. I fully recognise the noble Lord's concerns about the number of young people who are entering the sciences. Noble Lords will not be surprised to learn that we have seen a dramatic increase in the numbers of people choosing to study, for example, computer science. But in some subjects— engineering in particular and chemical engineering, an area about which I am particularly concerned—we have seen the number of students decrease. It is worth noting that between 1994–95 and 1999–2000 there was an increase of 13.9 per cent in the number of biologists.

Baroness Gardner of Parkes

My Lords, is the Minister aware of the work done by my noble friend Lady Platt of Writtle at WISE—Women in Science and Engineering? Is that initiative continuing, and are we seeing any growth in the number of women entering the field of science and engineering?

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, I cannot give precise figures for the number of women entering science and engineering. If I have that information, I shall be delighted to pass it on to the noble Baroness. We are funding a number of activities to support women in science and engineering, and we have asked the noble Baroness, Lady Greenfield, to look at how government can take an even stronger approach. As the noble Baroness, Lady Gardner, said, this is an important matter. Indeed, one of the planks of our Science Ambassadors programme is to ensure that we have good role models for our young people, particularly for young women who might be considering applying for a career in engineering, to enable them to see that it could be for them.

Baroness Sharp of Guildford

My Lords, does the Minister agree that mathematics is the key to studying science and engineering at university? Is she aware of the worries among, for example, the London Mathematical Society about the drop-off in the numbers taking A-level mathematics as a result of the introduction of Curriculum 2000?

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, as I understand it, the number of people entering university to study mathematics has increased by 3.3 per cent. The purpose behind Curriculum 2000 and other initiatives is to enable young people to have a range of opportunities to study maths; for example, AS qualifications in maths or further maths and the free-standing maths units; and from September 2001 young people will have the opportunity to study for a new qualification known as "AS use of mathematics"—from which I might have benefited had I been the right age at the right time. I take nothing away from the noble Baroness's question. It is important to ensure that we have mathematicians coming through the system—hence the efforts that we are putting in to ensure that people continue to study mathematics and, of course, become mathematics teachers.

Lord Taylor of Blackburn

My Lords, what steps is my noble friend taking to work with the Engineering Council and the various institutes to further the need for young people to go into engineering?

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, the Engineering Council and others have been involved with us. The Association for Science Education and the Royal Society have also been working closely with us, particularly on the Science and Engineering Ambassadors programme, which is designed to ensure that young people have the opportunity to meet others who have gone into science and engineering and, as importantly, to understand the relevance of science for many different careers. We have produced videos that show young people the use of science in everything from designing new films for television or the big screen right the way through to the manufacture of beauty products, in which science is key to ensuring that we can provide women in particular with some important products.

Baroness Perry of Southwark

My Lords, does the noble Baroness agree that one of the biggest problems is the lack of inspirational science teaching in schools? How do the Government intend to get more specialist teachers who can inspire young people to be excited about science and engineering?

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, we have a manifesto commitment to introduce a national centre for excellence in science teaching. We consulted on the idea earlier this year. As the noble Baroness will be aware, everything depends on the outcome of the spending review. We are looking to negotiate with a number of potential sponsors to work with us. We have some truly inspirational science teachers, but I recognise that we need to do more to enhance the quality, knowledge, skills, curriculum and resources available to help our science teachers to talk with young people, particularly about some of the science issues that are currently on people's minds. We hope that the national centre will be a key tool in enabling that.

Baroness Lockwood

My Lords, as part of their widening access programme, do the Government have any plans to include special programmes to attract young women from areas where there is no tradition of attending university? There is a tremendous amount of talent to be tapped among women and men, but special activities will be needed to bring women into that important area.

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, I agree with my noble friend that it is very important to ensure that the access programme attracts young women into science. However, the issue begins even earlier. We need to look at the strategy in key stages 2 and 3. That is under way. It is important to produce a framework for teaching science that supports learning and teaching for all our pupils and, as I said earlier, ensures that young women in particular have the opportunities to be able to consider science and engineering as real options for their careers.

Lord Roberts of Conwy

My Lords, it is pleasing to hear of Britain's pre-eminence in science and engineering in Europe, but what is the comparison with Japan and the United States?

Baroness Ashton of Upholland

My Lords, I do not have those comparisons. I have only the information about our standing within the G7 nations. It is important to recognise that Britain has a strong position in science and engineering across the globe. I am sure that every noble Lord wants to ensure that that continues in the best possible way. It is why we developed this year as Science Year: to enable all our young people across education to recognise the relevance and importance of science. The associations with which we have been working are very concerned to ensure that we have graduates coming through who can be our scientists of the future, particularly in some of the areas that I mentioned earlier, such as chemical engineering. We are beginning to be concerned that young people consider those subjects and understand what careers chemical and other engineering professions can offer them.