Nurses: Recruitment (Hansard, 1 November 2000)

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, the Department of Health is improving recruitment and retention by encouraging the National Health Service in England to become a better employer, increasing training places, attracting former staff back to the NHS, encouraging flexible retirement and supporting more effective collaborative international recruitment.

§ Lord Islwyn
My Lords, will the Minister confirm that nursing is the most understaffed profession in the National Health Service and that a large percentage of student nurses drop out of their training courses? Is this not essentially still a legacy from 18 years of 942 Conservative government? Is the Minister not sad to see trusts up and down the country applying to the Philippines, to India, to South Africa and even to China for their recruits? I noticed that my own NHS trust in Gwent has been trying to attract recruits from Finland. Surely that cannot be right. What is needed is a radical reappraisal of nurses' pay and conditions, because nurses certainly deserve better.

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, my noble friend has raised a number of interesting questions. I do not doubt for a moment that the impact of the internal market and the decision of the previous government to stage a number of recommendations from the nurses' pay review body led to demoralisation among nursing staff, alongside reductions in the number of training places. We are now turning this round. We have increased the number of training places. Through our recruitment campaign, we have attracted more qualified nurses back into the health service. Today, 10,000 more nurses are working in the health service than was the case two years ago.
As regards international recruitment, it is clear that we need to recruit more nurses. We have traditionally recruited internationally, provided that that does not have an adverse impact on health service provision in the home countries. I believe that it is entirely justifiable. Indeed, international recruits play an extremely important part in the provision of services by the NHS.

§ Lord Rotherwick
My Lords, does the Minister agree that it is not correct to seek to benefit our national health system by recruiting nurses from countries such as the Philippines, which has been done over recent years? Surely it is wrong that such countries should be denied the benefit of using their own highly skilled nurses, who have been trained using only the scarce resources that are usually available?

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, I agree with the general proposition that recruiting from countries overseas would not be advisable if that action would have a detrimental effect on the home healthcare systems of those countries. That is why, in November last year, the Government published guidance to the NHS which stressed that, while international recruitment should be valued for its contribution to this country's health services, it is a viable proposition only when, first, its benefit to an individual NHS organisation can be demonstrated and, secondly, such recruitment into the NHS will not have a negative impact on the home country's healthcare system. I am confident that NHS organisations are recruiting internationally according to those guidelines.

§ Lord Taylor of Blackburn
My Lords, perhaps I may congratulate my noble friend on the campaign 943 launched to attract qualified nurses back into the profession. However, I should tell him about one difficulty that has arisen—

Noble Lords
Question!

§ Lord Taylor of Blackburn
My Lords, is the Minister aware that, even when experienced people do decide to return to the service, they are often placed at the lower end of their grading for pay? That is the case even for those with great experience. Does the Minister agree that this does not serve to encourage experienced staff to apply for posts?

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, my noble friend usually tells me what he wants me to know. I agree that it is important that experienced nurses who are attracted back into the National Health Service after having moved away from their careers for some time should be given every support and encouragement. As regards the issue of grading, of course such matters must be left to be decided by each individual NHS trust. However, I agree with my noble friend that, when reaching such decisions, it is important to take into account the valuable past experience of nurses who have been away from the profession for some time.

§ Baroness Northover
My Lords, does the Minister agree that, while the recruitment of nurses is clearly urgent, of much greater concern is the retention of staff? Does he further agree that if he were to tackle low morale, inflexible working arrangements and low pay more effectively, that would help to solve the recruitment problem?

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, I certainly agree that the retention of nurses is very important. In regard to pay, our decision to accept without question the recommendations of the pay review body has been a considerable improvement on previous practice. I also agree that introducing more flexible working practices is a way of encouraging more nurses to stay in the National Health Service. There are now many examples where NHS trusts have recognised the need for better HR strategies and improved support. This is paying dividends. We are seeing more nurses coming back into and staying in the service. We have to redouble our efforts, but I am convinced that we shall achieve the 20,000 extra nurses we require in accordance with the targets set in the NHS plan.

Lord Acton
My Lords, can my noble friend give an indication of how many nurses have been attracted back by this campaign?

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, as I said, we have 10,000 more nurses working in the health service now as compared with two years ago. In relation to the specific campaigns, 3,000 nurses returned last year; nearly 2,500 have returned since March; and another 2,200 nurses are preparing to return to the health service. We are running another campaign in certain 944 areas of the country this autumn; we shall run further campaigns in the future. We are very anxious that former nurses will consider the NHS as a place in which to work again in the future.

§ Baroness Whitaker
My Lords—

Noble Lords
Next Question!

§ Baroness Whitaker
My Lords, does my noble friend agree—

§ The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Jay of Paddington)
My Lords, we have reached 16 minutes. I hope that my noble friend will understand if we move on.