Asylum Seekers (Hansard, 22 March 2000)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Office (Lord Bassam of Brighton)
My Lords, I understand that the decision by Glasgow City Council to return the asylum seekers was taken on the grounds that some of them should not have been sent from London as they were required, as a condition of their temporary admission to the United Kingdom, to report on a regular basis to a London office of the Immigration Service. The incident in Glasgow was regrettable but does not affect the Government's plans to disperse asylum seekers under the national asylum support scheme.

§ Lord Bellwin
My Lords, I thank the Minister for that Answer. Does he not agree that this whole complex and difficult situation is compounded by the fact that last year, while tens of thousands of applications were rejected, only 7,000 people were sent back? Where are the others and who is accommodating them?

§ Lord Bassam of Brighton
My Lords, the noble Lord makes reference to a subject which I know exercises many of your Lordships and certainly exercises the 273 Government. The number of removals last year was a record 7,650. That fact is widely known. As to speculating where other asylum seekers may be located, we have good and accurate records but it is undoubtedly the case that there are some who have disappeared within the system. That much is commonly known too. It is extremely difficult to estimate precisely how many of those seeking asylum have disappeared but the Government have been and are determined to keep abreast of this problem. We inherited a system which was not—

Noble Lords
Oh!

§ Lord Bassam of Brighton
My Lords, I know that Members of your Lordships' House have perhaps taken against the way we are conducting ourselves. But the simple fact is that we inherited a system which was a shambles. We are still working that system. We have tried to tackle it and to get on top of it. We have introduced legislation which will be effective in getting to grips with the problem. I should have expected Members opposite to support the firm, tough action that the Government are taking.

§ Lord Dholakia
My Lords, will the Minister accept that xenophobic attitudes towards asylum seekers now prevail and that there is a need to arrest such attitudes? Will he further accept that politicians could give a lead? Most asylum seekers are not beggars. They are law-abiding people. Will the Minister accept that one of their greatest difficulties is that they cannot work in this country? Will he review that position to ensure that those asylum seekers who are in this country for three months or longer are able to work to earn some kind of living, rather than having to live without adequate means?

§ Lord Bassam of Brighton
My Lords, the Government believe that we must deal with and treat asylum applicants with humanity and decency. That much is clear. We had a useful debate in your Lordships' House on precisely that issue only a few weeks ago. As to whether those seeking asylum should be able to work, that is a matter which all governments need to keep under constant review. We do not wish to develop a dependency culture in this country, but we must he fair. We must be tough in the way we exercise our immigration and asylum powers and controls, but we must be firm and stand steadfast against prejudice and bigotry in the system.

§ Lord Taylor of Gryfe
My Lords, is the Minister aware that those of us who live in Scotland were ashamed by the spectacle of the refugees being returned on a 400-mile bus journey to London after only a few days in Glasgow? It was entirely due to a lack of communication and understanding on the part of both local authorities in Glasgow and London. Can I have some assurance that there will be no further instances of bureaucratic cock-up in respect of these 274 poor people, many of whom were carrying young children? It has caused great misery to those unfortunate refugees.

§ Lord Bassam of Brighton
My Lords, the arrangements to which my noble friend refers were voluntary dispersal arrangements. They were not put in place by Her Majesty's Government. They were made between Glasgow and the London consortium of authorities, principally, in this case, the London Borough of Wandsworth. It was highly unfortunate and regrettable in the extreme that there was a lack of, or breakdown in, communication. The circumstances surrounding the decision of council officials in Glasgow to return the asylum seekers to London are, in a sense, understandable, but such situations must not prevail in the future. I am confident that the arrangements we are putting in place for the statutory dispersal scheme will ensure that such a breakdown in communication—a failure, in this instance—does not occur in the future. The situation did not result from government action; it arose between two local authorities as part of the current voluntary arrangements. On that point, I believe that we should leave the matter.

§ Lord Cope of Berkeley
My Lords, does not the Minister realise that the incident in Glasgow is merely one illustration of the chaos of the dispersal policy as a whole? It is part of the wider chaos of the Government's asylum policy. Will the Minister confirm that in December the Home Office expected by now to need 10,000 units of accommodation for that policy but that up to last month it had acquired fewer than 1,500 units; and that 1,000 of those involved have refused accommodation and have withdrawn themselves from support? Those were the figures last month. Does the Minister have any that are more recent?

§ Lord Bassam of Brighton
My Lords, I cannot today provide new information to the noble Lord, but when it is available, I shall, of course, do so. The noble Lord says that the system is chaotic. I cannot agree. The Government have put in place a system of statutory dispersal which will take effect from 3rd April. It is in all of our interests to give support to that system so that we can increasingly bring order to the chaos the Government inherited—a situation we intend to put right. We are working a system we inherited. We are putting measures in place to tackle the problem. It would be in all our interests if the House supported the Government in taking firm and effective action.