HL Deb 12 June 2000 vol 613 cc1365-8

2.44 p.m.

Lord Elliott of Morpeth

asked Her Majesty's Government:

What steps they plan to take to persuade other European Union member states rigorously to enforce in their territory the provisions of Council Directive 91/628/EEC on the protection of animals during transport, in respect of lambs and sheep which are being transported from the United Kingdom to or through other member states.

The Minister of State, Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Baroness Hayman)

My Lords, the European Commission is responsible for ensuring that EU legislation on animal welfare and transport is fully implemented and properly enforced by all EU member states. High animal welfare standards are important to the Government. We continue to press the Commission to take action to ensure that it meets its obligations in this respect. We shall also take an active role in EU and other institutions to encourage best welfare practice and discuss our concerns with individual EU member states whenever it is necessary to do so.

Lord Elliott of Morpeth

My Lords, I am grateful for that reply. However, does the Minister recall—I am sure she must—that when the directive that we are considering was introduced in 1995 all member states in the European Union welcomed it because it suggested that at long last there would be some ease in the suffering of animals having to undergo long journeys on their way to slaughter in various parts of Europe? Is the noble Baroness aware that the responsible body, Compassion in World Farming, has recently conducted an investigation over 18 months and has proved beyond any question that most European countries ignore this regulation, and that in consequence suffering has greatly increased? The noble Baroness rightly mentioned the European Commission. I believe that it is due to review this regulation. Will the noble Baroness please ensure that when the Commission's report comes before the European Agriculture Committee, the UK will use its strongest endeavour to seek a fundamental change from transportation of live animals to trade in meat?

Baroness Hayman

My Lords, I am aware of the issues that the noble Lord raises. Certainly the Government would prefer to see a trade in meat rather than live animals. As the noble Lord said, the Commission has started work on a review of the directive. We intend to press our view as regards the preferability of the carcass trade over the export of live animals. My right honourable friend the Minister wrote to Commissioner Byrne in February restating our deep concern about the failure of other member states to enforce the law as it is at present. The Commission is looking hard at ways of improving enforcement. It has initiated a series of working groups in which we have been able to stress the importance that we attach to improvements in the area. One of the groups is due to meet this week. We shall continue to emphasise the issues that the noble Lord rightly highlights.

Baroness Mallalieu

My Lords, the noble Baroness has said again that the Government are anxious to encourage carcass trade as opposed to live exports. The Government have called for that since the election and indeed well before it. Yet the Government's charging policy for inspectors of small abattoirs has the effect of closing down local abattoirs and causes animals to have to travel further, both in this country and overseas. What have the Government done during their time in office to bring about some improvement and some increase in the carcass trade?

Baroness Hayman

My Lords, as my noble friend will be aware, the review of charging policy for abattoirs is being undertaken at the moment by the Food Standards Agency. Earlier I outlined the view that we have tried to promulgate within Europe about the preferability of carcass trade. As regards trying to ensure that carcass trade is supported within this country, last week in your Lordships' House I answered a Starred Question about what we are doing to try to facilitate the export of whole unsplit carcasses to France—because that is what the market prefers—for cutting in that country. That is exactly the kind of measure which will support a carcass trade rather than any other.

Lord Monro of Langholm

My Lords, many farmers will feel that the Minister has not gone anything like far enough in her response today. They rightly feel that the farming industry in this country is penalised because farmers on the Continent can do whatever they like and no one seems to enforce any of the regulations. Can the noble Baroness say how many prosecutions—successful or otherwise—have been brought on the Continent since the regulations were introduced in 1995?

Baroness Hayman

My Lords, I am afraid that I do not have those figures with me. I certainly undertake to try to find them and to write to the noble Lord. But I outlined the work that we have done in terms of raising this issue with Commissioner Byrne. I can tell the noble Lord that the Swedish agriculture minister has now echoed our concern by requesting a debate at the June Agriculture Council on what should be done about the widespread non-observance of the welfare-in-transit rules. We shall be supporting that Swedish initiative. Equally, the action plan on farming pointed out our recognition that we needed to do more on this issue—not only in the EU but in an international context—and that we shall look at what we can do to support those with high animal welfare standards. I do not accept the charge that we have not acted in this area.

Lord Clinton-Davis

My Lords, when will the Commission complete its work in relation to the working parties that have been established? Does the Minister agree that it is not good enough that the Commission should buy time in order to deal with this urgent matter and that there is an important requirement on the Commission to produce a definitive result?

Baroness Hayman

My Lords, I agree with my noble friend. That is why we are pleased that three meetings of the working groups have taken place already—there will be another one this week—to improve enforcement in this area. Equally, it is important that a review of the directive overall is undertaken. The Commission has now been stirred into taking that action. We have had a positive response to my right honourable friend's letter from Commissioner Byrne and we hope to see action taken soon. The commissioner made it clear that he, too, is unhappy with the current position as a reflection of the importance that animal welfare issues should be accorded within the EU.

Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer

My Lords, although, of course, we should be pressing the EU to make reforms, is it the case that the Government have not commissioned any study into transport issues in this country since the closure of so many abattoirs? Will the Minister consider initiating a study into animal welfare in this country before we teach our overseas friends about them?

Baroness Hayman

My Lords, I am not sure that we need to commission a study. When the review of abattoirs for the over-30 months scheme was undertaken, the issues of the effect on journey times and the importance of enforcing the strict regulations on journey times that we have in this country were considered. We have regulations in this country and we ensure that they are complied with.

Noble Lords

Next question.

The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Jay of Paddington)

My Lords, we have now reached 17 minutes which, as the House knows, really means 18 minutes. I am sure that there is as much interest in prisons and pigeons, which I believe are the subjects of the next two Questions.