§ 3.23 p.m.
§ Lord Wallace of Saltaire asked Her Majesty's Government:
§ Whether they consider that upgrading early warning radar sites in the United Kingdom to support the proposed United States nuclear missile defence system would break the 19'72 Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty.
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, the United States recognises that changes to the terms of the ABM Treaty would be required to enable it to deploy the sort of national missile defence system currently envisaged without breaching that treaty. That is why it is seeking to negotiate such changes with Russia. The Foreign Office and the Ministry of Defence recently submitted a memorandum on the subject to the House of Commons Foreign Affairs Committee, which has now put it in the public domain via the Internet. I shall therefore now be able to place a copy in the Library of the House.
§ Lord Wallace of SaltaireMy Lords, I thank the Minister for that encouraging reply. Does she recognise that at the present stage of debate in the United States, where people are much less determined to go ahead than they were some months ago, the views of America's allies will carry great weight? Will she assure us that Her Majesty's Government intend making their views known about a system that will require British co-operation if it is to go into service as designed?
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, I assure the noble Lord and the House that our views on NMD have been conveyed clearly to the United States in bilateral exchanges and in discussions in NATO on many occasions. The debate involves important security concerns on all sides. We believe that they need to be considered and addressed seriously. Russia has now acknowledged that there is a growing threat from the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and long-range missiles and that that threat must be addressed. It is essential that the issue is taken forward on the basis of dialogue and negotiation. Public confrontation will hinder, not help, the search for an agreed way forward.
§ Lord Archer of SandwellMy Lords, safety from nuclear missiles is indivisible. Either the whole world is safe or no one is safe. If Russia is goaded into 371 abandoning her arms control programme, it will make America a more dangerous place in which to live, not a safer one.
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, it is in nobody's interests nor is it anyone's intention to goad Russia into anything of the sort. That is why the Americans are engaged in ongoing negotiations with the Russians, with our full support and encouragement, to try to find a way forward.
§ Lord Howell of GuildfordMy Lords, does the Minister accept that, despite the failure of the booster rocket in the test at the weekend, if these exoatmospheric killer vehicles can be made to work, they will help to reinforce world safety by reducing people's readiness to resort to nuclear weapons? Will she reassure us that the British Government take a rather more positive view of the issue than, for example, the French Government? As the decision has to be made in two weeks in Washington on whether the programme will go ahead under the current President and as British participation is necessary for that decision, because of the high-resolution radar at Fylingdales and the infra-red tracking facility at Menwith Hill, will she reassure us that the British Government are also ready to take the necessary decision in the next few weeks? Will she ensure that we are fully informed when the Government take that decision?
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, I assure the noble Lord that the House will be fully informed if any such decisions are taken. However, I caution against believing the reports, which I have also read, that decisions are about to be taken in the next week or two. I think that our information is accurate. Our understanding is that no decision on NMD will be taken in the United States until towards the end of this year. Many noble Lords will have seen the article in last Sunday's Observer stating that a decision would be taken at a meeting on Tuesday. That is not the case. There are many meetings taking place, as one would expect. The United States' decision on whether to proceed with NMD deployment will be taken by the President alone. I repeat that we do not expect any decision from him until later this year at the earliest.
§ Baroness Williams of CrosbyMy Lords—
§ Lord CarverMy Lords—
§ The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Jay of Paddington)My Lords, I think that we probably have time for two more questions. I believe that the House is inviting a contribution from the Cross Benches.
§ Lord CarverMy Lords, after the failure of the second trial the other day, will the Government try to persuade the United States Government to abandon this irrelevant project and switch their efforts to 372 theatre missile defence, which would not be in breach of the ABM treaty and would be much more relevant to the needs of NATO?
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, no doubt the outcome of the latest test will have a bearing on the United States' assessment as regards the decision to be made on the technological feasibility of proceeding to deploy an NMD system at this point. But plainly, as the noble and gallant Lord will understand better than most, one cannot judge the feasibility of such a complex system on the basis of one test. Many more tests have always been planned before any NMD system becomes operational.
Judgments on the technical progress of the programme are for the United States to make. In the meantime, as I said, we continue to discuss the wider issues raised by missile defence with the US Administration, both bilaterally and in NATO.
§ Baroness Williams of CrosbyMy Lords, may we take it from what the Minister said that she will now encourage much wider public debate, which has not so far taken place to any great extent in this country, especially given our very powerful negotiating position here? Does she agree that there is a real danger that the opening up of a much more extensive system of disarmament, with the full support of both Russia and China, depends largely on how this issue is handled over the next few months?
§ Baroness Ramsay of CartvaleMy Lords, yes. I can only repeat some of my earlier remarks. We are using every diplomatic means to make known our views to our allies and to those who are not always necessarily our allies on this issue. It is of vital importance to the whole world that we find a proper way forward.