Chechnya (Hansard, 27 October 1999)

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, Her Majesty's Government are deeply concerned about the situation, and the reported civilian casualties. If the Russians enter Grozny, they risk increasing the human suffering and getting dragged into a military quagmire. Russia has the right to fight terrorism, but its response must be directed solely at those responsible. The Prime Minister has expressed our concern to Prime Minister Putin, a message repeated by Finnish Prime Minister Lipponen at the EU/Russian summit.

§ Lord Ahmed
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for her reply. Is she aware that there is great concern about refugees? What are Her Majesty's Government doing to alleviate their suffering?

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, we are aware of, and are concerned about, the plight of refugees. Many of those refugees—about 150,000 of them—are crossing the border. Her Majesty's Government have plans to route any assistance through the UN High Commissioner for Refugees or the Red Cross. What the EU gives depends on need, but 1.2 million euros of EU money is available. We have successfully lobbied the Russians to allow an international needs assessment mission to go to the region to look at the requirements.

§ Baroness Williams of Crosby
My Lords, does the Minister agree that to describe a whole region as terrorist is perhaps a rather dangerous definition to enter into? Given how much the Russians weigh their membership of the Council of Europe—it is something they hold very precious—will Her Majesty's Government consider raising this matter with the Council of Europe through the Assembly in order to warn the Russians that their actions, if they involve large-scale deaths of civilians in Grozny, would conflict with then commitment to the European Convention on Human Rights, to which they are now of course a party?

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, I agree with the noble Baroness that it is quite improper to suggest that all Chechens are terrorists. Furthermore, Her Majesty's Government will give full and proper consideration to the noble Baroness's very pertinent point.

§ Lord Moynihan
My Lords, can the Minister say whether the Government, together with our European Union and NATO partners, have received any requests from Chechen leaders—for this is fast becoming a major refugee crisis—either to mediate or to intervene in the current conflict in Chechnya? Can 302 she say against which criteria the Government would weigh such a request in view of NATO's intervention in Kosovo on humanitarian grounds?

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, we have received no such request. At this stage perhaps I may respectfully suggest that it would be proper for us to await such a request before speculating on the basis on which we would respond.

§ Lord Hylton
My Lords, does the Minister agree that the indiscriminate use of force by the Russians is in the long run likely to be self-defeating because it will fuel Islamic extremism and put at risk the Russian minorities in central Asia?

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, the noble Lord is, of course, right. We have made very strong representations to the Russians that any response made by them should be proportionate and that they should direct their attention at those who are responsible for the incursions and not at others. They should also be very much aware of the civilian casualties that may flow from any such response. We have also made it plain that a military response will never adequately address the issues that are alive and present in this dispute and that that is not an appropriate way forward.

§ Lord Rea
My Lords, can my noble friend assist me with a case that has come to my notice? Chechen President Maskhadov's representative in Moscow, whose name is Maïerbek Vatchagaer, has been arrested on what appears to be planted evidence. Can our embassy be asked to follow up this case to ensure his safety and a fair trial? I declare an interest in the case because this man ensured my safety and provided generous hospitality during a rather perilous visit that I made to Chechnya four years ago.

§ Baroness Scotland of Asthal
My Lords, we are aware that the President's envoy has been arrested. The allegation, as far as we have been notified, is that he had an unlicensed firearm. We do not know the precise facts of the matter and we shall continue to monitor the situation.