Prison Population: Expenditure (Hansard, 20 July 1998)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Office (Lord Williams of Mostyn)
My Lords, planned current expenditure in 1998–99, including the additional funds which my right honourable friend the Home Secretary announced in February, is forecast to be £23,933 per prisoner at today's prices, on current population projections. That compares with £25,752 in 1995–96. Converted to real terms, at 1992–93 prices, the figures are £20,494 in 1998–99 and £23,987 in 1995–96.

§ The Earl of Longford
My Lords, I understand that an important Statement is to be made tomorrow. In advance of that I can only say that, if some increase is projected, everyone who cares about the rehabilitation of prisoners will sing a song of joy for the sinner who repenteth. When this all-important Statement is made tomorrow will there be some repudiation of the Government's policy of cutting the Prison Service, including the education and probation services? At a time when the prison population is increasing greatly will that policy be totally repudiated?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, my noble friend is correct that it would not be proper for me to attempt to anticipate anything that is to be announced by my right honourable friend Mr. Straw within the next few days. We are looking to improvements; for instance, we shall be looking to increase the hours per week spent in purposeful activity from 22.5 to 24. Targets have been set. Plainly, the situation is not satisfactory at present. The noble Lord is also correct in that on Friday, 17th July, we saw our highest ever prison population, standing at 66,102.

§ Lord Quirk
My Lords, does the Minister agree with Sir David Ramsbotham in his latest annual report on the vital importance of education for the prison population if we are to have any hope of rehabilitating prisoners? Does he further agree that, in view of the very welcome £19 billion extra money for education announced last week and given the desperately low levels of education among prisoners—two-thirds are sub-literate and sub-numerate—it would be nice if a due proportion of the new money could be ring-fenced for education in the prison population?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, again, perhaps I should not anticipate the precise terms of what may be stated. I entirely agree with the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Quirk, that low levels of education lead to low levels of self-esteem and therefore low levels of opportunity or prospect of work on release. It is not simply academic education at which we need to look; we need to look at, for instance, the useful pilot scheme on welfare to work, which properly lays stress on 579 employment opportunities on release rather than simply the acquisition of academic qualifications which may be inappropriate for some prisoners.

§ Lord Dholakia
My Lords, does the Minister agree that non-custodial alternatives are better forms of sentencing disposal? Does he also agree that we remand too many people in custody; that mentally ill offenders should not be in prison; and that there are better ways of dealing with people for non-payment of fines than sentencing them to a term in custody? Are not those the categories of people that should be seriously looked at so that, to an extent, we can reduce the extremely high prison population?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I gave the precise figures of the prison population, as I always do on these occasions, despite the fact that they make gloomy reading. Undoubtedly, non-custodial alternatives are extremely important provided that they are constructive and have public support. Public confidence in the judicial system is absolutely vital. It is commonplace to observe that there are too many people in prison. Sometimes the difficulty is in knowing which people in prison ought not to be there, which is a serious and fundamental question.

§ Baroness Anelay of St Johns
My Lords, will the Minister confirm the evidence in the latest Prison Service business plan that, in terms of running costs, privately-managed prisons are up to 15 per cent. cheaper to run than those in the public sector—to the same standards, of course? What plans have the Government to develop private sector-run prisons, or do they intend to stand by the Home Secretary's promise made to prison staff before the general election that privately-managed prisons will be taken back into the Prison Service as soon as contractually possible?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, undoubtedly, in some circumstances, privately managed prisons may offer a cheaper regime. It is not a perfect equation because, for instance, one wants to look at the higher cost of high security prisons which will, in the nature of things, be extremely expensive to run. Two DCMF competitions were launched in 1997–98; the first is at Agecroft and the second at Pucklechurch. Both prisons are planned to open in 1999. The second competition is for two 600-place prisons, one at Marchington in Staffordshire and one at Onley near Rugby. Those prisons are planned to open in the year 2000.

§ Lord Hunt of Kings Heath
My Lords, does my noble friend agree that one call on any extra resources for the Prison Service would be funding the transfer of the prison medical service to the National Health Service, thereby improving the standard of medical care?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, that alternative has certainly been put forward in your Lordships' House on a number of prior occasions. There is some virtue in it. Equally, some well-informed minds 580 have the view that a global national health provision in the particular circumstances of the prison estate will not always be appropriate.