HL Deb 08 April 1998 vol 588 cc750-1

2.46 p.m.

Baroness Linklater of Butterstone

asked Her Majesty's Government:

What is their policy on the closure of rural schools in Scotland.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Scottish Office (Lord Sewel)

My Lords, my honourable friend the Minister for Education has recently set out our view that no rural schools should be closed on financial grounds alone and that there must be a credible educational justification for closure. We have invited authorities to apply a test of proportionate advantage to any proposed closure of a rural primary school, demonstrating when the educational and financial gains outweigh any negative effects on the community,

Baroness Linklater of Butterstone

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that interesting and quite helpful Answer. I am aware of the statement made by the Minister for Education on 21st March. Can the noble Lord confirm that there is a presumption against the closure of rural schools in Scotland? Can he say whether, when considerations other than financial ones prevail and a rural school under threat is kept open, financial resources must be made available by the local authority, which must make savings elsewhere, or whether the Government will make available additional resources?

Lord Sewel

My Lords, the additional cost of provision in rural areas is recognised by the annual grant settlement for local authorities. It is for the local authorities to strike a balance in how the money available to them should be spent. That is their responsibility and their duty. The policy in Scotland is that when the closure of a primary school means the transfer to a school more than five miles away the closure is referred to the Secretary of State for Scotland.

Lord Palmer

My Lords, if and when schools must be closed, what is the Government's policy with regard to redundant schools? Our local school in the Scottish Borders was closed in 1964 and is still empty and unused.

Lord Sewel

My Lords, I am well aware that in many cases local schools after closure have been turned into major resources for the local community, providing, for instance, community facilities or small workshops and opportunities for local enterprise.

Lord Mackay of Ardbrecknish

My Lords, is the Minister aware that I agree with him that local authorities have a difficult task in balancing the financial and educational aspects of falling school rolls? Does he agree that it is essential that local authorities are allowed to get on with the job of removing from the system the huge overhang of empty school places? Does he further agree that we should indicate to the Liberal Democrat Party, which believes in devolution, that these matters ought to be left to local authorities?

Lord Sewel

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for his observation. Not only do I believe that the Liberal Democrat Party believes in devolution: it believes also in a strong and effective system of local government and local decision-making. I take the point which the noble Lord makes about the overhang of excess capacity. There are indeed quite proper savings which can be made and we are encouraging local authorities, in the appropriate circumstances, where the balance of argument is clearly in favour of closure and reorganisation, to adopt such policies.

Lord Pearson of Rannoch

My Lords, following the answer which the Minister gave to the noble Lord, Lord Palmer, is he aware that there are in fact many primary schools in Scotland—my own local primary school is, I am afraid, an example—which were closed many years ago and have not been put to any of the good uses which the Minister suggests?

Lord Sewel

My Lords, I suggest that the noble Lord perhaps has conversations with local representatives to see whether a proper and appropriate use can be found for such buildings.