Closed Circuit Television Systems (Hansard, 23 June 1997)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Office (Lord Williams of Mostyn)
My Lords, most public space closed circuit television (CCTV) systems are already regulated by codes of practice which cover the storage and publication of images, as are all systems which receive financial assistance from the Home Office. We wish to encourage best practice and will be prepared to consider the arguments on the principle and practicalities of statutory regulation of CCTV to underpin the existing codes of practice.

§ Lord Archer of Sandwell
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that general endorsement. Has he had an opportunity to read the accounts which I sent him of Mr. Peck, whose suicide attempt was, by chance, captured on security camera, who then discovered that the whole sequence had been released to the news media, that it appeared on local television, and it was then broadcast on the BBC's "Crimebeat"? Was not that heartless and irresponsible? Does it not justify the call by Liberty for protection for innocent people who appear on security cameras?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I am aware of the case to which my noble and learned friend referred. I am most grateful to him for his courtesy in informing me of the general background. The Government deprecate any use of CCTV for purposes of public entertainment. I cannot comment in any detail on the case of Mr. Peck at present as it remains the subject of court proceedings.

§ Lord Ackner
My Lords, will the Minister inform the House whether the Government intend, or have under consideration, the introduction of legislation to protect rights of privacy? Are the Government aware that in a recent criminal justice Bill, I sought to introduce certain amendments which had been outlined by Sir David Calcutt in one of his reports and was told that the then government had the matter under consideration and were going to publish a White Paper? That has not been done. Are the Government prepared to issue such a paper?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I am aware of that, having been present on the occasions in question when the noble and learned Lord, Lord Ackner, has adverted to that topic. I am equally aware of the promise given by the previous government that a White Paper to 1425 deal with privacy and related matters would be published. The present situation is that the Government are committed to the incorporation into our law of the European Convention on Human Rights. All questions within the ambit of that convention are presently being considered, and in due time a White Paper will be published.

§ Lord Marsh
My Lords, I declare an interest as chairman of a police committee involved in the use of closed-circuit television. Does the noble Lord agree that, while a misuse of tape in the way described cannot be supported, it is perfectly simple to ensure that it does not happen; that it should not happen and that the benefits in terms of the control of terrorism and serious organised crime are very great indeed?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I am happy to endorse absolutely what the noble Lord, Lord Marsh, said. CCTV can deter criminals and it does prevent crime. It is surprisingly popular with most members of the public. It is a useful tool from the point of view of the police. The police operate proper controls over the destination of CCTV material. I agree entirely with what the noble Lord, Lord Marsh, said. One must weigh the benefits against the occasional abuse.

§ Lord Archer of Sandwell
My Lords, does my noble friend agree that, while no one would complain about the use of security cameras—in fact everyone would approve of them—as the noble Lord, Lord Marsh, said, it is not difficult to make proper use of them while at the same time ensuring that the recordings are not abused?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I agree entirely and that is why, as I said earlier in my first Answer to my noble and learned friend, we are entirely willing to listen to arguments in favour of statutory regulation. If we are convinced by those arguments, we shall act.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, we agree absolutely that any abuse of the system is to be abhorred. Does the noble Lord agree however that that is a very rare occurrence? Most CCTV schemes throughout the country are implemented according to the codes of practice. We should wish to encourage that. In view of the great benefits that CCTV has brought to many communities, the way in which it is helping to reduce crime and the way in which it means that people may walk more safely on the streets going about their ordinary everyday business, are the Government committed to continuing to work in partnership with local authorities, local businesses and communities by giving grants at a national level to increase the number of schemes throughout the country?

§ Lord Williams of Mostyn
My Lords, I am most grateful for the support which the noble Baroness has given to my general response. Of course, abuse must be put into perspective. Our judgment is the same as that of the noble Baroness: namely, that public benefit is significantly greater than the occasional abuse for 1426 private profit, which we utterly deprecate. We are determined to continue a fruitful partnership between the government and local authorities and all other bodies or institutions which are able to assist us in the unremitting fight against crime.