HL Deb 30 July 1997 vol 582 cc169-72

2.38 p.m.

Lord Merrivale

asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether there has been any recent improvement regarding restrictions and delays at the land frontier between Gibraltar and Spain.

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, there has been a recent improvement at the frontier following representations to the Spanish authorities by the British ambassador in Madrid. But the situation remains unpredictable. We continue to urge Spain to provide sufficient staff to ensure that delays are kept to a minimum.

Lord Merrivale

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that Answer. In effect, her final remarks cover the question that I primarily intended to ask. In view of the fact that the Government continue to urge Spain to provide sufficient staff to reduce delays and keep them to a minimum, do the Government propose to use more persuasive arguments, particularly in regard to channelling traffic on a single lane basis, which at times causes great delays? Have the Government sought the lifting of weekend restrictions on commercial goods and increasing hours for clearance on weekdays?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, we take very seriously the delays at the Spanish-Gibraltar frontier and frequently raise the matter with the Spanish authorities when the delays become disproportionate. We welcome any measure introduced by the Spanish authorities aimed at reducing the delays, including the intention to implement their proposal for red and green channels in the way suggested by the noble Lord.

Lord Thomas of Swynnerton

My Lords, bearing in mind the desirability in the long term of reaching a solution to this problem, recognising that this country no longer has a major strategic interest in Gibraltar, and acknowledging that Spain and Britain are now partners in the European Union and allies in NATO, will the Minister consider looking with a favourable eye on the proposals allegedly put forward by the Spanish Foreign Minister for an arrangement whereby Britain and Spain exercise joint sovereignty over Gibraltar rather in the way that similar authorities have successfully exercised sovereignty over Andorra for hundreds of years?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, we look for co-operation with our friends in Spain over the question of Gibraltar. But the Government stand firmly by the commitment made to the people of Gibraltar in the preamble to Gibraltar's 1969 constitution that we will never enter into arrangements under which the people of Gibraltar pass under the sovereignty of another state against their freely and democratically expressed wishes. I hope that that makes the position clear.

Lord Whaddon

My Lords, I welcome what my noble friend says. However, can she tell the House whether there is any more optimistic news regarding the recognition by Spain of passports issued in Gibraltar?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, at the moment British passports are issued in Gibraltar under the authority of the Governor acting as the personal representative of the Queen. The Spanish Foreign Minister has given a public assurance that Spain has never questioned and will not do so in future the right of Gibraltarians to freedom of movement in the EU. Of course we expect the Spanish to respect that.

Lord Monson

My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that a few months ago the commanding officer of the British forces in Gibraltar, who was wearing civilian clothes but carrying documents which made it perfectly clear who he was, was stopped at the border and treated in the most abusive and insulting manner by the Spanish border guards, as, more recently, was Lady Luce, the wife of the present Governor? Can the Minister say what representations have been made to Spain over the disgraceful behaviour of its frontier police?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, I regret that I was not aware of the incidents the noble Lord has outlined to the House. If indeed they took place, they were not only disgraceful, but entirely contrary to what the Spanish Government told us would be the case. I shall look into the incidents described by the noble Lord and write to him.

Baroness Hooper

My Lords, I welcome the report from the noble Baroness that the border situation has improved. But can she assure us that the British Government will continue to make every effort to improve this exasperating situation, not only on a bilateral basis, but also through the appropriate channels in the European Union?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, I can give the noble Baroness that assurance. This is a matter that exercises the British Government. It is a subject that we raise frequently in our contacts with our friends in Spain and of course it is a matter that we discuss with the Spanish through EU channels. We shall continue to do so while the issue causes concern, not only in your Lordships' House but elsewhere.

Lord St. John of Bletso

My Lords, I support the strong stand that the Foreign Secretary took at the recent NATO summit in saying that Her Majesty's Government would only support Spain's full membership of NATO should the Spanish authorities lift restrictions on landing rights in Gibraltar. However, will the Minister ensure that such landing rights apply to military as well as to civilian aircraft?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, I regret that I am not in a position to answer the detailed question regarding military aircraft landing rights. That is a matter which is probably more appropriately put to my noble friend Lord Gilbert in the Ministry of Defence. I shall write to the Ministry of Defence on the noble Lord's behalf and ask for a view on the specific point relating to military aircraft.

Lord Chesham

My Lords, can the Minister give us any idea as to whether there are plans to hold a further constitutional conference on Gibraltar in the near future?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, there are no plans to hold a specific constitutional conference on Gibraltar in the near future. The whole question of our relationship with the dependent territories is one that the Government are considering. As the noble Lord probably knows, a ministerial group meets to consider the dependent territories. That group recently met and will be meeting again in the autumn. The question of Gibraltar's constitution is considered by that group along with the constitutions of other dependent territories, as I am sure the noble Lord will be aware. The arrangements of the previous administration have not changed.

Lord Merrivale

My Lords, in view of the strong stand taken by the Foreign Secretary in Madrid on 8th July regarding NATO matters, can the Minister assure us that he will take as strong a stand on other Gibraltar matters?

Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean

My Lords, I hope that I have given the House every indication that the Foreign Secretary will continue to take a strong stand over the question of Gibraltar whenever and wherever he discusses the matter.