HL Deb 12 June 1995 vol 564 cc1533-4

2.43 p.m.

Lord Jenkins of Putney asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether, as proposed by Germany, they will agree to a verifiable nuclear weapons register under the auspices of the United Nations; and if not, why not.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Defence (Lord Henley)

My Lords, after discussions with our allies, we concluded that the proposal would not make the positive and practical contribution to nuclear arms control that the German Government had hoped.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware, and does he agree, that now that the Non-Proliferation Treaty has been concluded it is absolutely essential to make sure that it works? Is he further aware that Russia and the USA have declared their missile strength and that it is only Her Majesty's Government's refusal to do the same that is holding up the conclusion of an addition to the treaty which should provide the necessary transparency?

Lord Henley

My Lords, I do not agree with the noble Lord, but he would not be surprised at that at all. We welcome the unanimous decision to extend the Non-Proliferation Treaty indefinitely and we attach great importance to it. As regards declaring exactly what our strength is, our position is very different from that of the United States and the Russians. We have only a minimum nuclear deterrent and revealing the exact size of our forces would compromise their effectiveness, with consequences that are obvious even to the noble Lord.

Lord Williams of Elvel

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware that this is a serious proposition from the German Government? The German Government seek to have greater transparency in the declaration of nuclear weapons. While we have no doubt about the veracity of the Government's statement that each Trident boat will deploy no more than 96 warheads, is it not the case that Trident is capable of deploying many more than that? Therefore, in the spirit of transparency, would it not be sensible for the Government at least to enter into negotiations on this matter? As I understand it—the noble Lord will correct me if I am wrong—it is only Her Majesty's Government and France who are opposed to this.

Lord Henley

My Lords, I had better start by correcting the noble Lord. My understanding is that it is the United States, France and Her Majesty's Government and other members of NATO who have opposed this suggestion. My understanding is further that the German Government have dropped it and put forward further proposals which we understand have not been taken any further. As regards the capacity of Trident, I can only say, as I think the noble Lord knows full well, that we intend that Trident shall deploy a maximum of 96 warheads and on some occasions fewer.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, is not the Government's position on this matter quite out of keeping with their enthusiastic support for the United Nations register of conventional weapons? Is it not even more necessary that everyone shall be aware of what the position is in relation to nuclear weapons or weapons of mass destruction? If that is not the case, how can one be sure that the Non-Proliferation Treaty is working?

Lord Henley

My Lords, the position of nuclear weapons is totally different from that of conventional weapons. I can take the noble Lord no further than what I said earlier. We have a minimum nuclear deterrent and we believe that revealing the exact size and nature of our forces would compromise their security.