Science and Technology: White Paper (Hansard, 6 May 1993)

§ The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Blatch)
My Lords, the Government intend to publish a White Paper on science and technology shortly. In preparing for it, the Minister of Public Service and Science has welcomed the helpful advice which he has received from many sources, not least your Lordships. This is being taken into account in formulating the White Paper's policies. However, I would be happy to report back to my right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster any further thoughts which noble Lords may have.

§ Lord Peyton of Yeovil
My Lords, what does "shortly" mean? Is my noble friend aware that there are widespread hopes that the forthcoming White Paper will clear up the confusion which presently attends our support of science in this country? Is it possible that the delays are caused by the reluctance of other departments to give up any of their territory to the newcomer?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I am not sure that I agree with the rather cynical undertones of what my noble friend says. There has been extensive consultation. It is important to get the matter right, as I am sure my noble friend agrees. However, I am also sure that with my noble friend's well known persistence in matters that concern him he will remonstrate with me before too long if "shortly" does not mean that.

§ Lord Morris of Castle Morris
My Lords, is it not a fact that the President of the Royal Society has said that an important component of a new policy should be a significant shift from the funding of research assistance on short-term project grants to longer term fellowships awarded on an individual basis? Do the Government agree with that expert view? It could hardly come from a much higher source. Will the Minister also tell the House how many scientists in this country are on contracts of fewer than five years?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I am sure that view has been given to the department in preparation for the White Paper. I hope that the noble Lord will not expect me to go into what the White Paper will say on these matters. He must await the White Paper. I do not have the information on the specific question about how many scientists in the country are on contracts of fewer than five years. If he presses me to write to him on the matter, of course I shall do so.

§ Lord Morris of Castle Morris
My Lords, I am happy to absolve the Minister from that requirement.

§ Lord Eatwell
My Lords, will the noble Baroness tell the House whether she considers that it is important to maintain independent sources of advice to Ministers in the area of science policy?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, the advice that my right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster has received in the preparation of the report has been very independent indeed. I do not believe that anyone comes more independent than your Lordships.

§ Lord Peyton of Yeovil
My Lords, I wish my noble friend to understand that I have no desire whatever to lay blame where I am sure that none is deserved. Will she please call the attention of some of her right honourable friends to these exchanges? I refer in particular to such departments as the Treasury, the Department of the Environment, the DTI and others who may well be the cause of the delay.

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I can assure my noble friend that I used equal persistence in pressing my officials—they were asking me to state at the Dispatch Box that the report would be published shortly—to give me some indication that the department meant that. I am more than confident that shortly means that. I believe that my noble friend will be pleasantly surprised.

§ Earl Russell
My Lords, in looking forward to the White Paper, will the noble Baroness give us any assurance about the future of the Advisory Board for the Research Councils?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, no, I cannot. The noble Earl seeks to persuade me to go into the detail of what the White Paper may state. The need for advice to my right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster will be addressed. We know that it is essential that he receives advice. The quality of the advice, and from where it should come, will be addressed in the White Paper.