HL Deb 29 March 1993 vol 544 cc664-7

7.4 p.m.

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Employment (Viscount Ullswater) rose to move, That the draft regulations laid before the House on 1st March be approved [23rd Report from the Joint Committee].

The noble Viscount said: My Lords, these regulations are being made under the Pneumoconiosis etc. (Workers' Compensation) Act 1979. The purpose of the regulations is to increase by 2½ per cent. the amounts of compensation paid under the Act to those who first satisfy all the conditions of entitlement on or after 1st May 1993.

People suffering from industrial diseases have the right to sue the employer concerned for damages. However, certain dust-related diseases take a long time to develop and may not be diagnosed until 20 to 30 years or more after exposure. By the time the disease is diagnosed the employer or employers responsible may no longer exist.

Parliament enacted this legislation in 1979 to provide a measure of compensation to those who cannot claim it in the normal way through the courts. It provides lump sum payments to sufferers from certain dust-related diseases or, when the sufferers have died, to their dependants. However, I would point out that it has never been the intention of the Act to provide an alternative to taking civil action in the courts.

There are three basic conditions of entitlement, which must be satisfied before a payment can be made: first, that there is no relevant employer who can be sued; secondly, that no court action has been brought nor compensation received in respect of the disease; and, thirdly, that industrial injuries disablement benefit has been awarded.

The Department of Employment does all it can to administer the compensation scheme in a sympathetic way. While it is necessary to ensure that payment conditions are met it is also recognised that each case is art individual disaster and the department is as generous as the legislation allows. Since the Act came into force in 1980 more than 7,000 applicants have made a claim and 75 per cent. of those have received payment. The total cost to date has been £33 million. Payments under the Act are additional to any social security benefits awarded.

The Government have given an undertaking to Parliament to review the amounts payable regularly to maintain their value. These regulations aim to fulfil this commitment.

I feel sure that all noble Lords will agree with me that the circumstances leading to these payments are very much to be regretted. They reflect the conditions in which some people worked many years ago. Action taken by the Government to control the use of asbestos and other hazardous substances will prevent such suffering for present generations of workers. Nevertheless, I very much welcome the opportunity provided by these regulations to maintain the value of the compensation.

I know that all noble Lords will recognise that no amount of money will ever compensate individuals and families for their loss but at least these regulations allow us to give some practical and material help. I beg to move.

Moved, That the draft regulations laid before the House on 1st March be approved [23rd Report from the Joint Committee].—(Viscount Ullswater.)

7.7 p.m.

Lord Dean of Beswick

My Lords, I welcome the regulations before the House and the manner in which the Motion has been moved. I wish to put forward only one or two points. We are grateful that there is to be an increase and that it is based on 2.5 per cent. However, because of the group of people about which we are talking I wish to suggest that the Minister takes into consideration the fact that they will be paying more for heat and warmth, which helps to sustain the lives of sick and aged people. The Budget will impinge heavily on the amount of money which such people draw. I realise that the Minister cannot answer tonight because he is not empowered to do so but I ask him to bring the matter to the attention of his right honourable friend the Secretary of State for consideration when the regulations are next updated.

We are dealing with a diminishing number of people. There have been enormous reductions in the number of miners and, as the Minister probably knows, there is today a lobby of miners and their supporters who are fighting to save the last vestiges of their industry. I am not sure that I agree with the press and some of the claims made by government Ministers that Mr. Heseltine has made an attempt to save the mining industry. I believe that all Mr. Heseltine is doing is slowing down the rigor mortis. But, having said that, I never .see the word "pneumoconiosis" without casting my memory back to a person who very quickly became a friend of mine when I first came to your Lordships' House. Unfortunately, he is no longer with us; indeed, he died about two years ago. I am talking about Lord Taylor of Mansfield, who was known as Bernard to us all. He was a real miner in the truest sense. He spent his life in the pits before going to another place and then coming to your Lordships' House. He was very well respected, and loved, by most people who met him as a true person of the kind that the mining communities and industries produced and who helped the country.

Lord Taylor once told me—and I believe one can read the history of this in his autobiography, Uphill all the Way—that he actually played a part in the formulation of the word "pneumoconiosis" and in its inclusion as an industrial complaint. That relates not just to miners, because other people also suffer from the disease. However, I wanted to put on record what Lord Taylor had done in his younger days and the way that he carried it through to his final years in your Lordships' House.

Once again, I should like to tell the Minister that we welcome the upgrading. I hope that the point I made regarding the increase in respect of costs that such people will have to bear as regards heating and lighting will be taken into consideration when the matter is next considered in the House for upgrading under the regulations, which I expect will be some time next year. On that basis, the Opposition is pleased to accept the Motion.

Lord Skelmersdale

My Lords, like the noble Lord opposite, I welcome the regulations. Of course, like the noble Lord opposite and, indeed, my noble friend the Minister, I regret the need for it. My noble friend said that we are talking about a shrinking number of people, but pneumoconiosis is, of course, still extant in some of our deep mines. Without going into the rhetoric of the noble Lord opposite, which may well have been directed to our debate on Wednesday, can my noble friend say whether the use of masks, and other equipment, which are now issued to miners has led to a decrease in the incidence of pneumoconiosis and that, therefore, sooner or later it will no longer be a problem down the mines?

Viscount Ullswater

My Lords, I welcome some of the comments made by the noble Lord, Lord Dean of Beswick. However, I have to point out two factors to him. Of course, the 2.5 per cent. uprating is in fact a generous one as the RPI has obviously not reached that figure at present. Lest the noble Lord should forget, the social security benefits to which all these people will be entitled, will reflect upratings for the future. Therefore, they will receive a generous payment of this lump sum and will also be entitled to the uprating of social security benefits.

My noble friend asked me a question to which I do not have a reply at present. He asked whether the wearing of masks will prevent people currently working down the deep mines from contracting pneumoconiosis. I have to point out to him that the scheme we are discussing tonight only deals with those people whose employer cannot be traced. Where the employer can be traced—and most of those about whom my noble friend is talking have an employer in British Coal—that employer is responsible for the safeguarding of the health of deep-coal miners.

However, I shall try to ascertain some information on the question put by my noble friend. If he will allow me, I shall write to him on the matter.

On Question, Motion agreed to.