Plutonium (Hansard, 23 November 1992)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Trade and Industry (Baroness Denton of Wakefield)
My Lords, as is the case with any commodity, international transactions in civil plutonium arise from the wish of the participants to pursue their commercial interests.

§ Lord Jenkins of Putney
My Lords, is the noble Baroness entirely unaware of the widespread concern throughout the world about the international trade in reprocessed plutonium? Is she also unaware that the International Atomic Energy Agency has stated: The excess of recycled plutonium poses a major political and security problem world-wide"? Does the noble Baroness consider that in contributing to that excess the British and French Governments may reasonably be regarded as spreading concern and alarm throughout the world? Is she entirely unaware of these matters?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, obviously I hear expressions of different viewpoints. Perhaps I could point out that whether or not the spent fuel is reprocessed is a matter for the owners of the material to decide on safety, technical and economic grounds.

§ Lord Jenkins of Putney
My Lords, am I to gather from that reply that the noble Baroness is unaware that reprocessed plutonium is barred from the territorial waters of the United States, from South Africa, Australia, New Zealand and other Pacific and Latin American countries and from the Panama Canal? Does she understand that these cargoes are regarded as completely undesirable and extremely dangerous to the world community as a whole?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, the noble Lord lists the views of other governments. I can only represent this Government.

§ Lord Stoddart of Swindon
My Lords, do the ending of agreements and the closing down of the Dounreay fast breeder reactor in any way affect the position and attitude of Her Majesty's Government?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, I am sorry but I did not catch the end of the noble Lord's question.

§ Lord Stoddart of Swindon
My Lords, perhaps I may repeat the question. Do the ending of agreements about fast breeder reactors and the closing down of Dounreay power station, which uses this fuel, affect the Government's attitude to the whole business of the transportation of this fuel?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, the Government decided in 1988 that the Dounreay prototype fast reactor would close in 1994. We are simply moving that decision.

§ Lord Williams of Elvel
My Lords, is it not the case that more than 50 tonnes of separated plutonium is currently held in store at Sellafield? Is it not further the case that in the 1990s world production of separated plutonium will leave a surplus to civil requirements of some 110 tonnes and that the surplus will largely be stored in the United Kingdom and France? If that is the case, can the noble Baroness tell us why we are producing and storing all that plutonium when there is no civil market for it?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, the current UK stock of plutonium at the end of March 1991 was 33 tonnes. Whether or not spent fuel is reprocessed is, as I said, a matter for the owners of that material. I assure your Lordships that this material is very safely stored at Sellafield.

The Earl of Halsbury
My Lords, can the noble Baroness confirm that reprocessed uranium from commercial reactors is not weapons grade?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, I am delighted to do that.

§ Lord Williams of Elvel
My Lords, this is not the question at issue, but perhaps I may press the noble Baroness a little further. Is it not the case that during the 1990s some 70 tonnes of civil plutonium is liable to be used in light water reactors, which are going out of fashion? Therefore, is it not further the case that there will be a substantial surplus which has to he stored and the only places capable of storing it are Sellafield, France and Russia? Are the Government satisfied that storing and perhaps trading in this material is a sensible way to go about things?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, I am not at all certain what the noble Lord is asking me to say. This material is recycled and is stored. That is a fact of life. I believe that what matters to your Lordships is that it is safely managed.

§ Lord Williams of Elvel
My Lords, perhaps I may intervene, with your Lordships' leave, to ask the noble Baroness whether, in the light of the fact that all other countries apart from the United Kingdom, France and Russia have for safety and political reasons sought to minimise the storage of plutonium, the United Kingdom is satisfied that we should be the dump where that material is stored?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, despite the emotion, I am sure that the noble Lord would not wish me to say that the United Kingdom is wrong and that other countries are right.

§ Lord Grimond
My Lords, as someone who knows nothing about the subject but who has listened to such Questions, I ask the Minister to assure the House that the Government take an interest in the matter and do not leave private enterprise to do what it likes. The implication is that the Government have washed their hands of this extremely dangerous substance. Will the Minister reassure the House that that is not the case?

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, I am delighted to reassure the noble Lord that that is not the case at all. We are most anxious to ensure that the material is fully subject to international safeguards.

§ Lord Jenkins of Putney
My Lords, is the Minister aware that I have a copy of yesterday's edition of Japan's Sunday Times in which concern about this issue is expressed? Does she agree that, if as seems likely, the trade is stopped as a result of the extremely dangerous nature of the cargo, we shall be left holding a baby with a half life of 20,000 years? That matter if nothing else must concern the Government.

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, I congratulate the noble Lord on the source of his material. Civil plutonium would be transferred abroad only if the country in question were able to give a satisfactory account of how it would be used.