House Building Figures (Hansard, 21 October 1991)

§ The Minister of State, Department of the Environment (Baroness Blatch)
My Lords, in Great Britain during the eight months up to August 1991 there were 115,200 new dwellings started and 111,800 new dwellings completed.

§ Lord Dean of Beswick
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that answer. However, does she agree that with repossessions and the number of homeless still increasing, together with the number of people sleeping rough—who are not recorded in any figures—also still increasing, those figures are insufficient and do not deal with the problem? Is the Minister aware that her colleague, the noble Viscount, Lord Astor, when answering a Question on Monday stated that by 1993–94—two to three years hence—the housing associations will be building a maximum of 40,000 houses'' Bearing in mind that the figures of the Minister's own department indicate the need for more than a million new houses by the turn of the century, is not that performance appalling? Will the 1308 Government at last end their vendetta against local authorities and let them once again build corporation houses to let, mainly from their own funds which the Government are holding in bond?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, neither I nor my department underestimate the seriousness of the difficulty of people seeking homes. However, I refer the noble Lord to a number of measures that have been taken. Total expenditure by local authorities is at £4.5 billion; housing revenue subsidy is now at £3.7 billion; housing corporation expenditure is set to rise to over £2 billion by 1993; there is an extra £50 million for low cost rural housing; an extra £268 million for estate action; £25 million which was announced only a couple of weeks ago to bring empty flats over shops into use—an extra £300 million over two years, on top of mainstream housing programmes, to help relieve statutory homelessness in London and the South East. There is a further £96 million to help to provide accommodation for the single homeless living rough in London; and that is not all of the measures.

§ Lord Hailsham of Saint Marylebone
My Lords, did I hear my noble friend aright on the figures which she gave in her principal Answer? Do the figures relate to the whole of the United Kingdom, to Great Britain or merely to England and Wales? How do they relate to the number of empty properties?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I cannot say how they relate to the number of empty properties. However, I can say that there are too many empty properties and that measures are being established to bring them back into use. The figures to which I refer are for Great Britain.

§ Lord Mellish
My Lords, we recognise that there are many bad councils, some of which have far too many empty properties. However, let us ignore those and consider the good councils. Why do not the Government allow them to build new houses with the money they get from the sale of homes to sitting tenants?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, on the first point made by the noble Lord, yes, of course there is some bad management. The hope is that measures will be taken to improve the management of housing stock. With regard to capital receipts, I have said several times at the Dispatch Box that those authorities with the highest capital receipts are not necessarily those authorities with the greatest need. Therefore, capital allocations—credit allocations—is the Government's way of making sure that resources are targetted on those authorities with the greatest need and that surplus moneys from receipts are used to reduce debt.

§ Lord Stallard
My Lords, I certainly welcome the announcement of the measures to be taken. However, they certainly are not enough when put into perspective. Does the Minister accept that in 1979 there were 50,000 homeless households. That figure had doubled by 1991 to 145,000. In 1978–79 the building of 92,000 houses commenced. By last year the number had fallen to 13,000. That is a huge reduction. As has already been mentioned, local councils have 1309 been prevented from spending on new houses the £5 billion that was set aside from council house sales. Does not that put everything into perspective and prove that the Government are not doing anywhere near enough in the present crisis?

§ Baroness Blatch
No, my Lords, I do not accept that the Government are not doing nearly enough, although there will always be a time when more could be done. Perhaps I may throw the question back to the noble Lord. Is he saying that the amount of money being spent on providing houses for people will be exceeded by the noble Lord's party should it come to government? If the noble Lord is saying that his party will allow all receipts to be used by local authorities, a great deal more money will be necessary to allow those authorities that do not have the receipts to provide for those in the greatest need.

§ Lord Molloy
My Lords, notwithstanding the encouraging part of her initial Answer, is the noble Baroness aware that local authority representatives of all political complexions are expressing in their magazines, month in month out—last month being the most severe—the savage problems that they have to face and the cruelty of the fact that their endeavours in trying to give homes to those who are badly in need are being frustrated? Would it not be wise to discuss these matters with representatives of all our local authorities?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I can assure the noble Lord that my department constantly discusses these matters with local authorities. The role of local authorities is to work as enablers with housing associations, private sector developers and private landlords, so that people are provided with housing from a variety of sources.

Lord Bruce of Donington
My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that the completion figure for new houses, whether provided by local authorities, private enterprise or housing associations, is about 100,000 per annum lower than the number achieved by previous governments, including governments of her own political persuasion? Is she further aware that this shortage of housing is leading to additional claims being made on the National Health Service by people suffering from all the mental and physical effects of living in bad housing or being without housing?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, I believe that the noble Lord is referring, as noble Lords opposite frequently do, to what local authorities are doing in the area of housing. It is important to take all providers of housing—

Lord Bruce of Donington
I have, my Lords.

§ Baroness Blatch
—and not to ignore that there are 2 million more houses in the housing stock than there were in 1979 and that 69 per cent. of people own their own homes; a figure infinitely comparable to that achieved by the party of the noble Lord.

Lord Bruce of Donington
My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that I included those figures?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I welcome what my noble friend said in answer to some of the very difficult questions that have been raised. Can she tell the House how many empty properties there are today? Is it a fact that there are well over 100,000 empty council houses? How many empty properties are there in the private letting market? Could not all these properties be brought back into use?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, my noble friend makes an important point. I cannot be specific—I shall write to her with specific answers to those questions—except to say that far too many houses stand empty in both the public and private sectors. We are looking at ways and means of making sure that they are brought into use. Better management of stock in the public sector would go a long way to bringing some of those houses into use. They could then be lived in by people who are in great need.

§ Lord Glenamara
My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that far too large a proportion of the houses being built are in the £150,000 to £200,000 bracket whereas the need is for houses to rent and for houses for first-time buyers? Builders are building more expensive houses because they make more money out of them. That is depriving people who are in the greatest need. Can the Government do anything to tilt the programme in favour of people whose need is greatest?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, the noble Lord raises an important point on which I shall try to give him some reassurance. First, the exceptions policy makes available in rural areas land that would not otherwise be used for housing. Secondly, a circular put out by my department requires local authorities, when giving planning permission to developers, to include as a condition of planning permission the making available of low-cost housing as part of the development.

Lord Winstanley
My Lords, is not one of the problems of the renovation of empty properties, especially empty properties in the private sector to which the noble Baroness, Lady Young, referred, that, in London in particular, they are renovated to such a high standard that no one can afford to live in them?

§ Baroness Blatch
My Lords, in terms of the way in which the capital receipts system works, the local authority is allowed to deduct the cost of refurbishment of empty houses being brought back into use before the capital receipts system is applied.