Hospital Trusts: Membership (Hansard, 21 November 1991)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Social Security (Lord Henley)
My Lords, there are 900 chairmen and non-executive directors of the National Health Service trusts appointed by my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Health and of these, 291, or 32 per cent., are women.

§ Baroness Fisher of Rednal
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that Answer. I was hoping he would say that 50 per cent. were women. That would be in accordance with the Prime Minister's Opportunity 2000. Can the Minister give the House an assurance that the representatives who are appointed—I call them "representatives" at this stage—are representatives of a broad spectrum of the community?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, we would certainly like to see more women on the trusts. We have announced various initiatives to increase the number of women who are appointed to them. We have made chairmen aware of their responsibility to look for suitable women for appointment to the trusts. I would not want to advocate going for merely 50 per cent. as a form of tokenism. We want to see the best possible people appointed for the best possible reasons. We should also like to see recruited people from all walks of life so long as they are suitable candidates for the job.

§ Baroness Denton of Wakefield
My Lords, does my noble friend agree that it is unlikely that any company in the private sector has five women on its policy board, as is the case at the Department of Health, or a special unit to release the potential of its female workforce? Moreover, does the Minister agree that there may be a relationship between the good housekeeping at Guy's which has allowed it to treat 10 per cent. more patients than planned while taking £5 million off its labour costs and the fact that the general manager of the trust is a woman?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, obviously I cannot confirm my noble friend's figures about the private sector. However, I can confirm what she said about the National Health Service policy board. As regards my noble friend's remarks about Guy's, I agree that the fact that there are women on the board and that it 1010 is chaired by a woman may have a great deal to do with its success, just as the presence of my noble friend Lord McColl may also have added to that success.

§ Lord Carter
My Lords, the Minister referred to community involvement. Is he aware of the widely held belief that there should be proper local authority and community care involvement in trust boards? Besides increasing the genuine involvement of local people, does the Minister agree that successful implementation of the community care plans in April 1993 will be greatly helped by appropriate involvement in that type of hospital service operated by the trusts? There is a feeling that sometimes the National Health Service is just a hospital service: it is much more than that.

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, the noble Lord is going beyond the Question on the Order Paper. I can confirm that we would welcome any suggestions from local authorities, particularly if they can suggest suitable women for the boards of the trusts. We shall certainly take note of any suggestions they make.

§ Lord McColl of Dulwich
My Lords, does my noble friend agree that in the Guy's-Lewisham trust the percentage of women executive members of the board is 36 per cent., including for the first time in 25 years, a matron? Does he further agree that that is very much better than the corresponding figure for the local council where the percentage of lady executive members is very much less?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, I shall take my noble friend's figures on trust. I can certainly confirm what he said about the Guy's-Lewisham trust. I am sure that those figures, as well as my noble friend's involvement, contribute to the success of that trust.

§ Lord Dean of Beswick
My Lords, in contrast with the success story highlighted by the noble Baroness, Lady Denton, in her supplementary question, is the Minister aware that some of the first trusts to he formed are already seriously in debt? I refer to Manchester and the Christie cancer hospital. If that situation persists, are the Government prepared to bail them out, or will they allow them to go to the wall?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, that is a completely different question. The Question is about the appointment of women to the trust boards.

§ Lord Carter
My Lords, is the Minister aware that the local authority, which has Guy's Hospital in its area, has a female chief executive?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that comment.

§ Lord Tordoff
My Lords, will the noble Lord inquire of his noble friend whether, if this trend continues at the hospital, it will change its name from Guy's to Doll's?

§ Baroness Fisher of Rednal
My Lords, will the noble Lord accept that I believe that the best possible women should be appointed? However, does he agree that there are other hospital trusts in the country 1011 besides Guy's? Does the Minister also agree that it is important that the best possible women know how to put their names forward? They do not always have husbands who wear the old school tie and so forth. Can the noble Lord tell the House how women in other parts of the country can put their names forward so that they are considered as the best possible women in their localities?

§ Lord Henley
My Lords, I hope that the publicity that the noble Baroness's Question generates will alert a great number of women to the fact that they can apply to go on the boards. As I said, we have advised chairmen that they must recognise that women have very different CVs to men because they have had a very different career structure. Therefore the chairmen should be looking in particular for women and, in seeking suitable candidates, should take account of the problems that women have had to face in developing their careers.