London Underground Plan: Effects (Hansard, 18 December 1991)

§ The Minister of State, Department of Transport (Lord Brabazon of Tara)
Yes, my Lords. The aim of the plan is to make the underground system more efficient. London Underground is confident that this will enable it to raise safety standards, improve quality of service, cut costs and increase revenue.

§ Lord Molloy
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that reply. Is he aware of the considerable consternation among the travelling public in London as to whether London Underground, let alone the bus system, is all that safe any more? Is he further aware that dismissals have already started in the outer regions? When one travels, for example, from East Acton all the way to Ruislip, as I did this morning to check this out, one sees not one single member of staff. They have all gone. The only people one sees are bill-stickers, pasting up bills on behalf of London Transport saying that fares will be increased next month. Does the Minister believe that we can sacrifice safety in order to save a few thousand pounds through the dismissal of important staff?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, there is no question of safety being sacrificed by the measures proposed in the London Underground plan. Among other things, the plan will bring about by 1995–96 a 75 per cent. reduction in peak cancellations, a more regular and reliable train service and a 40 per cent. reduction in the number of escalators out of service.

§ Baroness Gardner of Parkes
My Lords, will the Minister confirm that the most important improvements in safety are as recommended in the Fennell Report, and that London Underground has been quite good in carrying those out? Will he also confirm that a great many closed circuit television cameras are now in use in Underground stations? Those may be replacing visible station staff, but the screens are being watched by staff situated elsewhere in the station.

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I agree with my noble friend that London Transport has been assiduous in implementing the recommendations of the Fennell Report. In addition to more video coverage of stations, there will be an increased staff presence on the platforms and at stations.

§ Lord Grimond
My Lords, have the Government seen the notices from London Transport that the escalators at Victoria will be out of action for nine 1329 months? That is a third of the time it took to build the whole Central Line. Can they do something to expedite the matter?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, that very question was raised in the House on Monday. The noble Lord may have noticed London Transport's advertisement in the Evening Standard last night. That explained why that was necessary.

§ Lord Underhill
My Lords, is it not the case that the Monopolies and Mergers Commission inquiry into London Underground concluded that the major deficiencies in London Underground were due to lack of investment? From looking through the business plan and the company plan, I find that we are talking of a reduction in personnel from 21,000 to 16,000. Having looked through these documents, I find it very difficult as I do not have a research assistant to ascertain exactly where the reductions will take place. As my noble friend Lord Molloy has said, it may be that the reductions that are due to take place will imperil the position on safety.

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, the report of the Monopolies and Mergers Commission made two main recommendations. It called for both increased efficiency and higher investment. The Government are already providing the higher levels of investment that are needed. It is now up to London Underground to implement increased efficiency. That is what it is planning to do with the company plan.
I turn now to safety and safety measures. Any changes made will be subject to consultation between London Underground, the railway inspectorate and the London Fire and Civil Defence Authority.

§ Lord Molloy
My Lords, is the Minister aware that people are gravely apprehensive, and that they do not want to see another incident, like King's Cross, in which people lost their lives? Further, can he say whether an American organisation has put £4.2 million into London Transport with the condition that the number of staff must be reduced? Why do the Government think that the answer to all our problems is to create more and more unemployment and cause great unhappiness to people with mortgages?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, that is certainly not the purpose of the plan; its purpose is to produce a more efficient and effective Underground system for the people of London.

§ Lord Strabolgi
My Lords, how can the system be more efficient with fewer staff? Is the noble Lord aware that in the depths of the Underground, in the Tube, one sees no one, except beggars and itinerant musicians?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, it is perfectly possible to be more efficient with fewer staff. As I said in an earlier reply, the noble Lord will be pleased to know that passengers will see an increased staff presence. There will also be more frequent patrols of platforms, and transport police will be more effectively deployed.