Iraq: Policy (Hansard, 9 December 1991)

The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (The Earl of Caithness)
My Lords, we are determined that Iraq should never again be able to threaten its neighbours and that the regime should cease to repress its civilian population. We shall maintain sanctions against Iraq until it has complied in full with its obligations under successive UN Security Council resolutions, in particular Nos. 687 and 688.

§ Lord Judd
My Lords, the Government will certainly enjoy the support of the whole House in their firmness of resolve on Iraq. However, do the Government agree that there are great numbers of innocent people, Kurds in the north and Shias in the south, who are suffering acutely, not least from the breakdown of the social infrastructure? Do the Government agree that it is totally beyond the capacity of the United Nations system and voluntary agencies to do more than provide limited humanitarian relief? If there were a genuine and demonstrable change of heart on the part of the Iraqi Government, would there be some way in which the Government could illustrate what might then become available? In other words, could there be some carrot as well as stick?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, as the whole House knows, our quarrel is with the regime, not with the long-suffering Iraqi people. There is plenty of opportunity for the Iraqi authorities to take action now. As the noble Lord will know, they have only to comply with Security Council Resolutions 706 and 712 to allow Iraq to export 1.6 billion dollars' worth of oil. That will help enormously on the humanitarian front.

§ Lord Boyd-Carpenter
My Lords, will my noble friend say whether Iraq's capacity to produce nuclear weapons has been eliminated?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, as I understand it, not completely would be the correct answer. However, we are working on the matter and making progress.

§ Lord Bonham-Carter
My Lords, what further supplies are being sent to the Kurds in the light of the oncoming winter? What assurance can we have that those supplies are reaching them? How much of the moneys raised by the Simple Truth have now been spent? How many of the supplies so bought have been sent to Kurdistan?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, as I understand it, the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees believes that the winter programme will have the food and funds necessary to complete the projected programme, despite the problems that face it.
With regard to the money raised by the Simple Truth Appeal, the British Red Cross has confirmed that all the £57 million-plus has been accounted for.

§ Lord Mellish
My Lords, the Minister will be aware that this question was asked last week. Once again, the problem of Saddam Hussein arises. I ask the Minister a straight question. What do we intend to do with him? He owes untold millions of pounds towards Kuwait, a country we are supposed to have released. When shall we receive those moneys?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, I have answered this question once or twice before. We are abiding strictly by the Security Council resolutions. We shall not change our minds on that.

§ Lord Molloy
My Lords, is the noble Earl aware that we and the Americans have always said that we have no hatred or enmity for the people of Iraq? They have suffered as much as anyone else. I was recently in Kuwait. What causes great perturbation is this. The Iraqis took back 2,000 Kurdish people, many of them families. A thousand women, young as well as older, are pregnant from rapes. Are the Government aware that the attack on the Kurds continues with equal ferocity? While we may be anxious about the people of Iraq, cannot we show that we consider it highly offensive that Saddam Hussein carries on with his actions? Is it not time that the Security Council stepped in and tried to stop such actions?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, the Security Council has been acting very effectively in those areas. The noble Lord is right to point out that the continuing retention of Kuwaiti detainees is one of the examples of blatant Iraqi non-compliance with Security Council resolutions.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
My Lords, the view from all quarters of the House is that the suffering of Iraq will continue while their present leader remains in power. What view do the Government take of the stability of the Government in Baghdad? Is there any indication that there might be a change, now or in the foreseeable future? If there is no change, and the United Nations takes no further steps in the matter, then the awful suffering of the people of Iraq and the Kurds will continue.

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, we are most anxious about the people of Iraq. The Security Council reviews the situation on a regular basis. It was 455 reviewed only a few days ago, when the Security Council agreed that there was no case for relaxing sanctions at present.

§ Lord Hylton
My Lords, will the Minister say what progress has been made, first, in renewing the mandate for the UN agencies working throughout Iraq and, secondly, in extending the allied agreement with Turkey which permits overflying of the Kurdish areas in the north?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, I must write to the noble Lord about that matter.

§ Lord Judd
My Lords, does the Minister recognise that there is widespread support for toughness in dealing with the regime? Will he accept that in the meantime many thousands of Shi'ites as well as Kurds are suffering desperately? If we are not to intervene externally in order to deal with the regime, change must come about internally. Therefore, would it not help if an indication were given about the international co-operation that would be available if there were a substantial political change within Iraq?

The Earl of Caithness
My Lords, we have regularly made it clear to the authorities in Iraq that there must be considerable change before that country can be accepted back into the community of nations. The United Kingdom has made a contribution second to none of any other country; more than £44 million has gone to the international relief effort since April. We are aware of the suffering of the Kurds in the north and the Shi'ites in the south. However, the real problem lies with the authorities in Iraq.