HL Deb 10 May 1989 vol 507 cc648-50

2.40 p.m.

Lord Dormand of Easington asked Her Majesty's Government:

What percentage of young disabled people, having completed training under the YTS, have taken up full-time employment.

The Secretary of State for Trade and Industry (Lord Young of Graffham)

My Lords, 42 per cent. of young disabled people who complete their YTS course obtain full-time employment within three months.

Lord Dormand of Easington

My Lords, that is a very disappointing Answer but is—

Noble Lords

No!

Lord Dormand of Easington

My Lords, it is a very disappointing Answer indeed. Is the Secretary of State aware that nationally twice as many disabled young people are unemployed as are able-bodied young people? Is it not obvious that the Government are not aware of the severe difficulties which arise from the double handicap of being young and disabled? Will the Secretary of State look again at what is happening in this scheme and, among other things, consider the probability of positive discrimination in favour of young disabled unemployed people?

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I am sorry that the noble Lord should believe, first, that the figures are disappointing because I do not believe that they are—

Noble Lords

Hear, hear.

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, secondly, I was sorry to hear the rather incredible assertion that the Government are unaware of the position. I was responsible for the introduction of YTS five or six years ago. From the beginning we were aware of the position of disabled people and young disabled people in particular. We have made arrangements to enable young disabled people to enter into YTS later, to stay longer and to take steps which are unequalled. We have done so in order to help young people who suffer from some form of disability to join the world of work.

I rejoice in the fact that 42 per cent. of young disabled people find work within three months of completing their course. We shall continue to help young disabled people because the world has found that those with a disability are very good employees.

Baroness Turner of Camden

My Lords, can the Secretary of State tell the House whether the quota system which was in operation for disabled employment still exists and whether it is being effectively monitored? It was my experience that it was not effectively monitored and that there was not a great deal of inspection. Can the same kind of system be applied in relation to disabled young people?

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I agree with the noble Baroness that the quota system is not very effective. I vividly recall that some years ago I endeavoured to persuade those concerned with disabled people to abandon the system. Such was the protest that it did not then occur.

However, that is another question concerning YTS and the general disablement lobby. If the noble Baroness cares to table a Question I shall be happy to answer it.

Lord Hailsham of Saint Marylebone

My Lords, considering the disadvantages which young disabled people necessarily find in obtaining employment, is it not extremely encouraging to discover that, while it is not the only way to help them, the YTS has managed to obtain full employment for between 40 and 50 per cent.: in fact, 42 per cent.?

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I think it is. I do not feel that we should be satisfied yet; we should continue to do more. However, we have seen steady improvement in the employment of young, disabled people through this scheme.

Baroness Seear

My Lords, can the noble Lord say how many disabled young persons who wished for a YTS place were unable to gain one? It could be that the 42 per cent. represents those among disabled people who are easiest to place. I am not however denying that 42 per cent. is, in many ways, unexpectedly good.

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, there are some 146,000 unfilled places on YTS in the country at present. Unless the disability was so severe that it would prevent employment in the conventional sense, I should be very surprised if any young person were unable to gain a place. However, I shall inquire and write to the noble Baroness.

Lady Kinloss

My Lords, can the Secretary of State say whether the employment prospects for disabled young people leaving YTS schemes will be improved once the training and enterprise councils come into being? Can he say when those councils are likely to start?

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I very much hope that the establishment of training and enterprise councils will provide a sharp focus not only on training but also on employment prospects in the areas in which they start. I expect that as they come into being and become experienced they will improve the employment prospects of disabled people as well as young people and the general population. The first TEC will be established towards the end of this year and we shall be closely watching its progress.

Lord Molloy

My Lords, acknowledging that his department has a great deal of expertise at its fingertips, is the noble Lord prepared to consider the possibility of getting in touch with a few national organisations which represent nearly every form of disability in the UK? I am quite sure that they would be only too pleased to help him.

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, from what I know of those national organisations, although for the past year or two I have not actually dealt with them, I doubt very much whether they are not already in constant touch with the department.

Lord Glenamara

My Lords, the noble Lord is so pleased with the fact that 42 per cent. have jobs, but that means that 58 per cent. do not have jobs. Can he say how many obtain jobs six months or a year after completing the course?

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I believe the fact that 42 per cent. obtain jobs within three months is commendable; it is rather better than the general position of disabled people.

Lord Glenamara

My Lords, it is appalling.

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, many young people go in and out of jobs after leaving YTS as young people have since time immemorial to find the sort of occupation which suits them best. However, I shall inquire into the figures. I do not agree that they are appalling. However, I shall write to the noble Lord and place the information in the Library.

Viscount St. Davids

My Lords, will the noble Lord draw to the attention of industry the fact that those who are crippled in one way or another may become much stronger in another way? The man with one arm is likely to be much stronger in that arm than if he had two arms. The supreme example is Professor Stephen Hawking who, having only his magnificent brain and the power to move one finger, is our leading scientist and famed throughout the world.

Lord Young of Graffham

My Lords, I hear what the noble Lord says. I completely agree.