Food Safety Research (Hansard, 4 July 1989)

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Baroness Trumpington)
My Lords, the AFRC will continue to undertake food safety research, including work on meat hygiene, at the other sites of the institute at Norwich and Reading, and we expect to transfer our research contracts to these laboratories.

§ Lord Carter
My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. Is she aware of the very considerable concern that has been expressed at the closure of this research institute in view of the massive increase in food poisoning that is taking place? The Minister referred to the fact that food hygiene safety work is to be protected. If that is the case, can the Minister say why, as a result of the government cuts, two research projects have been closed at Bristol this year? The first project was into the subject of salmonella poisoning in poultry and eggs and the second involved research into botulism. Can the Minister say whether it is part of the new enterprise culture that the scientist responsible for the botulism work is now the manager of a golf course?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, the AFRC operated the laboratory at Langford under a lease from the University of Bristol. The AFRC will cease to operate the laboratory at the end of 1990. That is not a retrenchment but a necessary rationalisation to allow the institute to improve its scientific effort. In particular, major programmes on food safety and nutrition will be further strengthened and expanded. More will be spent on research into food poisoning bacteria and on the design of rapid diagnostic tests of food quality and safety.

§ Lord Walston
My Lords, will the noble Baroness give us an assurance that the team of workers that has been engaged on this very valuable and important work at Bristol will not be dispersed but that it will be able to carry on as a team in the new locations?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am confident that my department has adequate qualified staff to fulfil its responsibilities as regards action to control salmonella in poultry flocks and elsewhere. We have recently taken on 21 additional qualified veterinarians to work in this area. Every effort will be made to find jobs in the Reading and other laboratories for those who may be displaced from their present jobs at Bristol.

§ Lord Harmar-Nicholls
My Lords, in the context of this Question can my noble friend tell me the difference between retrenchment and rationalisation?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I prefer the word "rationalisation". That is a sensible way to make the most of what you have got.

§ Lord Tordoff
My Lords, is the Minister aware that that kind of phraseology reminds some of us who are much younger than she is, of a phrase that was used during war time when we were in full retreat? It was called retreating to prepared positions.

§ Lord John-Mackie
My Lords, can the Minister say whether it has been proved that centralisation is so good for research?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am sorry I did not hear the noble Lord's question.

§ Lord John-Mackie
My Lords, has centralisation of research been proved to be the best way?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I believe that the greatest expertise will be lodged in the other places that will be used for research. I hope that the noble Lord meant older than me and not younger than me.

§ Lord Tordoff
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that correction.

§ Lord Gallacher
My Lords, does the noble Baroness agree that, on the basis of experience to date, the designation of research by her Ministry as near-market has been tantamount to the kiss of death at Bristol, Torry and elsewhere? In the light of that sad but factual experience, will she ask her right honourable friend to consider again the very reasonable request made to him by the National Farmers' Union for an independent review of national research and development?

§ Baroness Trumpington
No, my Lords, I do not believe that a review is necessary. I point out to the noble Lord that my department spends £6 million on food safety research, of which £177,000 is at the moment spent at the Institute of Food Research at Bristol. I also point out that a considerable amount of work undertaken at Bristol will be moving to the institute's Reading laboratory in the near future as there is a considerable amount of work on food microbiology taking place there. The Reading laboratory will be the centre for a major new initiative in food microbiology sponsored by MAFF.

§ Lord Carter
My Lords, in the light of that reply, can the noble Baroness say what will happen to the new £1 million food hall at Bristol which is unique in the world, and what will happen to the work carried out there? In addition, will the work into food refrigeration techniques be stopped, including work on the alternatives to CFCs?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, is the noble Lord referring to work on listeria?

§ Lord Carter
My Lords, I am referring to research into the processing of food at the food hall, Bristol, which is unique.

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am afraid I shall have to write to the noble Lord on that subject.

§ Lord Glenamara
My Lords, in view of the incidence of BSE, which is a veritable time-bomb within the population and in the long term potentially much worse than AIDS, is it not short-sighted and foolish to close down any institution concerned with meat research?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, MAFF has quickly set up a considerable programme of research to establish methods of diagnosis to elucidate the epidemiology of transmissible encephalopathies, such as scrapie in sheep and BSE in cattle (Creutzfeldt Jakob disease in humans), at Weybridge. In 1988–89 funding amounted to £764,000. Over the next seven years, research amounting to £13 million is planned—£11 million at Weybridge and £2 million at the neuro-pathogenic unit in Edinburgh. In addition, £30,000 annually is being spent to maintain a scrapie-free flock of sheep at Redesdale.

§ Lord Somers
My Lords, is it not a fact that if we were to pay serious attention to all that we are told is bad for us, particularly by American scientists, we would probably not eat anything at all?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am not sure that I heard the noble Lord correctly. Was he referring to work in America by American scientists? Perhaps the noble Lord could repeat his question.

§ Lord Somers
My Lords, I was merely saying that we are absolutely barraged with an enormous amount of information as to what we may and may not eat, particularly by American scientists. It is surprising that some of us are still alive.

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am most grateful to the noble Lord. I entirely agree with him. As I have said on previous occasions, we are in danger of becoming a nation of healthy hypochondriacs.